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Will keep this short. Had pretty shitty grades 1L (CCN) with a 3.1. Doing better for 2L, and think I will end up with a 3.3 overall GPA.

I have a 2L SA at a v50 and got about 9 CBs out of 24 screeners during EIW. Few years of solid work experience. I regret not applying to "more prestigious" firms during 1L but I was pretty risk adverse. I'm thinking of going into tax law (had a change in heart) and my summer firm is not exactly a standout in the practice area. This is why I also put skadden in my topic title. Is 3L OCI unrealistic for me with my grades? If not, which firms should I try to hit? Should I try to network/cold email before my summer starts, during, or after?

Overall goals are to hack it out in a large law firm with a large class as long as I can (4 years hopefully) to use the experience as a springboard.

Not impossible. I'd hit up Skadden recruiting in July of this summer and see what their 3L hiring is going to look like and let them know you're interested.

Did you direct apply skadden? what happened

Trying won't hurt at all. Hopefully you can at least get an offer at your v50 firm to fallback on should you be unlucky.

I don't 3L OCI is "unrealistic" for you. It may be unlikely, but honestly it just depends on the particular hiring needs of that firm at the time. Some firms may just not need anyone, some firms may have a few openings and be totally willing to give you a shot. Already coming from an SA will probably put you above the other 3Ls who struck out entirely and didn't do SAs.

Like Nebby said, I'd probably start emailing them in July about their hiring needs.

Also don't regret not applying to more "prestigious firms". You got a SA that many others couldn't. Lots of reasons why "prestigious" firms can suck compared to others.

I'm in a similar boat. I'm waiting on my spring grades which I hope will spring me above the median. Made the mistake of just taking black letter courses 2L instead of taking "grade hacking" seminars or research work with profs who give As. Honestly kicking myself for it, but I'd like to hit up a few firms for 3L after the summer at a v30. I am not necessarily looking for a v10 or anything. There are a few firms I liked that are in the v20 and even v30 range that I'd like to get into over my current firm.

Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

I would recommend casting your net more broadly into V-15. You should be able to get at least one screener, especially with firms that are slightly less grade conscious like L&W and Weil.

Anonymous User wrote:Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

Fwiw, it seems like GULC seminars only give out A-'s like candy, A's are still usually top 10%.

Are you exclusively targeting NYC?

Anonymous User wrote:Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

nah you're fucked.

you should probably still apply anywhere you'd wanna work though

When would be a good time to mail? Ideadly I don't want to wait until the post summer offer, which, assuming I don't shit my pants or the economy goes kaput, will happen at the tail most end of july.

Anonymous User wrote:When would be a good time to mail? Ideadly I don't want to wait until the post summer offer, which, assuming I don't shit my pants or the economy goes kaput, will happen at the tail most end of july.

july seems good

Kratos wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

[*]nah you're fucked.
you should probably still apply anywhere you'd wanna work though

i hate TLS

Anonymous User wrote:

Kratos wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

[*]nah you're fucked.
you should probably still apply anywhere you'd wanna work though

lol wut?

your question was stupid so I gave a dick answer. like if someone said, "nah I don't think you have a shot" are you suddenly gonna not apply? asking about chances is dumb, especially with 3L hiring since for OCI there will be a finite number of employees so there's really no issue with bidding and shit and for mass mail you should just apply broadly and see how things shake out.

eta: nice ninja edit

What is a "similar type of firm?" One that you'll enjoy telling people you are employed at?

Kratos wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:

Kratos wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Is that only my school or I think seminars give give out tons of B+s and A-s, solid A can only be earned by cold hard curved courses for me. I did better 2L year taking all hard courses, with professors who are available and willing to give out past exams. Can I OCI into Vault 50 or similar type of firm with a 3.6 (BC/BU, top 15%)

[*]nah you're fucked.
you should probably still apply anywhere you'd wanna work though

lol wut?

your question was stupid so I gave a dick answer. like if someone said, "nah I don't think you have a shot" are you suddenly gonna not apply? asking about chances is dumb, especially with 3L hiring since for OCI there will be a finite number of employees so there's really no issue with bidding and shit and for mass mail you should just apply broadly and see how things shake out.

eta: nice ninja edit

very impressive speed at responding.

dixiecupdrinking wrote:What is a "similar type of firm?" One that you'll enjoy telling people you are employed at?

yes for anything below that you just sort of tell people that you work at a middle-sized boutique firm that has good reputation in the area.

