Jones Day Compensation Data Points Forum

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Apr 18, 2022 10:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:18 pm
Is anyone else frustrated that SAs were seemingly bumped to $225K but current NLGs haven’t heard anything about a raise. Any idea if or when we’ll get bumped?
We're not getting bumped, and I'm pissed.
I wonder how they are going to spin it in literally a month when the summers are making more than the first years. Although it seems like most of the people in my office aren't particularly opinionated about it. I guess the best case scenario is that they bump us to like $230K in June

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Apr 18, 2022 11:00 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:18 pm
Is anyone else frustrated that SAs were seemingly bumped to $225K but current NLGs haven’t heard anything about a raise. Any idea if or when we’ll get bumped?
We're not getting bumped, and I'm pissed.
Didn't everyone know that JD pulls these kind of shenanigans before accepting an offer? I don't see how this is a surprise.
Well, they bumped us to $210K right before we started, so I think most of us thought they would do something similar.

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Mon Apr 18, 2022 11:40 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 10:59 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:18 pm
Is anyone else frustrated that SAs were seemingly bumped to $225K but current NLGs haven’t heard anything about a raise. Any idea if or when we’ll get bumped?
We're not getting bumped, and I'm pissed.
I wonder how they are going to spin it in literally a month when the summers are making more than the first years. Although it seems like most of the people in my office aren't particularly opinionated about it. I guess the best case scenario is that they bump us to like $230K in June
I wouldn't be surprised if bumps happen in June. They may not be retroactive, though.

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:26 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:18 pm
Is anyone else frustrated that SAs were seemingly bumped to $225K but current NLGs haven’t heard anything about a raise. Any idea if or when we’ll get bumped?
We're not getting bumped, and I'm pissed.
Didn't everyone know that JD pulls these kind of shenanigans before accepting an offer? I don't see how this is a surprise.
I'm pissed, but I'm not overly surprised. I did somewhat expect them to keep pace with the first years, and they're not even doing that. Rich of them to then ask us to court the summers.

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:51 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:26 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 6:23 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:18 pm
Is anyone else frustrated that SAs were seemingly bumped to $225K but current NLGs haven’t heard anything about a raise. Any idea if or when we’ll get bumped?
We're not getting bumped, and I'm pissed.
Didn't everyone know that JD pulls these kind of shenanigans before accepting an offer? I don't see how this is a surprise.
I'm pissed, but I'm not overly surprised. I did somewhat expect them to keep pace with the first years, and they're not even doing that. Rich of them to then ask us to court the summers.
I swear they did this sort of thing before, maybe 2018? Like the summers got an immediate match but the NLGs didn't. Not a JD associate but I knew a few back then.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:57 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:48 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:17 pm
Upping this thread in light of special bonuses.

Current NLG in a cravath-scale market. What are the odds of NLGs getting a mid-year salary bump to (at least partially) reflect special bonuses. 0%? More than 0%?

Would appreciate any thoughts.
It depends on how many associates who are being undercompensated start interviewing between now and June. Jones Day will only pay if a large number of people start threatening to leave (i.e., the associates throw a wrench in the business operations of the firm) by interviewing at other law firms and actually departing. Just making noise about it but not taking action won't be enough. And believe me, your office's management committees are absolutely writing down which names are showing up as those with resumes in the market and making retention pay decisions accordingly (if the partners like you).

If you have good credentials at JD (prestige undergrad, T14 or especially T6 law school) then you should absolutely make some noise by putting some feelers out there. It will show up in your comp. Bad resumes are usually very badly compensated at that firm, because they feel lucky to even be associated with a reasonable, if not top tier, law firm. And as we know, there are a lot of bad resumes at JD.
Any idea whether JD compensation may be better for associates with "prestige undergrad/T14 or especially T6 law school"? Better as in those associates are more likely to get market rate compensation than other associates if work output is the same. This question pertains to non I&A associates.

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:59 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:48 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:17 pm
Upping this thread in light of special bonuses.

Current NLG in a cravath-scale market. What are the odds of NLGs getting a mid-year salary bump to (at least partially) reflect special bonuses. 0%? More than 0%?

Would appreciate any thoughts.
It depends on how many associates who are being undercompensated start interviewing between now and June. Jones Day will only pay if a large number of people start threatening to leave (i.e., the associates throw a wrench in the business operations of the firm) by interviewing at other law firms and actually departing. Just making noise about it but not taking action won't be enough. And believe me, your office's management committees are absolutely writing down which names are showing up as those with resumes in the market and making retention pay decisions accordingly (if the partners like you).

