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Hey everyone,

I’m a rising second-year associate, V10 NYC and have a difficult situation that’s making me consider leaving. Would love any advice.

As background info, I’ve gotten pretty good reviews & assigned (as I wanted to) to a highly competitive small group at the firm, where I did my first rotation. I want to work in this subject matter area post-Biglaw.

Towards the end of my second rotation (in a different group, around late July), there was a general call around the firm for junior associates to get staffed on a huge regulatory matter that’s going to be going on and very active for at least 9 months.

I was slow the wrong week and was among ~20 associates staffed on it. (I don’t do regulatory work, have no interest/experience, etc.) I was told I’d be on it for a few weeks, a month max. I wasn’t thrilled but thought this wasn’t a huge deal. The Work is highly non-substantive and has 0 overlap with that of my actual group.

Fast-forward to today, I’m still on this matter, and will be until at least some point in December (but I’ve gotten my timeline moved back for getting of it 4 times, so I’m pretty pessimistic that timeline will he kept). Nearly all other Non-regulatory associates have gone back to their groups.

It’s been a pretty heavy workload (~250 a month on average), and I haven’t had time to do much, if any, of my actual group’s work (<10 hours total).

I’m very concerned that, as this stretches into the 4-6 month range & with no real end in sight, my development is being damaged and that I’m significantly behind my classmates who are doing actual substantive work on a daily basis and have been for months.

The partners know my concerns, but I don’t get any responses besides “you’re doing a good job on this” and “sorry”.

Am I crazy for thinking (especially as no end is in sight) that I should be thinking about leaving so I actually develop somewhere? Welcome any advice. Thanks!

The reward for good work is more work. It sounds like you are good at what you do. Congrats .

To get to your real question, I think you should just stay put.

1) Nobody is going to care about those extra 6-months of "experience" a couple years from now. The partners are fine with it for the time being, and you are in no risk of getting let go. The idea that a firm is going to play favorites because associate X has worked on substantive matters for 3 years and associate Y has worked on substantive matters for 3.5 years is ridiculous on its face.

2) You aren't going to suddenly get more experience by jumping ship. The time you have already spent on regulatory work is a sunk cost. Even if you interview, lateral out, and join a new firm... how much more time will be burned up before you start getting "substantive" work in your preferred practice area? Unless you are going to be stuck on this regulatory work for the next 1-2 years, there is no advantage to switching out.

I get that the situation sucks, and there are other subtle reasons why it isn't great (e.g., you won't be able to build strong relationships with the partners in your own practice group). But nothing is really going to be solved by trying to jump ship to another firm.

I'm in a similar situation, though I'm billing only 150 per month, doing substantive work. 250 doing non-substantive work sounds awful.

You could leave, but the issue is where would you go?

If you can secure offers at other V10 firms, go for it. Otherwise, stick it out a while longer.

Being very very familiar with what you’re describing, I would vote for leaving if you can line something else up. I’d also make it clear to the partners in your actual practice group that you will look to leave the firm if you don’t come off the matter in December. Frame it as you don’t want to take them by surprise.

OP here. Thanks for the advice to you both! You both hit the nail on the head. It’s a pretty draining process, doing 250 a month on non substantive work & makes me hate my job. The lack of relationships being built also matters a lot to my ability to stick it out long term.

I guess my primary concern is being 6 months behind my classmates, and always being the last person in my pretty small class (only 5 of us second years in the group) to get staffed on more interesting stuff moving forward.

Anonymous User wrote:OP here. Thanks for the advice to you both! You both hit the nail on the head. It’s a pretty draining process, doing 250 a month on non substantive work & makes me hate my job. The lack of relationships being built also matters a lot to my ability to stick it out long term.

I guess my primary concern is being 6 months behind my classmates, and always being the last person in my pretty small class (only 5 of us second years in the group) to get staffed on more interesting stuff moving forward.

At the same time, I think partners generally think all junior associates are fairly incompetent and need a lot of hand holding (which is true, it's just part of the job), but it sounds like you have a pretty good work ethic. So, in a few months, I don't think partners will care that you've done less substantive work than your classmates and will probably still give you substantive work.

