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Graduated from CCN with a 3.25. I'm not sure where I fall ranking wise, but I assume bottom third. Good news is I have big law lined up. I assume this will affect me if I get shitcanned or want to lateral within the next two years. Will my grades be largely behind me after that? Ultimate goal is to end up in-house.

Anonymous User wrote:Graduated from CCN with a 3.25. I'm not sure where I fall ranking wise, but I assume bottom third. Good news is I have big law lined up. I assume this will affect me if I get shitcanned or want to lateral within the next two years. Will my grades be largely behind me after that? Ultimate goal is to end up in-house.

You are fine. Currently at a V30 and we've hired laterals with similar GPAs from that tier of school.

Anonymous User wrote:Graduated from CCN with a 3.25. I'm not sure where I fall ranking wise, but I assume bottom third. Good news is I have big law lined up. I assume this will affect me if I get shitcanned or want to lateral within the next two years. Will my grades be largely behind me after that? Ultimate goal is to end up in-house.

A handful of firms will care enough for it to be an issue; most firms won't care at all.

As for in-house positions, in-house hiring can be idiosyncratic, but your law-school grades will be completely irrelevant for most in-house jobs.

went to a top 10 school. My lateral firm after 1.5 years of practice ddint ask for a transcript until post offer. Most lateral firms did though, some dont

in a similar boat as OP.. Lots of Ps at Berkeley

I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

OP here. Nice congrats on landing on your feet. I actually fucked up 1L too, had a 3.0 fall semester, which I brought up to 3.1 at the end of the year. Felt pretty relieved to still have like 9 call backs from OCI, so I lucked out. I didn't even apply to any v10 because I didn't think I had a shot and I wanted to play it super safe for OCI, which in hindsight, I sort of regret.

Anonymous User wrote:in a similar boat as OP.. Lots of Ps at Berkeley

Same!

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

How did you get that V10 gig when you had no big law job at graduation? Can I PM you?

I thought grades no longer affected me either (a few years out, barely a mid level though) and this was true for the most part during my lateral interviews earlier this year. However, I had a nightmare interview at a callback in which a partner berated me for 30 minutes about my 1L grades, and pretty much shat all over me the entire time. For instance, he pointed to one of my higher 2L grades and made a comment to the effect of, "let me guess, this was on a higher curve right?" We talked about virtually nothing else during the interview. He did not acknowledge my upward grade trend or some of my really high 2L and 3L grades.

This was especially perplexing to me considering this partner graduated from a lower tier regional school and graduated without honors or law review. I concluded this was either a stress test or the guy had a serious chip on his shoulder. Ended up getting an offer but, my 1L grades came back to haunt me more than half a decade later.

For context, I'm from a lower t14 (and t13.... Since that seems to matter for some people on TLS). This was biglaw, but not a V50 firm.

Anonymous User wrote:I thought grades no longer affected me either (a few years out, barely a mid level though) and this was true for the most part during my lateral interviews earlier this year. However, I had a nightmare interview at a callback in which a partner berated me for 30 minutes about my 1L grades, and pretty much shat all over me the entire time. For instance, he pointed to one of my higher 2L grades and made a comment to the effect of, "let me guess, this was on a higher curve right?" We talked about virtually nothing else during the interview. He did not acknowledge my upward grade trend or some of my really high 2L and 3L grades.

This was especially perplexing to me considering this partner graduated from a lower tier regional school and graduated without honors or law review. I concluded this was either a stress test or the guy had a serious chip on his shoulder. Ended up getting an offer but, my 1L grades came back to haunt me more than half a decade later.

For context, I'm from a lower t14 (and t13.... Since that seems to matter for some people on TLS). This was biglaw, but not a V50 firm.

Hm well it kind of sounds like if it weren't your 1L grades, it would have been something else.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

How did you get that V10 gig when you had no big law job at graduation? Can I PM you?

Sure feel free to PM

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

OP here. Nice congrats on landing on your feet. I actually fucked up 1L too, had a 3.0 fall semester, which I brought up to 3.1 at the end of the year. Felt pretty relieved to still have like 9 call backs from OCI, so I lucked out. I didn't even apply to any v10 because I didn't think I had a shot and I wanted to play it super safe for OCI, which in hindsight, I sort of regret.

Don't regret it, you probably had zero chance at a V10 from OCI. I got my offer after being out of school for a year and working in a field that made the transition logical. You can always lateral up if you are dissatisfied at your firm.

