Stealth Layoff Tracker (COVID-19 2020) Forum

[Anonymous User]

Judging by my LinkedIn feed, Deloitte laid off a few seniors/managers but seem to have spared almost all new people hired last year from LLM programs.

[Anonymous User]

Can also confirm multiple layoffs at Cleary. We've always been an up or out firm, but I've heard about associates in the Class of 2016/2017 (and up) getting stealthed.

I've heard the same thing regarding Cleary. This also comes on the heels of them announcing a one-off fellowship where they are seconding juniors to non-profits for half their salary. Seems like they might be moving aggressively to shed associate salaries.

[Anonymous User]

Can also confirm multiple layoffs at Cleary. We've always been an up or out firm, but I've heard about associates in the Class of 2016/2017 (and up) getting stealthed.

I've heard the same thing regarding Cleary. This also comes on the heels of them announcing a one-off fellowship where they are seconding juniors to non-profits for half their salary. Seems like they might be moving aggressively to shed associate salaries.

Any idea why Cleary is being hit so hard? I know Vault rankings don't matter a whole lot, but they're a V20 and generally very highly regarded. It's concerning to see them struggling so much when the rest of the V20 has been relatively unscathed.

[unlicensedpotato]

Can also confirm multiple layoffs at Cleary. We've always been an up or out firm, but I've heard about associates in the Class of 2016/2017 (and up) getting stealthed.

I've heard the same thing regarding Cleary. This also comes on the heels of them announcing a one-off fellowship where they are seconding juniors to non-profits for half their salary. Seems like they might be moving aggressively to shed associate salaries.

Any idea why Cleary is being hit so hard? I know Vault rankings don't matter a whole lot, but they're a V20 and generally very highly regarded. It's concerning to see them struggling so much when the rest of the V20 has been relatively unscathed.

I don't have any specific information, but I think it's likely just because they don't have as significant of a corporate/transactional practice as a lot of their peer firms.

[cisscum]

Can also confirm multiple layoffs at Cleary. We've always been an up or out firm, but I've heard about associates in the Class of 2016/2017 (and up) getting stealthed.

I've heard the same thing regarding Cleary. This also comes on the heels of them announcing a one-off fellowship where they are seconding juniors to non-profits for half their salary. Seems like they might be moving aggressively to shed associate salaries.

Any idea why Cleary is being hit so hard? I know Vault rankings don't matter a whole lot, but they're a V20 and generally very highly regarded. It's concerning to see them struggling so much when the rest of the V20 has been relatively unscathed.

I don't have any specific information, but I think it's likely just because they don't have as significant of a corporate/transactional practice as a lot of their peer firms.

Is cleary the highest ranking firm in this thread? This should be bigger news.

[Wild Card]

Cleary
2020: V14
2019: V14
2018: V12
2017: V9
2016: V8
2015: V7
2014: V8
2013: V8
2012: V8
2011: V9

I think it'll remain the GULC of the top law firms this year. Rankings come out in a week or so.

[LBJ's Hair]

Cleary's RPL is pretty lousy compared to peers. Imagine part of that is large relative share of international offices (w/lower billing rates) dragging down its average, but still...

2019 #s
S&C: $1.7M
K&E: $1.6M
STB: $1.6M
CSM: $1.6M
Skadden: $1.5M
Debevoise: $1.4M
DPW: $1.4M
PW: $1.4M
Gibson: $1.4M
...
Cleary: $1.0M

[Anonymous User]

For Cleary, are you referring to the ordinary course firings that happen around this time of year every year? I wouldn't think of those as stealth layoffs. Every April/May following the spring partner meeting, the firm culls the more senior classes, firing associates who are no longer partner track (up or out) and reaches down to fire some associates in lower classes too. Can confirm Cleary has done that the last few years, including this year, probably firing between 10-20 associates annually. Associates get a significant amount of time to find a new job (while being paid). Or is the poster referring to something different?

[Anonymous User]

For Cleary, are you referring to the ordinary course firings that happen around this time of year every year? I wouldn't think of those as stealth layoffs. Every April/May following the spring partner meeting, the firm culls the more senior classes, firing associates who are no longer partner track (up or out) and reaches down to fire some associates in lower classes too. Can confirm Cleary has done that the last few years, including this year, probably firing between 10-20 associates annually. Associates get a significant amount of time to find a new job (while being paid). Or is the poster referring to something different?

It didn't happen to me and I am not in a class year or group that was impacted. But I heard from others: (1) more lawyers cut than in prior years, (2) people given until September to find new positions (vs December or later, which is more standard), and (3) lawyers in class years that are not usually part of the spring partner meeting lay-offs are being are being culled. So, while more senior lawyers are always part of that conversation, I heard about 3rd/4th/5th years getting the call.

[Anonymous User]

Just learned from someone who got let go that Shearman & Sterling NY has been laying off junior assocs (1-2 yr) in their corporate groups.

[Anonymous User]

Just learned from someone who got let go that Shearman & Sterling NY has been laying off junior assocs (1-2 yr) in their corporate groups.

Thanks for the tip! Do they happen to be people who failed to win the H1B lottery or are domestic juniors being cut as wel?