If you have good credentials at JD (prestige undergrad, T14 or especially T6 law school) then you should absolutely make some noise by putting some feelers out there. It will show up in your comp. Bad resumes are usually very badly compensated at that firm, because they feel lucky to even be associated with a reasonable, if not top tier, law firm. And as we know, there are a lot of bad resumes at JD.
Any idea whether JD compensation may be better for associates with "prestige undergrad/T14 or especially T6 law school"? Better as in those associates are more likely to get market rate compensation than other associates if work output is the same. This question pertains to non I&A associates.

Anonymous User
Posts: 428113
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:05 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 19, 2022 8:59 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:48 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Mon Mar 29, 2021 6:17 pm
Upping this thread in light of special bonuses.

Current NLG in a cravath-scale market. What are the odds of NLGs getting a mid-year salary bump to (at least partially) reflect special bonuses. 0%? More than 0%?

Would appreciate any thoughts.
It depends on how many associates who are being undercompensated start interviewing between now and June. Jones Day will only pay if a large number of people start threatening to leave (i.e., the associates throw a wrench in the business operations of the firm) by interviewing at other law firms and actually departing. Just making noise about it but not taking action won't be enough. And believe me, your office's management committees are absolutely writing down which names are showing up as those with resumes in the market and making retention pay decisions accordingly (if the partners like you).

If you have good credentials at JD (prestige undergrad, T14 or especially T6 law school) then you should absolutely make some noise by putting some feelers out there. It will show up in your comp. Bad resumes are usually very badly compensated at that firm, because they feel lucky to even be associated with a reasonable, if not top tier, law firm. And as we know, there are a lot of bad resumes at JD.
Any idea whether JD compensation may be better for associates with "prestige undergrad/T14 or especially T6 law school"? Better as in those associates are more likely to get market rate compensation than other associates if work output is the same. This question pertains to non I&A associates.
I'm not sure JD cares about undergrad. Otherwise yes, pay is better for T14 grads, former clerks (even outside I&A), and laterals from prestigious firms.

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:52 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:05 pm
I'm not sure JD cares about undergrad. Otherwise yes, pay is better for T14 grads, former clerks (even outside I&A), and laterals from prestigious firms.
I’ve looked at bills and circumstantially, there seems to be about a ten percent difference between how much Jones Days bills out associates from lower-ranked schools vs ~T20ish. I haven’t actually heard this but was surprised to see different rates between me and my classmates in the same office.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:24 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:05 pm
I'm not sure JD cares about undergrad. Otherwise yes, pay is better for T14 grads, former clerks (even outside I&A), and laterals from prestigious firms.
I’ve looked at bills and circumstantially, there seems to be about a ten percent difference between how much Jones Days bills out associates from lower-ranked schools vs ~T20ish. I haven’t actually heard this but was surprised to see different rates between me and my classmates in the same office.
Which Jones Day was this?

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Apr 20, 2022 11:04 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:24 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2022 12:52 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Tue Apr 19, 2022 11:05 pm
I'm not sure JD cares about undergrad. Otherwise yes, pay is better for T14 grads, former clerks (even outside I&A), and laterals from prestigious firms.
I’ve looked at bills and circumstantially, there seems to be about a ten percent difference between how much Jones Days bills out associates from lower-ranked schools vs ~T20ish. I haven’t actually heard this but was surprised to see different rates between me and my classmates in the same office.
Which Jones Day was this?
Texas offices

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 21, 2022 9:37 pm

Any insight as to how competitive JD DC is for people who aren't gunning for I&A? I noticed there are very few T14 associates (non I&A) compared to other DC biglaw firms at JD DC

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri Apr 22, 2022 7:08 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Apr 21, 2022 9:37 pm
Any insight as to how competitive JD DC is for people who aren't gunning for I&A? I noticed there are very few T14 associates (non I&A) compared to other DC biglaw firms at JD DC
Not at JD but knew a few of the T14 types in the DC office. My understanding is most of those non-T14 types were near or at the top of their class. In the T14, I do think they'll dip below what Cov/WH/A&P/Gibson/etc. would go for, but not by a lot.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:03 pm

How common is it for an NLG to not get their first choice for a practice group, particularly if it’s a more specialized group (aka not the mega BATL, M&A, etc. groups)?

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 11:14 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:03 pm
How common is it for an NLG to not get their first choice for a practice group, particularly if it’s a more specialized group (aka not the mega BATL, M&A, etc. groups)?
Anon because this is a specific instance that could be linked to me. In my experience, if you meet with enough people and drag your heels into the ground, you can join any practice group (except for I&A). Unless you’re not getting any work at all from the group, you’ll be fine. This is true even when there aren’t attorneys in your office that are in the group. Just keep talking to people and make it loud that you want to be in X group. Meet with partners especially and ask the odds of them taking another associate, if the partners are fine with it, no one will interrupt it.

