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Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 4:27 pm
by Anonymous User
What would be the consequences of reneging on a V39 for a V10? Does this even make sense to do?

ETA: Both NY

Post removed...

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 4:28 pm
by chalky
Post removed...

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:28 pm
by californiauser
It's okay to renege on a v53 for a V6, but definitely not a V39 for a V10.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 5:36 pm
by Anonymous User
californiauser wrote:It's okay to renege on a v53 for a V6, but definitely not a V39 for a V10.
Just trying to name the firm's without potentially outting myself...

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 8:38 pm
by Anomynous
Page 4 of the C&F application for most states has a question about whether you have reneged any offers after accepting them. They also provide a methodology in the appendix of the application (page 79 in the New York version) that applicants must use to determine whether their reneging constitutes a violation of the Rules of Professional Conduct. I am not sure what it is for other states, but in New York, in order for a reneging to be acceptable, the Vault rank of the firm you switched to must be less than one third of the Vault rank of the firm whose offer you reneged minus four. So, for example, if you reneged a V60 firm for a V15 firm, 15 is less than 16 (i.e., 60/3 – 4) so it would be okay. In your case, whether your reneging is acceptable depends on the rank of the firm you’re considering; 39/3-4 is 9, so you would be okay as long as the firm you’re considering is V8 or better. You have to be careful, though, because Vault rankings change from year to year so even if your reneging is acceptable now, it might not be in a year when you’re filling out the C&F application.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 8:58 pm
by BigZuck
It's Sunday and you're a big lawyer. Don't you have work to do?

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:28 pm
by Anonymous User
Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:34 pm
by jbagelboy
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:44 pm
by Winter is Coming
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:50 pm
by Anonymous User
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.
Yes, the V10 is Band 1 or 2 in the practice areas I am interested and the lower ranked ranked in band 4 or band 5. My current firm pays market, but I am mostly interested in exiting out of NYC to another market--think Chicago/LA type market--where my current firm does not have an office so I want to know if the increased name "prestige" will help with that. I also wouldn't be entirely opposed to lateraling down for the chance at partner (long shot I know and hard to say how serious this interest is without having practiced but I wouldn't want to close those doors without exploring it). Also the V10 is really good in some practice areas that my current firm doesn't really practice.

So will I get any flak for this? Or am I good to go?

ETA: both firms pay market and are 100% offer. I am slightly concerned about my current firm because of how it didn't fare the best in the recession. I think my current firm also matched the DPW bonus scale and I think it would match if salaries rise but it would obviously be far more costly for them to do so since the V10's PPP is around 3M and the PPP of my current firm is more 1.3 ish

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 8:34 am
by Anonymous User
I think its pretty obvious the lower ranked firm is FF and the V10 is either Cleary or Kirkland.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 9:15 am
by SemperLegal
For a SA? Have you tried splitting?

If not, is there a reason to switch other than ranking? I.e. compensation, firm stability, good info leading you to beleive better fit (not just one associate you thought was cool), etc?

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 9:16 am
by SemperLegal
Anonymous User wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.
Yes, the V10 is Band 1 or 2 in the practice areas I am interested and the lower ranked ranked in band 4 or band 5. My current firm pays market, but I am mostly interested in exiting out of NYC to another market--think Chicago/LA type market--where my current firm does not have an office so I want to know if the increased name "prestige" will help with that. I also wouldn't be entirely opposed to lateraling down for the chance at partner (long shot I know and hard to say how serious this interest is without having practiced but I wouldn't want to close those doors without exploring it). Also the V10 is really good in some practice areas that my current firm doesn't really practice.

So will I get any flak for this? Or am I good to go?

ETA: both firms pay market and are 100% offer. I am slightly concerned about my current firm because of how it didn't fare the best in the recession. I think my current firm also matched the DPW bonus scale and I think it would match if salaries rise but it would obviously be far more costly for them to do so since the V10's PPP is around 3M and the PPP of my current firm is more 1.3 ish
Ask to split and go from there.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:08 pm
by Anonymous User
SemperLegal wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.
Yes, the V10 is Band 1 or 2 in the practice areas I am interested and the lower ranked ranked in band 4 or band 5. My current firm pays market, but I am mostly interested in exiting out of NYC to another market--think Chicago/LA type market--where my current firm does not have an office so I want to know if the increased name "prestige" will help with that. I also wouldn't be entirely opposed to lateraling down for the chance at partner (long shot I know and hard to say how serious this interest is without having practiced but I wouldn't want to close those doors without exploring it). Also the V10 is really good in some practice areas that my current firm doesn't really practice.

So will I get any flak for this? Or am I good to go?