Also in this boat graduated from a top 14 but definitely in the bottom of my class. I have a biglaw job line dup but what should I expect if I want to lateral? What are lateral firms looking at in junior associates 1-2 yrs in? Nothing I can do about my gpa now.

Anonymous User wrote:Also in this boat graduated from a top 14 but definitely in the bottom of my class. I have a biglaw job line dup but what should I expect if I want to lateral? What are lateral firms looking at in junior associates 1-2 yrs in? Nothing I can do about my gpa now.

My situation exactly. Have biglaw in a secondary, but interested in moving to NYC in 1-2 years.

First, as a general proposition, your grades will travel with you for long, long time. It's incorrect for people to claim that grades don't matter after the first [second] job; if you have a truly crappy gpa you can bet your bottom dollar that an employer would pause a little at the very least. They ask for transcripts for a reason, even after 5-10 years of practice. Of course, if you are a super rainmaker, then no one cares.

Having said that, if you have a numerically decent-sounding GPA from one of the best schools (say 3.25), you would do just fine. Class rank might be in the bottom 1/3, but you are not going to put that down on your resume, are you? If your school is not local to the firm in question, you can assume that most attorneys wouldn't have a good sense of the grade curve.

Yes, the ranking might be on the transcript, depending on whether your school officially ranks its students, but the interviewers might not look in the right place (most normal ones don't study the transcript in fine detail). In my experience, firms don't freak out over ranks as much as a (numerically horrible) grade point average. There is definitely something psychological about this. The opposite is true: a 2.5 might be the median at a law school, but it's not likely that anyone with a 2.95 from that school is getting hired by a larger firm, even if 2.95 puts you in the top 1/3 (let's just say).

That's just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Also in this boat graduated from a top 14 but definitely in the bottom of my class. I have a biglaw job line dup but what should I expect if I want to lateral? What are lateral firms looking at in junior associates 1-2 yrs in? Nothing I can do about my gpa now.

My situation exactly. Have biglaw in a secondary, but interested in moving to NYC in 1-2 years.

Generally difficult to do for an array of reasons. Best (but not only) shot is if your firm has an office in NYC that you can move to.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

OP here. Nice congrats on landing on your feet. I actually fucked up 1L too, had a 3.0 fall semester, which I brought up to 3.1 at the end of the year. Felt pretty relieved to still have like 9 call backs from OCI, so I lucked out. I didn't even apply to any v10 because I didn't think I had a shot and I wanted to play it super safe for OCI, which in hindsight, I sort of regret.

Don't mean to hijack your thread but any advice on how you managed to get so many callbacks with your 1L GPA would be super appreciated. Pretty sure I'll be in the same boat.

Congrats!

hagoomata wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:I had that GPA at a top 10 school at graduation, way worse 1L grades (3.0), had no big law job and ended up at a V10. Your GPA is fine

OP here. Nice congrats on landing on your feet. I actually fucked up 1L too, had a 3.0 fall semester, which I brought up to 3.1 at the end of the year. Felt pretty relieved to still have like 9 call backs from OCI, so I lucked out. I didn't even apply to any v10 because I didn't think I had a shot and I wanted to play it super safe for OCI, which in hindsight, I sort of regret.

Don't mean to hijack your thread but any advice on how you managed to get so many callbacks with your 1L GPA would be super appreciated. Pretty sure I'll be in the same boat.

Congrats!

I'm the quoted anon within the quoted anon, but I had a 3.0 GPA (bottom 5-10%) and had 14 callbacks during OCI (0 offers - ended at V10 after graduation). Networking is the answer. Literally cold-emailing alumni partners at firms in my target city, scheduling coffee/lunch/office visits (sometimes 3-4 a day) and just trying my hardest to make connections with the right people. If you hit it off with a powerful partner, it can be an instant callback for you. It was a ton of work but was very necessary for me to get the number of callbacks I did.

As someone in this position, why are firms suddenly open to laterals from T14s with 3.25ish final GPAs after a couple years? Is it a supply/demand thing?

Anonymous User wrote:As someone in this position, why are firms suddenly open to laterals from T14s with 3.25ish final GPAs after a couple years? Is it a supply/demand thing?

Likely because someone with knowledge of how to do law firm work is more valuable with a dude who got an A in Torts? Grades are in many ways a way to get through the door when they otherwise have no way to meaningfully measure the abilities of different law students.