Omitting bad law firm from resume? Forum

[Anonymous User]

I want to disassociate from a crappy firm. I don't mean the firm is crappy because it's shitlaw or has no prestige; it is because the firm and the partner themselves do not have good reputation in the area, including to federal judges. Once I secure my next job, is it okay to leave this firm out of my work history? If so, how would I fill this 8-12 months gap?

[tyroneslothrop1]

Probably more hassle than it is worth. If I saw someone who worked for a firm with a terrible reputation for 8-12 months, I'd think to myself: "I understand why they moved on." I wouldn't hold it against them. A gap would probably raise more red flags. In a couple years you could omit it if you really wanted to.

[Toni V]

If you are ever seriously considered by a real law firm [i.e. “V”] they will have you thoroughly checked out. No way in hell would you ever be able to explain your omission of a previous legal employer. You would be immediately disqualified on ethics.

[A. Nony Mouse]

If you are ever seriously considered by a real law firm [i.e. “V”] they will have you thoroughly checked out. No way in hell would you ever be able to explain your omission of a previous legal employer. You would be immediately disqualified on ethics.

Leaving stuff off your resume is not an ethical breach. Lying on your resume, maybe. But a resume is a selection of your qualifications, not a sworn statement that you have disclosed everything you've ever done.

I agree the firm probably won't hurt you, and it's true that when a firm does conflicts checks they will need to know that you worked at this crappy place, so you'll have to tell them anyway, so leaving it off seems more trouble than it's worth. But it's not an ethical breach to leave it off your resume. (Maybe not to tell them for conflicts, but I would imagine that's a different process than just looking at your resume.)

[barkschool]

Even John Kasich keeps Lehman Bros on his resume.

[thatbethat]

Dont risk it. Such bigger downside to leaving it off and getting caught.

[2014]

If you are ever seriously considered by a real law firm [i.e. “V”] they will have you thoroughly checked out. No way in hell would you ever be able to explain your omission of a previous legal employer. You would be immediately disqualified on ethics.

I doubt this is true in the context of a resume - it's just a personal advertisement you can put whatever you want or leave whatever you want off.

Any legal employer will definitely ask you for previous legal employers for conflicts purposes though and there's no way in hell OP could omit this firm then. The question is whether it's worth the awkward "wait why isn't this on your resume" conversation that has a good chance of coming up.

[NoDayButToday]

.

[Anonymous User]

OP here. Will there be a conflict issue even if I worked as a law clerk and never filed any paper with my name on it? The reason why I want to leave this off is this firm is toxic and went bankrupt. It is barely staying afloat.

[rpupkin]

OP here. Will there be a conflict issue even if I worked as a law clerk and never filed any paper with my name on it? The reason why I want to leave this off is this firm is toxic and went bankrupt. It is barely staying afloat.

Yes, there can be a conflict based on your work as a clerk (or as a summer associate).

By the way, I think you're vastly overthinking this. Law firms dissolve/go bankrupt all the time. A junior associate is not tainted by association with such a firm. Leaving relevant legal experience off of your resume is weird and not in your interests.

[Anonymous User]

OP here. Will there be a conflict issue even if I worked as a law clerk and never filed any paper with my name on it? The reason why I want to leave this off is this firm is toxic and went bankrupt. It is barely staying afloat.

Yes, there can be a conflict based on your work as a clerk (or as a summer associate).

By the way, I think you're vastly overthinking this. Law firms dissolve/go bankrupt all the time. A junior associate is not tainted by association with such a firm. Leaving relevant legal experience off of your resume is weird and not in your interests.

The partners will probably be disbarred or at worst, go to jail, for something they did before I got there.

[2014]

OP here. Will there be a conflict issue even if I worked as a law clerk and never filed any paper with my name on it? The reason why I want to leave this off is this firm is toxic and went bankrupt. It is barely staying afloat.

All legal work has to be disclosed - I've had to fill out forms for serving as a legal assistant to a solo practitioner during college

[rpupkin]

OP here. Will there be a conflict issue even if I worked as a law clerk and never filed any paper with my name on it? The reason why I want to leave this off is this firm is toxic and went bankrupt. It is barely staying afloat.

Yes, there can be a conflict based on your work as a clerk (or as a summer associate).

By the way, I think you're vastly overthinking this. Law firms dissolve/go bankrupt all the time. A junior associate is not tainted by association with such a firm. Leaving relevant legal experience off of your resume is weird and not in your interests.

The partners will probably be disbarred or at worst, go to jail, for something they did before I got there.

Then it sounds like you'll have some interesting stories to tell! Seriously, this is not as bad for you as you think it is. Put the legal experience on your resume.

[Anonymous User]

Then it sounds like you'll have some interesting stories to tell! Seriously, this is not as bad for you as you think it is. Put the legal experience on your resume.

every interview i had that asked why I left the firm, I said it's because i wanted more challenge and responsibility and something closer to home. would u at any point disclose the true reason?

[rpupkin]

Then it sounds like you'll have some interesting stories to tell! Seriously, this is not as bad for you as you think it is. Put the legal experience on your resume.

every interview i had that asked why I left the firm, I said it's because i wanted more challenge and responsibility and something closer to home. would u at any point disclose the true reason?

