Top Law Schools

Can we have a thread dedicated to outing firms that are conducting stealth layoffs? Might seem a bit redundant to some other threads but I think it's helpful to have a place where those firms are specifically outed. I think stealth layoffs, for a variety of reasons, are worse than your run of the mill layoffs and so firms that do that deserve some extra attention/scorn.

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

They've already laid off 50 supporting staff according to ATL.

Shearman has fired all the associates who didn't receive the H-1B visa (relocation was apparently promised as part of the offer before start). Associates under the same situations from previous years all received overseas office relocation. Not stealth layoff per se, but a lot of firms are using this as a pretext for the much needed attrition.

Anonymous User wrote:Shearman has fired all the associates who didn't receive the H-1B visa (relocation was apparently promised as part of the offer before start). Associates under the same situations from previous years all received overseas office relocation. Not stealth layoff per se, but a lot of firms are using this as a pretext for the much needed attrition.

I'm an international student. As far as I know, they can work for at least one year using the OPT, even if they didn't get the work visa. It's just not a good reason. Shame.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Shearman has fired all the associates who didn't receive the H-1B visa (relocation was apparently promised as part of the offer before start). Associates under the same situations from previous years all received overseas office relocation. Not stealth layoff per se, but a lot of firms are using this as a pretext for the much needed attrition.

I'm an international student. As far as I know, they can work for at least one year using the OPT, even if they didn't get the work visa. It's just not a good reason. Shame.

If they’re associates, that means they’ve already been working under OPT since they graduated in 2019. Sounds like these associates then lost out on the H1B lottery two years in a row.

Sucks that they’re not relocating such associates to other offices, but during these times where immigration is especially in the administration’s crosshairs, relocating someone would be difficult and paycuts/layoffs are becoming more common, this seems like a group who would unfortunately get cut first.

Anonymous User wrote:Shearman has fired all the associates who didn't receive the H-1B visa (relocation was apparently promised as part of the offer before start). Associates under the same situations from previous years all received overseas office relocation. Not stealth layoff per se, but a lot of firms are using this as a pretext for the much needed attrition.

Associates who "didn't" or who "haven't" received the H-1B visa?

This is important, because Shearman, like many other biglaw firms, hires plenty of foreign nationals hoping to work long-term in the United States. I think, every year, one or two has his visa denied; many others are waiting. So were the one or two fired, or were all foreign nationals still waiting on their visas fired?

Wild Card wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Shearman has fired all the associates who didn't receive the H-1B visa (relocation was apparently promised as part of the offer before start). Associates under the same situations from previous years all received overseas office relocation. Not stealth layoff per se, but a lot of firms are using this as a pretext for the much needed attrition.

Associates who "didn't" or who "haven't" received the H-1B visa?

This is important, because Shearman, like many other biglaw firms, hires plenty of foreign nationals hoping to work long-term in the United States. I think, every year, one or two has his visa denied; many others are waiting. So were the one or two fired, or were all foreign nationals still waiting on their visas fired?

I think all H1B lottery results for this year have been announced at this point.

strawberrieee wrote: I think all H1B lottery results for this year have been announced at this point.

Yes this is true.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Thank you for doing this! Were there any signs that this would happen, and if so, what were they, and what year (without getting too specific) were you?

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Damn. As far as I know they did pretty well last year. Just don't understand why they are doing this. Some other peer firms handle this by cutting salaries.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Any of the normal details would be good: scale/scope, groups, class years, how hard has GP worked to make it seem performance related (eg sudden mid year reviews, etc.), what’s the mood internally, anything else related.

objctnyrhnr wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Any of the normal details would be good: scale/scope, groups, class years, how hard has GP worked to make it seem performance related (eg sudden mid year reviews, etc.), what’s the mood internally, anything else related.

+1. Am an incoming SA here so would be grateful for as much as you're willing to share. I'm sorry this happened to you and I hope you're able to recover.

Anonymous User wrote:

objctnyrhnr wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Any of the normal details would be good: scale/scope, groups, class years, how hard has GP worked to make it seem performance related (eg sudden mid year reviews, etc.), what’s the mood internally, anything else related.

+1. Am an incoming SA here so would be grateful for as much as you're willing to share. I'm sorry this happened to you and I hope you're able to recover.

I know a couple people at one of the major offices. Sounds like lit and life sciences are a couple of the groups of being hit as hard.

Can anon stealthed associate confirm?

