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Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 4:14 am
by xiaofashix86
Hello everyone.
I am a Chinese and I am a 0L student at GULC. Recently I am considering working in London or China after finish my law degree. And I would like to practice Intellectual property law only in Big Law.
My question is will their London office or Asia office hire JD students working in IP field? I did some research but barely find any JD students in some IP giants' London offices (covington, Cooley, Arnold Porter etc), though some Asia offices have. JD students normally work in MA or capital market in these two places.What about Magic Circle London HQ ? IF they did, what’s the package? Thank you so much!
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:09 am
by jhett
Most US JDs in foreign offices are in M&A/cap markets/transactional because those practice areas are less tied to domestic laws. In contrast, IP law is very jurisdiction-dependent. It will be hard to break into foreign IP work when you are trained as an US lawyer. Not sure if you are interested in litigation or prosecution, but on the prosecution side if you're in London you'll need to be familiar with EPO practice, while in China you'll need to be familiar with SIPO practice.
I don't think most biglaw firms will hire you to do IP in a foreign jurisdiction unless you already have experience with IP in that jurisdiction (of course, there may be exceptions, but I have no leads on that). They probably prefer to hire local. You'll have to think outside the box when looking for employers. Don't just look at US biglaw or Magic Circle.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 9:11 am
by xiaofashix86
jhett wrote:Most US JDs in foreign offices are in M&A/cap markets/transactional because those practice areas are less tied to domestic laws. In contrast, IP law is very jurisdiction-dependent. It will be hard to break into foreign IP work when you are trained as an US lawyer. Not sure if you are interested in litigation or prosecution, but on the prosecution side if you're in London you'll need to be familiar with EPO practice, while in China you'll need to be familiar with SIPO practice.
I don't think most biglaw firms will hire you to do IP in a foreign jurisdiction unless you already have experience with IP in that jurisdiction (of course, there may be exceptions, but I have no leads on that). They probably prefer to hire local. You'll have to think outside the box when looking for employers. Don't just look at US biglaw or Magic Circle.
Thank you jhett, and I still want to know what do these abbreviation mean, EPO and SIPO? And what about competition law?
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 1:30 pm
by NapoleonXV
I do not know about IP practice in China specifically, but judging by your post, you definitely need to improve your writing skills and English abilities to become more employable.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 2:00 pm
by jhett
xiaofashix86 wrote: Thank you jhett, and I still want to know what do these abbreviation mean, EPO and SIPO? And what about competition law?
EPO =
European Patent Office
SIPO = State Intellectual Property Office of the P.R.C.
I just want to add that if international IP is really your goal, you have to start working on it right away. Network with lawyers in the countries where you may want to practice, learn about various IP law systems (i.e. US, EU, China, the Patent Cooperation Treaty), and research employers that are willing to take on US-trained lawyers. This will be a lot more work than just searching for jobs state-side.
Also, as the other poster said, you do need to improve your English. Having dual English/Chinese fluency is very marketable, but employers will expect that as a US-trained lawyer you will have great English skills.
I don't know anything about competition law.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 2:07 pm
by rpupkin
NapoleonXV wrote:I do not know about IP practice in China specifically, but judging by your post, you definitely need to improve your writing skills and English abilities to become more employable.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 4:49 pm
by Anonymous User
rpupkin wrote:NapoleonXV wrote:I do not know about IP practice in China specifically, but judging by your post, you definitely need to improve your writing skills and English abilities to become more employable.
poetic justice. I've seen over five similar comments that are useless and hurtful to the extreme, with the same rationale every single time (precision is important, etc, etc, etc, i mean this is a forum, pathetic shiz).
OP you need to work on your grades since that is the prerequisite thing;
-Make connections right now, but make sure the first conversation with any alum to be more so about their career, before you have your grades there is not much career to be discussed with you, you want to make people like you through that kind of connections.
-Go to ABA IP fair. EVERY SINGLE ONE
-keep your options open, who said people with science background can only do IP? personally I think entering into law school with a determination to IP work is extremely unwise. Unless you have a PHD in rock hard science, IP might make your life harder and jobless.
for IP transaction or litigation, i think international students are better suited for IP transactions, which some firms might not require a science background, but a science background definitely helps. NY and Boston are two big east coast IP market, especially Boston. (rish, coole, foley lardner. etc.) But GULC is definitely not as competitive in boston as in DC.
edit: I'm from Canada with a soft science background(bio-chem). hope this helps. and probably work on writing precision ASAP as well. there are work check software.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:48 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote:rpupkin wrote:NapoleonXV wrote:I do not know about IP practice in China specifically, but judging by your post, you definitely need to improve your writing skills and English abilities to become more employable.
poetic justice. I've seen over five similar comments that are useless and hurtful to the extreme, with the same rationale every single time (precision is important, etc, etc, etc, i mean this is a forum, pathetic shiz).