If it's true that you want more responsibility and something closer to home, then say that. But if a bunch of folks (including you) were let go because the firm is about to collapse--and if the reasons for that collapse are publicly known--why not say that as well? It might actually help you. If someone stopped working at a healthy firm after just a few months, I would probably assume they were asked to leave for performance reasons. But if the firm is in massive trouble, I would assume that the departure is probably unrelated to performance.

[rpupkin]

Edit: Removed double post

[BigZuck]

OP- Your question was "Could/should I do this?' and the answer is "No." That's the answer. "No." You can keep fighting that for another page and a half, or just accept the answer that was given to you. Given the quality of the advice you have received I'm not sure why you would keep fighting against it or why you would ignore it but YOLO bro.

[Toni V]

All legal work has to be disclosed - I've had to fill out forms for serving as a legal assistant to a solo practitioner during college

So true. If you omit your previous firm and your potential employer's point-of-view is that your omission is unethical....it's unethical. Short read....you're sunk.

[Anonymous User]

If it's true that you want more responsibility and something closer to home, then say that. But if a bunch of folks (including you) were let go because the firm is about to collapse--and if the reasons for that collapse are publicly known--why not say that as well? It might actually help you. If someone stopped working at a healthy firm after just a few months, I would probably assume they were asked to leave for performance reasons. But if the firm is in massive trouble, I would assume that the departure is probably unrelated to performance.

I am just worried that they might think I am connected to the unethical activities of the firm. It's just a really awkward conversation. "I left the firm because the partner was engaged in conduct that led to the firm's bankruptcy and possible investigation by the state bar. but I had nothing to do with it."

[kalvano]

All legal work has to be disclosed - I've had to fill out forms for serving as a legal assistant to a solo practitioner during college

So true. If you omit your previous firm and your potential employer's point-of-view is that your omission is unethical....it's unethical. Short read....you're sunk.

Disclosed for a conflicts check as part of the hiring process. Not on a resume. It's not any type of ethical violation to not put them on a resume.

OP, I agree with other folks here - especially as a law clerk, you have to kind of take the jobs that are available. I wouldn't be super concerned about it - I'd be more concerned about a gap in the resume. But if the firm really is that bad, then I don't think anyone will question why you left. Honestly, in that type of situation, I know if I were interviewing you, I'd be fine with you saying "I got the job, then realized it was kind of a shady place, but I needed the money so I stayed until I couldn't take it anymore / they collapsed / whatever." That's obviously going to be very dependent on your rapport with any interviewer, but generally speaking, people will understand.

[rpupkin]

If it's true that you want more responsibility and something closer to home, then say that. But if a bunch of folks (including you) were let go because the firm is about to collapse--and if the reasons for that collapse are publicly known--why not say that as well? It might actually help you. If someone stopped working at a healthy firm after just a few months, I would probably assume they were asked to leave for performance reasons. But if the firm is in massive trouble, I would assume that the departure is probably unrelated to performance.

I am just worried that they might think I am connected to the unethical activities of the firm. It's just a really awkward conversation. "I left the firm because the partner was engaged in conduct that led to the firm's bankruptcy and possible investigation by the state bar. but I had nothing to do with it."

C'mon. No one is going to think a law clerk is responsible for a firm going bankrupt. If asked, just say that you left because the firm was in financial trouble.

I agree that saying "but I had nothing to do with it" would be rather awkward, but that awkwardness would be entirely of your own making.

Let me draw an analogy. Imagine a college intern spent a summer working in the White House in 2005. When applying for jobs the following fall, the intern asks you for advice: "How am I going to make clear during interviews that I wasn't responsible for the mishandling of the Iraq war?" You'd laugh, right? Your situation is way more like this than you realize.

[A. Nony Mouse]

All legal work has to be disclosed - I've had to fill out forms for serving as a legal assistant to a solo practitioner during college

So true. If you omit your previous firm and your potential employer's point-of-view is that your omission is unethical....it's unethical. Short read....you're sunk.

Disclosed for a conflicts check as part of the hiring process. Not on a resume. It's not any type of ethical violation to not put them on a resume.

Yeah, please stop saying it's unethical to omit past work from a resume. It's absolutely not. And the OP has never said anything about not revealing what's necessary for conflicts checks.

(All moot because the OP should just put the firm on their resume, but stop posting bad fear-mongering advice.)

[Toni V]

When the firm gives you an in-person callback and they go over your work experience and resume, you’re saying that it’s okay to omit a firm you recently worked for? This is your advice, seriously?

[rpupkin]

When the firm gives you an in-person callback and they go over your work experience and resume, you’re saying that it’s okay to omit a firm you recently worked for? This is your advice, seriously?

I think you have a reading comprehension problem.

[A. Nony Mouse]

When the firm gives you an in-person callback and they go over your work experience and resume, you’re saying that it’s okay to omit a firm you recently worked for? This is your advice, seriously?

My advice is that the OP should put the firm on their resume, because the benefit of having legal experience to talk about outweighs any downside to being associated with the firm (which I think the OP is overestimating - I get why they're concerned, but I don't think it's the problem they fear it is).

But, no, not putting it on your resume isn't an ethical breach. The new firm might think it's weird when you do tell them about it after you get the job, and that might be kind of awkward or possibly even piss someone off, but none of those things are ethical problems.