ETA: both firms pay market and are 100% offer. I am slightly concerned about my current firm because of how it didn't fare the best in the recession. I think my current firm also matched the DPW bonus scale and I think it would match if salaries rise but it would obviously be far more costly for them to do so since the V10's PPP is around 3M and the PPP of my current firm is more 1.3 ish
Ask to split and go from there.
Splitting is off the table--I screwed up and already accepted at the lower firm. Could I really ask for a split now?

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:10 pm
by Anonymous User
Is there some way this could actually bite me back?

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 12:34 pm
by SemperLegal
Anonymous User wrote:
SemperLegal wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.
Yes, the V10 is Band 1 or 2 in the practice areas I am interested and the lower ranked ranked in band 4 or band 5. My current firm pays market, but I am mostly interested in exiting out of NYC to another market--think Chicago/LA type market--where my current firm does not have an office so I want to know if the increased name "prestige" will help with that. I also wouldn't be entirely opposed to lateraling down for the chance at partner (long shot I know and hard to say how serious this interest is without having practiced but I wouldn't want to close those doors without exploring it). Also the V10 is really good in some practice areas that my current firm doesn't really practice.

So will I get any flak for this? Or am I good to go?

ETA: both firms pay market and are 100% offer. I am slightly concerned about my current firm because of how it didn't fare the best in the recession. I think my current firm also matched the DPW bonus scale and I think it would match if salaries rise but it would obviously be far more costly for them to do so since the V10's PPP is around 3M and the PPP of my current firm is more 1.3 ish
Ask to split and go from there.
Splitting is off the table--I screwed up and already accepted at the lower firm. Could I really ask for a split now?
Yes. Better then reneging.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:59 pm
by gk101
Anonymous User wrote:
jbagelboy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Bumping for anyone who will take my question seriously...
It's not a serious question; the vault rankings are meaningless. Is there a substantial different in pay or strength of your chosen practice group between the two firms? V-X versus V-Y means nothing to us; give a query of substance and a serious answer you shall receive.
Yes, the V10 is Band 1 or 2 in the practice areas I am interested and the lower ranked ranked in band 4 or band 5. My current firm pays market, but I am mostly interested in exiting out of NYC to another market--think Chicago/LA type market--where my current firm does not have an office so I want to know if the increased name "prestige" will help with that. I also wouldn't be entirely opposed to lateraling down for the chance at partner (long shot I know and hard to say how serious this interest is without having practiced but I wouldn't want to close those doors without exploring it). Also the V10 is really good in some practice areas that my current firm doesn't really practice.

So will I get any flak for this? Or am I good to go?

ETA: both firms pay market and are 100% offer. I am slightly concerned about my current firm because of how it didn't fare the best in the recession. I think my current firm also matched the DPW bonus scale and I think it would match if salaries rise but it would obviously be far more costly for them to do so since the V10's PPP is around 3M and the PPP of my current firm is more 1.3 ish
:lol: :lol:

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:38 pm
by Anonymous User
I reneged. It didn't feel great, but it hasn't hurt me. It's a burnt bridge, but the world isn't short on NYC law firms, and it sounds like you're looking to leave NYC anyways. There are ways it could come back in the future, but they're not likely. (E.g., if the person you interviewed with at v39 laterals to a firm you're interviewing with in Chicago in a few years, that might not work out great for you.)

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 2:53 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote:I reneged. It didn't feel great, but it hasn't hurt me. It's a burnt bridge, but the world isn't short on NYC law firms, and it sounds like you're looking to leave NYC anyways. There are ways it could come back in the future, but they're not likely. (E.g., if the person you interviewed with at v39 laterals to a firm you're interviewing with in Chicago in a few years, that might not work out great for you.)
Thanks for giving your experience. Did you tell the new firm? If they found out you reneged (either through you or someone else) what was their response? Thanks!

Re: Reneging

Posted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 3:01 pm
by Throwawayrenege
Anonymous User wrote:I reneged. It didn't feel great, but it hasn't hurt me. It's a burnt bridge, but the world isn't short on NYC law firms, and it sounds like you're looking to leave NYC anyways. There are ways it could come back in the future, but they're not likely. (E.g., if the person you interviewed with at v39 laterals to a firm you're interviewing with in Chicago in a few years, that might not work out great for you.)
OP here, could you PM me so we can discuss in a bit more detail...

Don't mind other people jumping on the thread.

Re: Reneging

Posted: Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:26 am
by pworx
Throwawayrenege wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:I reneged. It didn't feel great, but it hasn't hurt me. It's a burnt bridge, but the world isn't short on NYC law firms, and it sounds like you're looking to leave NYC anyways. There are ways it could come back in the future, but they're not likely. (E.g., if the person you interviewed with at v39 laterals to a firm you're interviewing with in Chicago in a few years, that might not work out great for you.)
OP here, could you PM me so we can discuss in a bit more detail...

Don't mind other people jumping on the thread.
Not OP, but would also appreciate a PM