[gasfard]

Just learned from someone who got let go that Shearman & Sterling NY has been laying off junior assocs (1-2 yr) in their corporate groups.

Thanks for the tip! Do they happen to be people who failed to win the H1B lottery or are domestic juniors being cut as wel?

If 2nd years are being let go it's not just about the visa (being a 2nd year means you got the visa)

[Anonymous User]

Just learned from someone who got let go that Shearman & Sterling NY has been laying off junior assocs (1-2 yr) in their corporate groups.

From experience, the corporate groups at Shearman have slowed down. Well before the pandemic, there were too many warm bodies and not enough work to go around. Perversely, litigation has been consistently busy.

[Anonymous User]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

[Anonymous User]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

I have no direct knowledge but have a hard time believing that a progressive-leaning firm with a female chair and voted one of the best firms for female attorneys is specifically targeting women with stealth layoffs. Maybe I'm not cynical enough.

[JusticeSquee]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

I have no direct knowledge but have a hard time believing that a progressive-leaning firm with a female chair and voted one of the best firms for female attorneys is specifically targeting women with stealth layoffs. Maybe I'm not cynical enough.

Narrator: She was not cynical enough.

[smile0751]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

Any more details? Level? Group? Total number?

[Anonymous User]

It went pretty junior to 2017 range. Unclear of number.

[Anonymous User]

Believe it was around 5 for numbers in an area. Not sure about other groups.

[Anonymous User]

I have first hand knowledge of the R&G culture and this does not surprise me. Although it touts itself as being a great place for women in my experience it was as male-dominated a culture as they come.

[Anonymous User]

For Cleary, are you referring to the ordinary course firings that happen around this time of year every year? I wouldn't think of those as stealth layoffs. Every April/May following the spring partner meeting, the firm culls the more senior classes, firing associates who are no longer partner track (up or out) and reaches down to fire some associates in lower classes too. Can confirm Cleary has done that the last few years, including this year, probably firing between 10-20 associates annually. Associates get a significant amount of time to find a new job (while being paid). Or is the poster referring to something different?

It didn't happen to me and I am not in a class year or group that was impacted. But I heard from others: (1) more lawyers cut than in prior years, (2) people given until September to find new positions (vs December or later, which is more standard), and (3) lawyers in class years that are not usually part of the spring partner meeting lay-offs are being are being culled. So, while more senior lawyers are always part of that conversation, I heard about 3rd/4th/5th years getting the call.

Another Cleary associate here. I can confirm I've heard all of the same things as the above, morale is definitely low...

[Throwaway5818]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

I have no direct knowledge but have a hard time believing that a progressive-leaning firm with a female chair and voted one of the best firms for female attorneys is specifically targeting women with stealth layoffs. Maybe I'm not cynical enough.

Just because the layoffs may or may not have been disproportionately women does not mean they were targeting women. Could very easily be that a disproportionate number of the incompetent associates were women.

[Anonymous User]

I have first hand knowledge of the R&G culture and this does not surprise me. Although it touts itself as being a great place for women in my experience it was as male-dominated a culture as they come.

Female R&G associate here. I haven’t heard anything about layoffs, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t happening. I will say that I find the culture at Ropes to be extremely supportive of women. There are tons of women in leadership, and they are very accommodating of associates (male and female) with family commitments. I’m surprised the anon has had a different experience, because it seems pretty entrenched in firm culture.

[objctnyrhnr]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

I have no direct knowledge but have a hard time believing that a progressive-leaning firm with a female chair and voted one of the best firms for female attorneys is specifically targeting women with stealth layoffs. Maybe I'm not cynical enough.

Just because the layoffs may or may not have been disproportionately women does not mean they were targeting women. Could very easily be that a disproportionate number of the incompetent associates were women.

+1. Honestly call me not supportive enough or whatever, but I truly believe that in today’s culture, this type of counterpoint/obvious observation does not seem to be made often enough.

We as an educated body simply can’t automatically assume that any time that white males didn’t get some sort of adverse action in direct proportion to, or above, their population in a given group, that the ‘powers that be’ were purposefully targeting [insert non-white-male group here].

Correlation does not equal causation and all that.

[legalpotato]

I heard from a friend that R&G did stealth layoffs in their corporate dept and thinks it mainly affected females associates

I have no direct knowledge but have a hard time believing that a progressive-leaning firm with a female chair and voted one of the best firms for female attorneys is specifically targeting women with stealth layoffs. Maybe I'm not cynical enough.

Just because the layoffs may or may not have been disproportionately women does not mean they were targeting women. Could very easily be that a disproportionate number of the incompetent associates were women.

+1. Honestly call me not supportive enough or whatever, but I truly believe that in today’s culture, this type of counterpoint/obvious observation does not seem to be made often enough.

We as an educated body simply can’t automatically assume that any time that white males didn’t get some sort of adverse action in direct proportion to, or above, their population in a given group, that the ‘powers that be’ were purposefully targeting [insert non-white-male group here].

Correlation does not equal causation and all that.

Careful, there is no room in [our] civilized society for nuanced opinions. Would appreciate, though, if people could give us more of the actual data re layoffs (how many, class years, etc.) and less of the political trolling.