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Typical question: which of the three would you choose? I think rankings matter very little in this comparison, to be honest. A&O and JD are obviously sort of "outsiders" in the "NY BigLaw" field and Cadwalader is a traditional NY firm but definitely in the "second tier" it seems. Interested in corporate work at all of them.

If anyone has experience with one of them, please share your experience if you have the time. Thanks!

Jones Day and I don't think it's that close.

*accidental anon

Anonymous User wrote:Jones Day and I don't think it's that close.

*accidental anon

do you mind expanding with some rationale? Curious.

I don't know all that much about A&O, but Cadwalader is a notoriously terrible place for associates and J&D is infamous for being a stickler about formal business attire.

nealric wrote:I don't know all that much about A&O, but Cadwalader is a notoriously terrible place for associates and J&D is infamous for being a stickler about formal business attire.

I guess the bit about formal attire isn't a big deal for me. I don't mind it. They're also moving to FiDi by this time next year which is appealing to me, location-wise. I bet the new offices will be nice too.

Thanks for the input.

Jones Day > Allen & Overy > Cadwalader. I have friends who summered in all three. From what I've heard, Jones Day and Allen & Overy are pretty close in terms of work atmosphere, but Cadwalader is notoriously a difficult place to work and it lives up to its reputation. Both JD and AO are great for international work obviously.

Anonymous User wrote:

nealric wrote:I don't know all that much about A&O, but Cadwalader is a notoriously terrible place for associates and J&D is infamous for being a stickler about formal business attire.

I guess the bit about formal attire isn't a big deal for me. I don't mind it. They're also moving to FiDi by this time next year which is appealing to me, location-wise. I bet the new offices will be nice too.

Thanks for the input.

I don't mind wearing suits per-se, but it can get stifling after a 15 hour day. Also, it's generally more expensive to keep up a formal business wardrobe (more cleaning bills, bigger up-front expense).

You can, you know, take off your suit jacket over the course of the day when in the office. It's not much different from being in business casual.

I was choosing btwn Jones Day, Cadwalader and a third firm.

Cadwalader was out of the running for me during the callback. People were weird there. My cb was at the same time as 3 other classmates and we all had someone senior at the firm close the door and tell us hey, it used to be bad working here because we had one awful partner but he's gone now, so it's a better place to be at. I had a 1st year associate who was a 3L when I started law school flat out tell me the culture there is bad, and that she was trying to get out. It's hard to imagine how it could be worse than the rest of NYC but I got bad vibes after those comments.

I'd choose Jones Day. Strong firm, have a great national reach, and seem to actually like each other. I was interested in lit so have no idea how corporate it as either. Best of luck though and congrats!

Anonymous User wrote:I was choosing btwn Jones Day, Cadwalader and a third firm.

Cadwalader was out of the running for me during the callback. People were weird there. My cb was at the same time as 3 other classmates and we all had someone senior at the firm close the door and tell us hey, it used to be bad working here because we had one awful partner but he's gone now, so it's a better place to be at. I had a 1st year associate who was a 3L when I started law school flat out tell me the culture there is bad, and that she was trying to get out. It's hard to imagine how it could be worse than the rest of NYC but I got bad vibes after those comments.

I'd choose Jones Day. Strong firm, have a great national reach, and seem to actually like each other. I was interested in lit so have no idea how corporate it as either. Best of luck though and congrats!

Just summered at Cadwalader and thought the culture was great. Maybe your friend is just at the wrong firm for her. Although, associates often say, on TLS and offline, that the summers are shielded from how things really are, so my read on the culture might be totally off. I definitely know people there that don't like it, but I can say the same for friends at other firms in NYC.

OP, if you are interested in M&A, I'd choose JD. For international work and projects, A&O, obviously. For financial regulation, derivatives, securitization and maybe real estate I'd choose Cad.

ETA: TBF to the anon I quoted I actually got kind of a weird vibe from my CB too. But the second look changed that.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:I was choosing btwn Jones Day, Cadwalader and a third firm.

Cadwalader was out of the running for me during the callback. People were weird there. My cb was at the same time as 3 other classmates and we all had someone senior at the firm close the door and tell us hey, it used to be bad working here because we had one awful partner but he's gone now, so it's a better place to be at. I had a 1st year associate who was a 3L when I started law school flat out tell me the culture there is bad, and that she was trying to get out. It's hard to imagine how it could be worse than the rest of NYC but I got bad vibes after those comments.

I'd choose Jones Day. Strong firm, have a great national reach, and seem to actually like each other. I was interested in lit so have no idea how corporate it as either. Best of luck though and congrats!

Just summered at Cadwalader and thought the culture was great. Maybe your friend is just at the wrong firm for her. Although, associates often say, on TLS and offline, that the summers are shielded from how things really are, so my read on the culture might be totally off. I definitely know people there that don't like it, but I can say the same for friends at other firms in NYC.

OP, if you are interested in M&A, I'd choose JD. For international work and projects, A&O, obviously. For financial regulation, derivatives, securitization and maybe real estate I'd choose Cad.

ETA: TBF to the anon I quoted I actually got kind of a weird vibe from my CB too. But the second look changed that.

I'm the OP.
This is good advice and kind of what I've been thinking also.

I doubt that cwt is worth it over the other two. I definitely think Jones day is superior.