Big4

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:14 am

With respect to job security, is it fair to analogize the Big4 (especially in NYC) to the v4 (or similar) biglaw firms to the extent that even in economic downturns (like now) neither the Big4 nor v4 biglaw firms are laying off current associates or rescinding outstanding offers for associates to join? Like the v4, Big4 (NYC) is always busy, right?

dabigchina

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Re: Big4

Post by dabigchina » Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:14 pm

It's like a v5 in that they are financially stable and won't completely collapse.

But, because they have so many people, employees and partners are generally more expendable. They had layoffs last time around, and if things stay bad, they will again.

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nealric

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Re: Big4

Post by nealric » Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:58 pm

Regarding partnership prospects, keep in mind that Big4 are more leveraged than Biglaw tax. What that means is the ratio of people who start at the firm to the ones who go on to make partner is even more skewed against partnership.

"Director" is probably equivalent to "of counsel" but be aware you can get stuck at senior manager for a long time. But other posters are right in that there is a very strong in-house pipeline. Some of that is because you physically go to clients on a regular basis and really get to know people on the client side, unlike biglaw where you are usually chained to your desk and most client interaction happens at the partner level. Most folks jump in house once they hit manager or senior manager (essentially the point that you become marketable and have had time to develop client connections). Big4 has less of an up or out mentality than Biglaw does, and will usually welcome you back if you decide to return after time in-house.

As a final note, I'm uncertain how things would shake out for a non-CPA JD/LLM in terms of in-house opportunities. There are numerically lot more CPA positions in corporate tax departments than there are JD positions. It's also more rare for tax legal to interact significantly with less senior Big 4 folks. While someone on the compliance side might regularly interact with a manager-level person for a return review, in a planning project, I'd only have significant interaction with the partners.

dabigchina

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Re: Big4

Post by dabigchina » Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:53 pm

Agree re: exit ops. I think a JD/LLM from big4 will have a slight edge if only because they are closer to the numbers, which is more valuable for an in house department. Note, that this is probably less applicable to WNT and M&A.

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:33 am

Does anyone here work in transfer pricing? If so, is transfer pricing its own group, or is it a subgroup of the international tax group?

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hangtime813

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Re: Big4

Post by hangtime813 » Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:57 am

Anonymous User wrote:Does anyone here work in transfer pricing? If so, is transfer pricing its own group, or is it a subgroup of the international tax group?
At Deloitte, Transfer Pricing is its own group.

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nealric

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Re: Big4

Post by nealric » Wed Apr 29, 2020 11:34 am

Anonymous User wrote:Does anyone here work in transfer pricing? If so, is transfer pricing its own group, or is it a subgroup of the international tax group?
The thing with transfer pricing is that it's more economic analysis than law. The experience won't translate well outside of transfer pricing. I'd probably avoid it unless I were an economist by training or had no other options.

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 29, 2020 12:27 pm

nealric wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Does anyone here work in transfer pricing? If so, is transfer pricing its own group, or is it a subgroup of the international tax group?
The thing with transfer pricing is that it's more economic analysis than law. The experience won't translate well outside of transfer pricing. I'd probably avoid it unless I were an economist by training or had no other options.
Thanks. A v30 law firm I follow is holding a webcast on transfer pricing issues for CLE credits so I was wondering if it'd have any useful overlap with international tax.

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nealric

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Re: Big4

Post by nealric » Wed Apr 29, 2020 1:05 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
nealric wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Does anyone here work in transfer pricing? If so, is transfer pricing its own group, or is it a subgroup of the international tax group?
The thing with transfer pricing is that it's more economic analysis than law. The experience won't translate well outside of transfer pricing. I'd probably avoid it unless I were an economist by training or had no other options.
Thanks. A v30 law firm I follow is holding a webcast on transfer pricing issues for CLE credits so I was wondering if it'd have any useful overlap with international tax.
It’s within the umbrella of international, it’s just that transfer pricing issues are usually their own thing, so you likely won’t learn much technical tax in a transfer pricing group.

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 07, 2020 12:44 pm

Have incoming tax associates in NYC received start dates yet? If so, when are you starting? month.

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 07, 2020 1:32 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Have incoming tax associates in NYC received start dates yet? If so, when are you starting? month.
Yes, October 22 :|

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 07, 2020 1:42 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Have incoming tax associates in NYC received start dates yet? If so, when are you starting? month.
Yes, October 22 :|
Not so bad. Better than January. Which firm? KPMG hasn't reported start dates yet.

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Re: Big4

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 07, 2020 2:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Have incoming tax associates in NYC received start dates yet? If so, when are you starting? month.
Yes, October 22 :|
Not so bad. Better than January. Which firm? KPMG hasn't reported start dates yet.
Definitely better than January! The firm is PwC.

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