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 2:16 pm

What do you need to get I&A? Are you specifically recruited for it, or do you have to go through NLG and hope it works out? Also how does NLG work for post-clerkship associates coming in as 2/3rd years in general?

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 7:56 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 2:16 pm
What do you need to get I&A? Are you specifically recruited for it, or do you have to go through NLG and hope it works out? Also how does NLG work for post-clerkship associates coming in as 2/3rd years in general?
SCOTUS or 9th, 2nd, D.C. circuit clerkship = I&A

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 7:58 pm

I honestly can't believe that the SAs are going to be making more than us (NLGs) lol.

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 8:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 7:56 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 2:16 pm
What do you need to get I&A? Are you specifically recruited for it, or do you have to go through NLG and hope it works out? Also how does NLG work for post-clerkship associates coming in as 2/3rd years in general?
SCOTUS or 9th, 2nd, D.C. circuit clerkship = I&A
This used to be true, but not anymore. These days I&A is basically all SCOTUS clerks, especially in DC, with a few feeder clerks sprinkled in.

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 13, 2022 9:47 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 8:12 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 7:56 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 2:16 pm
What do you need to get I&A? Are you specifically recruited for it, or do you have to go through NLG and hope it works out? Also how does NLG work for post-clerkship associates coming in as 2/3rd years in general?
SCOTUS or 9th, 2nd, D.C. circuit clerkship = I&A
This used to be true, but not anymore. These days I&A is basically all SCOTUS clerks, especially in DC, with a few feeder clerks sprinkled in.
Huh. Interesting. Out where I am (albeit it’s not the mothership), the I&A associates are mainly 9th Circuit clerks.

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Sat May 14, 2022 11:46 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 9:47 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 8:12 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 7:56 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 13, 2022 2:16 pm
What do you need to get I&A? Are you specifically recruited for it, or do you have to go through NLG and hope it works out? Also how does NLG work for post-clerkship associates coming in as 2/3rd years in general?
SCOTUS or 9th, 2nd, D.C. circuit clerkship = I&A
This used to be true, but not anymore. These days I&A is basically all SCOTUS clerks, especially in DC, with a few feeder clerks sprinkled in.
Huh. Interesting. Out where I am (albeit it’s not the mothership), the I&A associates are mainly 9th Circuit clerks.
On the current website, 21 out of the 30 I&A associates are SCOTUS clerks, and some of the other 9 will clerk in the future. Of the others, the 9th Circuit, 6th Circuit, and 11th Circuit are well-represented.

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Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue May 17, 2022 9:50 pm

Does anyone else feel like the firm is hemorrhaging associates at an insane rate? We’ve already lost multiple NLGs

Anonymous User
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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue May 17, 2022 10:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 9:50 pm
Does anyone else feel like the firm is hemorrhaging associates at an insane rate? We’ve already lost multiple NLGs
To other firms? Our office is gonna lose a few soon, but not to other firms.

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue May 17, 2022 10:06 pm

So is it fair to say that JD is actually three firms in a trenchcoat? I&A is a boutique, T14 grads in NY are generic biglaw, everyone else more like midlaw?

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Re: Jones Day Compensation Data Points

Post by Anonymous User » Tue May 17, 2022 10:35 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Tue May 17, 2022 10:06 pm
So is it fair to say that JD is actually three firms in a trenchcoat? I&A is a boutique, T14 grads in NY are generic biglaw, everyone else more like midlaw?
Former JD associate, now at another Biglaw firm. In practice, no not really. Associates in all major-market JD offices work on cases pretty similar to other V20/V50. I never worked on cases that’d generally be handled by midlaw/regional firms. I mostly worked on well-publicized cases for F500 clients. Also handled some white collar investigations for HNW clients.

I&A folks were brought onto cases to help with responsive motions and potential appellate concerns. This is similar to my new firm where the appellate people will help general litigation with major briefing, but otherwise stay out of investigations, discovery, or trial practice.

In terms of compensation, I don’t think there’s a disparity between a T14 in New York versus DC, or Chicago, or the California (and maybe Texas) offices. Across the board, it’ll be lower than market. Comp in Atlanta, Miami (I think) would be a little lower than the major markers. And comp in Ohio/Pittsburgh/Minneapolis would be the lowest (but probably higher than market comp in those cities—don’t hold me to that though).

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

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