OP you need to work on your grades since that is the prerequisite thing;
-Make connections right now, but make sure the first conversation with any alum to be more so about their career, before you have your grades there is not much career to be discussed with you, you want to make people like you through that kind of connections.
-Go to ABA IP fair. EVERY SINGLE ONE
-keep your options open, who said people with science background can only do IP? personally I think entering into law school with a determination to IP work is extremely unwise. Unless you have a PHD in rock hard science, IP might make your life harder and jobless.
for IP transaction or litigation, i think international students are better suited for IP transactions, which some firms might not require a science background, but a science background definitely helps. NY and Boston are two big east coast IP market, especially Boston. (rish, coole, foley lardner. etc.) But GULC is definitely not as competitive in boston as in DC.
edit: I'm from Canada with a soft science background(bio-chem). hope this helps. and probably work on writing precision ASAP as well. there are work check software.
Thanks for your reply!
I also did bioscience (bachelor) before entering into law school and I heard it would not be that difficult to find a job in IP market that's why I choose IP practice.
I really want to know why you think entering into law school with a determination to IP work is extremely unwise and why it would be better for international students to do IP transaction work? And if possible, can you recommend other areas suited for science students?
I also find it is so competitive in US and I am thinking about whether I should go back to Hong Kong to practice law. At least, life will be easier.
Thanks for your advise and I would improve my English as much as I can.
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2015 10:55 pm
by BigZuck
Anonymous User wrote:rpupkin wrote:NapoleonXV wrote:I do not know about IP practice in China specifically, but judging by your post, you definitely need to improve your writing skills and English abilities to become more employable.
poetic justice. I've seen over five similar comments that are useless and hurtful to the extreme, with the same rationale every single time (precision is important, etc, etc, etc, i mean this is a forum, pathetic shiz).
OP you need to work on your grades since that is the prerequisite thing;
-Make connections right now, but make sure the first conversation with any alum to be more so about their career, before you have your grades there is not much career to be discussed with you, you want to make people like you through that kind of connections.
-Go to ABA IP fair. EVERY SINGLE ONE
-keep your options open, who said people with science background can only do IP? personally I think entering into law school with a determination to IP work is extremely unwise. Unless you have a PHD in rock hard science, IP might make your life harder and jobless.
for IP transaction or litigation, i think international students are better suited for IP transactions, which some firms might not require a science background, but a science background definitely helps. NY and Boston are two big east coast IP market, especially Boston. (rish, coole, foley lardner. etc.) But GULC is definitely not as competitive in boston as in DC.
edit: I'm from Canada with a soft science background(bio-chem). hope this helps. and probably work on writing precision ASAP as well. there are work check software.
There are work check software? That's a joke, right?
How is telling someone that their English needs to improve in order to work at a big American firm "useless and hurtful to the extreme"?
Re: Question about working in London or China on IP law
Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:07 am
by RedGiant
xiaofashix86 wrote:Hello everyone.
I am a Chinese and I am a 0L student at GULC. Recently I am considering working in London or China after finish my law degree. And I would like to practice Intellectual property law only in Big Law.
My question is will their London office or Asia office hire JD students working in IP field? I did some research but barely find any JD students in some IP giants' London offices (covington, Cooley, Arnold Porter etc), though some Asia offices have. JD students normally work in MA or capital market in these two places.What about Magic Circle London HQ ? IF they did, what’s the package? Thank you so much!
You might want to post this question to the forums at RollOnFriday which is a UK website that's a cross between TLS and abovethelaw. I would caution you to think that there's a lot of international IP in London at US-based firms. I worked as a paralegal at Cravath in London, and nearly every other super-top-tier firm in London did capital markets (often high yield debt) and advised European clients on U.S. corporate law issues. There may be firms that do more lit, but cap markets was the norm. If you're not finding people on websites, that means that there's not a big presence for that type of law in that firm in that office.