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Is it really as bad as people are saying? There hasn’t been anything on ATL and I assumed someone would’ve said something by now.

esther0123 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Thank you for doing this! Were there any signs that this would happen, and if so, what were they, and what year (without getting too specific) were you?

I got held back a class year in January at my annual review for very vague "performance" reasons, which caught me completely off guard. Before my review, I had received consistently positive performance reviews (both formally and informally) and thought I had built a good rapport with people in my group. Billables were never a problem - even after my annual review I was still being assigned to new deals and my hours never dropped until I got stealthed.

objctnyrhnr wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Any of the normal details would be good: scale/scope, groups, class years, how hard has GP worked to make it seem performance related (eg sudden mid year reviews, etc.), what’s the mood internally, anything else related.

At least in my experience, they made the stealth feel very personal (presumably so I wouldn't talk). I have good relationships with a few other associates who confided in me that they were stealthed, but I really don't know who beyond my inner circle was affected. I know people who were affected in each of Boston, NY, and SF and across the board class year wise (i.e., very junior to more senior).

objctnyrhnr wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

objctnyrhnr wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Any of the normal details would be good: scale/scope, groups, class years, how hard has GP worked to make it seem performance related (eg sudden mid year reviews, etc.), what’s the mood internally, anything else related.

+1. Am an incoming SA here so would be grateful for as much as you're willing to share. I'm sorry this happened to you and I hope you're able to recover.

I know a couple people at one of the major offices. Sounds like lit and life sciences are a couple of the groups of being hit as hard.

Can anon stealthed associate confirm?

I have heard of stealths happening in a few of the corporate groups, which makes sense given that Covid could significantly impact deal flow this year. Don't know anything about lit.

2013 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Is it really as bad as people are saying? There hasn’t been anything on ATL and I assumed someone would’ve said something by now.

Personally, I don't feel comfortable leaking to ATL. I am assuming they would require me to verify my identity in some way and that's a non-starter for me (even if they promise to keep my identity a secret). I do feel strongly about getting my experience out there (be it on message boards or otherwise) - so long as I can do it anonymously.

Anonymous User wrote:

esther0123 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Thank you for doing this! Were there any signs that this would happen, and if so, what were they, and what year (without getting too specific) were you?

I got held back a class year in January at my annual review for very vague "performance" reasons, which caught me completely off guard. Before my review, I had received consistently positive performance reviews (both formally and informally) and thought I had built a good rapport with people in my group. Billables were never a problem - even after my annual review I was still being assigned to new deals and my hours never dropped until I got stealthed.

Thank you for sharing your experience. It sounds like you've had multiple years worth of reviews, not just one. Would it be fair to assume you're somewhere in the mid-level to senior range?

esther0123 wrote: ↑

Fri May 08, 2020 5:55 pm

Anonymous User wrote:

esther0123 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Thank you for doing this! Were there any signs that this would happen, and if so, what were they, and what year (without getting too specific) were you?

I got held back a class year in January at my annual review for very vague "performance" reasons, which caught me completely off guard. Before my review, I had received consistently positive performance reviews (both formally and informally) and thought I had built a good rapport with people in my group. Billables were never a problem - even after my annual review I was still being assigned to new deals and my hours never dropped until I got stealthed.

Thank you for sharing your experience. It sounds like you've had multiple years worth of reviews, not just one. Would it be fair to assume you're somewhere in the mid-level to senior range?

That's correct - I'm between a 3rd and a 6th year.

Anonymous User wrote: ↑

Fri May 08, 2020 4:25 pm

2013 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Goodwin Procter (V37) according to another thread.

More details?

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... &start=175

This is all anyone knows rn. I, too, would like more details. Hopefully a GP associate can chime in.

GP associate who got stealthed checking in. Happy to answer any questions about my experience so long as I can remain anonymous (for obvious reasons).

Is it really as bad as people are saying? There hasn’t been anything on ATL and I assumed someone would’ve said something by now.

Personally, I don't feel comfortable leaking to ATL. I am assuming they would require me to verify my identity in some way and that's a non-starter for me (even if they promise to keep my identity a secret). I do feel strongly about getting my experience out there (be it on message boards or otherwise) - so long as I can do it anonymously.

As I understand it, they won't "verify" anything. Just give them a throwaway email--it's better that they have the info so they can compile and have something to reference when they ask firm management what's going on. If they for whatever reason *did* ask you to verify your identity, you could always refuse anything that might out you.

Also, if Goodwin is in fact laying off an impressive number of associates, they won't be able to figure out that it was you.

Reed Smith has quietly and abruptly laid off some associates in several US offices.