OP here. Thanks for the responses.

Yes I am looking only in NYC. Of course I plan to work hard this summer and secure an offer. I guess I'm not even sure which firms are actually worth applying to and risking a move to in case I really click at my firm. Like I said, my only reason for applying to a "more prestigious firm" is because I feel the name recognition and bigger class size will help overall when I leave big law, and more importantly, I think the type of work will be more varied than what is done at my v50, particularly in tax.

That being said, as a 3L applicant, it's not like I will have the benefit of even having a SA with the new firm or trying these"varied" practices.

To the person who said I should cast my net more widely throughout the v20, should I really stress my interest in a specific field like tax? For tax, especially, I feel like there are never many openings and the people who really wanted it, get it by chumming up with the tax dept during their summers.

Former Skadden associate here. Unless things have changed in the last year, Skadden's 3L hiring is for specific practice group needs. If you receive an offer, you will be able to choose your practice group, but your choices will be limited to those mentioned when interviewing. Getting assigned to Skadden's tax team is really hard, even for regular summer associates, so I wouldn't count on that ever being an option at 3L OCI.

If you want to work for Skadden, don't try to sell your interest in tax. If you want to do tax, I'd suggest looking at other firms.

Of course, it never hurts to try. You just need to be sure which of the two possible good options you want before doing so.

Anonymous User wrote:Former Skadden associate here. Unless things have changed in the last year, Skadden's 3L hiring is for specific practice group needs. If you receive an offer, you will be able to choose your practice group, but your choices will be limited to those mentioned when interviewing. Getting assigned to Skadden's tax team is really hard, even for regular summer associates, so I wouldn't count on that ever being an option at 3L OCI.

If you want to work for Skadden, don't try to sell your interest in tax. If you want to do tax, I'd suggest looking at other firms.

Of course, it never hurts to try. You just need to be sure which of the two possible good options you want before doing so.

This is really what I was worried about. Anyone else have 3L OCI anecdotes?

Anonymous User wrote:

dixiecupdrinking wrote:What is a "similar type of firm?" One that you'll enjoy telling people you are employed at?

yes for anything below that you just sort of tell people that you work at a middle-sized boutique firm that has good reputation in the area.

I hate TLS.

From my experience (friends/classmates and this was 4 yrs ago), 3L hiring is much more random, so if you want to, give it a shot. But yes, 3L hiring at most places is much more group targeted, even at firms that don't group at the 2L SA or even 1st year associate level.

Why are people indulging this blatant prestige whore OP with an idiotic cover story of wanting to go to Skadden for tax?

Monochromatic Oeuvre wrote:Why are people indulging this blatant prestige whore OP with an idiotic cover story of wanting to go to Skadden for tax?

OP here. Idiotic? Nah I actually want to go into tax. Not sure about the other people who have hi-jacked the thread with their 3L OCI desires.

Anonymous User wrote:From my experience (friends/classmates and this was 4 yrs ago), 3L hiring is much more random, so if you want to, give it a shot. But yes, 3L hiring at most places is much more group targeted, even at firms that don't group at the 2L SA or even 1st year associate level.

Ah yes. I'm worried because tax is such a close-knit specialized group, Idk if they ever take rando 3Ls. Also, as I mentioned, at best, my gpa will only be 3.3 (which I'm not sure is even median or not at CCN).

Your issue isn't going to be your GPA it's going to be that firms had massive summer classes last year and even bigger ones this year and the economy growth has slowed. I doubt 3L hiring is nearly as robust this year as the last two.