DPW (NY) vs. STB (NY) Forum

[NLaw13]

I have narrowed down my offers to DPW and STB and I was hoping for some insight into which would be better for someone who wants to do corporate law for 3-5 years followed by great exit opportunities to in-house counsel positions. Information about the summer program, office culture, face time requirements, etc. would be greatly appreciated!

[DoveBodyWash]

Used to work at DPW and have friends at Simpson. STB has funner/chiller people and you’ll have more fun as a summer there. Passive aggressive stereotype is much more applicable to the DPW litigators. As a junior you’re expected to be in the office within reason (I.e., if your seniors are there then you should be) but face time expectations vary between groups.

On substance, depends on what you want. STB has three rotations (DPW has two) and primary/secondary practice group assignments. Better if you want to try more practices and/or don’t know what you want to do yet.

STB and DPW typically represent opposite sides of the sponsor/lender and issuer/underwriter coin, which will lead to different exit options at the junior/midlevel stage. My sense is that exit options start to equalize and depend more on who you know as you get more senior. I think lifestyle on the sponsor side is always worse (because the clients themselves work harder).

[uncle_rico]

Used to work at DPW and have friends at Simpson. STB has funner/chiller people and you’ll have more fun as a summer there. Passive aggressive stereotype is much more applicable to the DPW litigators. As a junior you’re expected to be in the office within reason (I.e., if your seniors are there then you should be) but face time expectations vary between groups.

On substance, depends on what you want. STB has three rotations (DPW has two) and primary/secondary practice group assignments. Better if you want to try more practices and/or don’t know what you want to do yet.

STB and DPW typically represent opposite sides of the sponsor/lender and issuer/underwriter coin, which will lead to different exit options at the junior/midlevel stage. My sense is that exit options start to equalize and depend more on who you know as you get more senior. I think lifestyle on the sponsor side is always worse (because the clients themselves work harder).

STB is actually reducing the rotation system down to two rotations so they’re even more similar now. STB has phenomenal relationships with KKR and Blackstone as well as the general private equity industry so if that’s specifically the type of work or exit opportunities you’d like then I’d lean there. I believe that DPW tends to be more on the bank side of transactions given their well known FIG team. Also, people seem to give the advantage to DPW aFork CapMarkets work. You can’t go wrong at either of these firms, though I probably would go to STB our kf personal choice. The passive aggressiveness at DPW is a real thing and something that even some of the associates inexplicably pitched as a positive about DPW. Try to do second looks if you haven’t already and just go with whichever me you like the people at better.

[v5junior]

DPW M&A group has been on a VERY aggressive facetime kick. Like monitoring when people show up to the office in the AM and calculating 3-month averages of arrival times.

[Anonymous User]

DPW M&A group has been on a VERY aggressive facetime kick. Like monitoring when people show up to the office in the AM and calculating 3-month averages of arrival times.

How exactly is this done? Is it just automated tracking or do emails actually get sent out calling people out for not coming in early enough??

[DoveBodyWash]

DPW M&A group has been on a VERY aggressive facetime kick. Like monitoring when people show up to the office in the AM and calculating 3-month averages of arrival times.

How exactly is this done? Is it just automated tracking or do emails actually get sent out calling people out for not coming in early enough??

lol what. anyone who works in biglaw other than the last 6 associates standing at Cadwalader knows it's laughable to think the bolded is true. Yes the M&A group is emphasizing face time more lately but they were also the most relaxed for awhile.

There's a strong expectation that juniors are in the office when they're needed (which is a lot depending on group) but it's not going to be meaningfully better at a peer firm. Simpson M&A has been on a total tear lately. They're not closing all those deals from their home office.

[kdxsam]

Also interested in the same question, with Cleary also being considered. It'd be great if I can hear some perspective on quality of life aspects of the firm. I liked DPW, but two things that threw me off were: (1) the way the office is arranged, with one person behind the other, instead of sitting next to eachother. Just felt a bit creepy to me... (2) how the dinner reimbursement is capped at $25, and associate at Skadden mentioned it's like $40 there.

[WeeBey]

Also interested in the same question, with Cleary also being considered. It'd be great if I can hear some perspective on quality of life aspects of the firm. I liked DPW, but two things that threw me off were: (1) the way the office is arranged, with one person behind the other, instead of sitting next to eachother. Just felt a bit creepy to me... (2) how the dinner reimbursement is capped at $25, and associate at Skadden mentioned it's like $40 there.

There's not going to be any work-life balance difference that is measurable between DPW, STB, and Cleary for corporate. Any difference would solely due to the luck of the draw of which partners that you work for. All of them are top NYC corporate practices with DPW and STB being a cut above Cleary.

[Anonymous User]

STB has a $35 dinner cap. Not sure what you can get delivered for $25 in NYC.

[Anonymous User]

STB has a $35 dinner cap. Not sure what you can get delivered for $25 in NYC.

This isn't true, unless you meant DPW (I have heard vague comments about a dinner cap there but can't verify). I've gotten as much as $50 reimbursed for dinner at STB. There's no cap, just guidelines, and you can bend the guidelines.

[Anonymous User]

The DPW dinner allowance is also just a guideline. I've never heard of anyone spending $35 on dinner and being reprimanded, or even having it mentioned to them.

Even as a summer, I spent $30-35 on dinner at DPW, more often than not.

[Anonymous User]

Where are you people ordering dinner from that exceeds $25?

[Anonymous User]

Where are you people ordering dinner from that exceeds $25?

Sushi, mostly.

[Anonymous User]

The DPW dinner allowance is also just a guideline. I've never heard of anyone spending $35 on dinner and being reprimanded, or even having it mentioned to them.

Even as a summer, I spent $30-35 on dinner at DPW, more often than not.

yeah the cap isn't enforced

[NLaw13]

Thanks for the responses so far! I have heard before that STB has more fun/friendlier people who are slightly more social and also that DPW tends to be stinger with the benefits overall, including food, but it seems like that might not be entirely enforced. Is it not true though that DPW might be just a small cut above STB in terms of both work and prestige (unless you want to do private equity)?

[DoveBodyWash]

Thanks for the responses so far! I have heard before that STB has more fun/friendlier people who are slightly more social and also that DPW tends to be stinger with the benefits overall, including food, but it seems like that might not be entirely enforced. Is it not true though that DPW might be just a small cut above STB in terms of both work and prestige (unless you want to do private equity)?

Definitely no edge in terms of the work. STB does a ton of top notch/complex work. They probably have a lot more smaller deals/matters going on because sponsors are involved all over the place but those deals aren't any easier (oftentimes they're worse). I personally never felt that DPW was more prestigious than STB, especially since it appears they've successfully weathered the Kirkland raids. However, I do think DPW may have more of a sheen among law students and older/boomer lawyers (in the same way that Milbank remains pretty prestigious in the minds of older lawyers). Don't think that should affect your decision though.

ETA: DPW has more of a revolving door with the federal government (makes sense given who their traditional clients are) which may round out its prestige factor. But that could change and shouldn't really matter if you're pure corporate and not interested in litigation/regulatory work.