It also sounds like you are doing a good job on this project, so maybe the partners you're working for now will share positive feedback with the partners in your group. In my opinion, I'd heavily prefer a junior that I know will work hard and try to do a good job than one who has 6 months more substantive experience.

You have to ask for work in other group and turn down work in reg group if at all feasible. If you look unavailable to the small group you want, assignments that otherwise going to you will go to someone else and before you know it, you’re not really part of the group at all.

You'll be fine on the experience front. Just try to get back to your preferred area and if not, look around to lateral. You don't need to tell them so soon though.

Don't leave yet, while I understand it is frustrating, the people you work for seem to like the work you are doing. If you can get off the project next month, great. If it gets pushed back several months again, then talk with the partners in your group about trying to get back or at least reducing your time on the project. If that fails and there really is no end in sight, then start looking

OP here. I think this is basically what I’m going to do. I’ve generally gotten my materials together, and made the partners aware that I’m very eager to get off this ASAP. Fingers crossed.

Thanks for the advice to all!

OP - the best advice here is to get busy on other matters in the group for which you would like to work. Talking to folks will not do much. They obviously need bodies and do not care if that means you are not learning. Leaving may be an option but it will take a while and it may be difficult to transition without substantive experience in the area of your choice.

While it will be painful to also be busy on other matters - it will be worth it in the long run and will allow you to push back on work from this project. You will also likely need to do a less than stellar job on work from this project. Again, this will be painful, but this is what taking control of your career looks like. Everyone will be nice to you if you keep plowing away at this project - until it’s time for you to be promoted (or simply rise in class year) or to try to lateral.

At that point, folks at your current firm will not remember your sacrifices on this project but care only about your substantive skills, which you will not have been developing. Lateral firms similarly will ask you at interviews about your experience - what will you tell them?

To summarize, stop asking and simply start getting on work you like. Then push back on the work you don’t like. I’ve seen too many associates get stuck on these type of cases for years and end of stunted in their career development (and unable to effectively lateral).

Anonymous User wrote:OP - the best advice here is to get busy on other matters in the group for which you would like to work. Talking to folks will not do much. They obviously need bodies and do not care if that means you are not learning. Leaving may be an option but it will take a while and it may be difficult to transition without substantive experience in the area of your choice.

While it will be painful to also be busy on other matters - it will be worth it in the long run and will allow you to push back on work from this project. You will also likely need to do a less than stellar job on work from this project. Again, this will be painful, but this is what taking control of your career looks like. Everyone will be nice to you if you keep plowing away at this project - until it’s time for you to be promoted (or simply rise in class year) or to try to lateral.

At that point, folks at your current firm will not remember your sacrifices on this project but care only about your substantive skills, which you will not have been developing. Lateral firms similarly will ask you at interviews about your experience - what will you tell them?

To summarize, stop asking and simply start getting on work you like. Then push back on the work you don’t like. I’ve seen too many associates get stuck on these type of cases for years and end of stunted in their career development (and unable to effectively lateral).

I strongly agree with the above. From experience, even if people think you are a good worker, they may not like you enough to be invested in your career or like others more or may simply not care. In any event, you have to take ownership of the work you are getting or look for greener pastures. Probably a little early to leave yet, but if after 2-3 months or so, nothing's changing after doing the above and nothing seems like it will change in the near future, I'd start looking.

It's also important to note that your assigned group may not have that much work, period, and I can definitely see a situation where they assigned you to that group without expressing that they don't have any work to appease all parties involved. Firms are weird like that.

This is something others have touched on, but I think you need to stop asking and/or expressing disinterest in the project you are working on. Partners don’t care - and if anything, may be annoyed that a second year making $200k+ is “complaining” (even if that isn’t the case) about not getting enough “substantive” experience.

Instead, focus on getting more work in the group you are in, and use that work to push back on the regulatory work. They can find another warm body to fill your shoes.

Something else to consider is talking to midlevels/senior associates in your preferred group. Depending on your relationship, you could take a more senior associate out to lunch/coffee, constructively raise your issue and see if that associate would be willing to staff you on some of their matters (or give you some overflow work). This is obviously dependent on how free market your staffing is, but could be useful to get the thoughts of a more senior associate who also knows the partners in your preferred group and what your regulatory work may mean for your future.