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I'm currently interviewing with a federal agency in hopes of leaving my biglaw job. Curious as to what TLS considers "bigfed." Is it solely DOJ? What about other agencies like the SEC, EPA, DHS, USPS, DOL, ED, DOT, etc., or the various OIG offices within these agencies?

Also curious if USDA Office of General Counsel would be bigfed?

To me, BigFed is any federal agency with a revolving door to BigLaw.

What does it matter?

Tiny Rick! wrote:What does it matter?

And this discussion just went WAY over Rick's head.

Bigfed is synonymous with any legal employment in federal government

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:What does it matter?

And this discussion just went WAY over Rick's head.

Explain please.

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:What does it matter?

And this discussion just went WAY over Rick's head.

Explain please.

Nebby understands. Read OP, my comment, and then Nebby's. Read Nebby's careful and a few times out loud if you have to.

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:What does it matter?

And this discussion just went WAY over Rick's head.

Explain please.

Nebby understands. Read OP, my comment, and then Nebby's. Read Nebby's careful and a few times out loud if you have to.

I think you have trouble with reading comprehension (and adverb use if we are being nit picky). My question was in the same spirit as Nebby's comment.

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:What does it matter?

And this discussion just went WAY over Rick's head.

Explain please.

Nebby understands. Read OP, my comment, and then Nebby's. Read Nebby's careful and a few times out loud if you have to.

I think you have trouble with reading comprehension (and adverb use if we are being nit picky). My question was in the same spirit as Nebby's comment.

It is not in the same spirit as Nebby's comment. It must be your poor writing and poor use of tone.

kellyfrost wrote: It is not in the same spirit as Nebby's comment. It must be your poor writing and poor use of tone.

Can you explain how you interpret my comment?

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote: It is not in the same spirit as Nebby's comment. It must be your poor writing and poor use of tone.

Can you explain how you interpret my comment?

A question asked by someone who doesn't understand the nature of OP's comment.

BigFed is anything that is not ShitFed. Also, ShitFed (like the limit) does not exist because all of the federal government is awesome.

Also, this escalated quickly.

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote: It is not in the same spirit as Nebby's comment. It must be your poor writing and poor use of tone.

Can you explain how you interpret my comment?

A question asked by someone who doesn't understand the nature of OP's comment.

Thanks - very helpful. I see the error of my ways now.

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote:

Tiny Rick! wrote:

kellyfrost wrote: It is not in the same spirit as Nebby's comment. It must be your poor writing and poor use of tone.

Can you explain how you interpret my comment?

A question asked by someone who doesn't understand the nature of OP's comment.

Thanks - very helpful. I see the error of my ways now.

Good.

I really hope that whether TLS considers your job offer "bigfed" will not affect your decision making.

i agree that this line drawing is probably dumb but i would guess bigfed is doj, sec, dod, ftc, fcc and the like; midfed is usda, epa, interior, etc.; shitfed is dhs, the va and similar.

To me (federal government attorney) big fed is basically any normal "905" attorney job in the federal government that involves the programatic work of the agency--normal meaning that it has an 11-14/15 career ladder. It's honestly hard to differentiate based on agency. For example, an attorney at the SEC who does labor relations/employment law in the general counsel's office is going to be in a totally different position than an attorney in one of the SEC policy/enforcement divisions when it comes to exit options. Same at the DOJ, etc.

Obviously some federal attorney positions are harder to get and more "prestigious" than others though. But this isn't entirely based on agency.

ShitFed does exist. It's called Social Security (unless you're an ALJ, though a recent circuit court case may have opened the door to a constitutional challenge of the entire ALJ scheme in the federal government).

I agree with the above post. Any position that has a promotion potential of a GS-14 is BigFed; GS-15 or SES even better. Though, I think in most people's minds, BigFed is mostly DOJ, but it actually uses a less generous pay scale than other federal agencies.

abogadesq wrote:ShitFed does exist. It's called Social Security (unless you're an ALJ, though a recent circuit court case may have opened the door to a constitutional challenge of the entire ALJ scheme in the federal government).

I agree with the above post. Any position that has a promotion potential of a GS-14 is BigFed; GS-15 or SES even better. Though, I think in most people's minds, BigFed is mostly DOJ, but it actually uses a less generous pay scale than other federal agencies.

CR. Also, another poster above was correct that DHS is generally ShitFed. Assistant Chief Counsel at ICE, for example, is a sps position generally occupied by less-than-stellar attorneys.

Re pay for DOJ: I know you're right for AUSAs, but aren't Main Justice attorneys on the GS?

It is all relative and what people are looking out of a legal position. Most fed attorney positions don't have variance in terms of pay, so the benchmarks would be prestige, media exposure, and exit opportunities. I'd also think that most positions at agency HQ in DC is more likely to be considered Bigfed.

.

gaddockteeg wrote:To me, BigFed is any federal agency with a revolving door to BigLaw.

This makes sense, I guess, although the vast majority of fed lawyers and law students aiming for federal employment I've met have planned on staying there long term.

The only downside to the fed track is that most of it runs through DC. GS salaries top out around 160k. Perfectly fine for most of the country, but it doesn't go very far in the DC area, especially since most people will eventually have families.

abogadesq wrote:ShitFed does exist. It's called Social Security (unless you're an ALJ, though a recent circuit court case may have opened the door to a constitutional challenge of the entire ALJ scheme in the federal government).

I agree with the above post. Any position that has a promotion potential of a GS-14 is BigFed; GS-15 or SES even better. Though, I think in most people's minds, BigFed is mostly DOJ, but it actually uses a less generous pay scale than other federal agencies.

The sarcasm in my post didn't translate well.

Anyway, yeah SSA is BAD.

jess wrote:

grand inquisitor wrote:i agree that this line drawing is probably dumb but i would guess bigfed is doj, sec, dod, ftc, fcc and the like; midfed is usda, epa, interior, etc.; shitfed is dhs, the va and similar.

this is a pretty good breakdown except i would put dhs as midfed solely because you can hit gs 14/15 as an attorney, whereas the VA and soc sec seem to max out at gs 11 or something absurd like that.

VA attorney here. VA maxes out at GS-14, with GS-15 being a competitive promotion. The exception is VA field attorneys, which recently were eligible for GS-15 promotions (not sure how widespread this is though).