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http://www.breakingviews.com/cravaths-$ ... 97.article

interesting to have some insight into what they are billing me out at over the summer.

Articles like this pop up pretty regularly from Bankruptcy filings - it's great voyeurism into fees. People love counting lawyers charging over $1k per hour.

A little surprised Cravath put summers on a bill they knew would be public. For some matters summers do get billed to clients because they do work that isn't done by anyone else, so it kind-of sort-of makes sense, but they had to know this was going to fall under public scrutiny...

friend summering at CSM says it's standard for them to bill clients for SA work.

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I'm a summer at a small boutique in a secondary market, and my firm bills me at 140 an hour. Who's to say if that actually ends up on the client bill, but I know if I was a client I wouldn't pay it. Especially since it takes me as a summer like 2x as long to do stuff cause im lost as fuck.

Summers are useless. I'd rather get billed a paralegal's time cause I know that's real work being done. If I got a bill with summer's time in it I'm calling the partner to bitch.

We have our summers enter time but their time is always written off before the bill goes to the client. always assumed this was SOP at most biglaw firms

The bill will never reach the client with summer hours included unless it's such a huge deal that the budget floodgates have opened completely. So it really doesn't matter what the stated rate is.

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Desert Fox wrote:

jbagelboy wrote:The bill will never reach the client with summer hours included unless it's such a huge deal that the budget floodgates have opened. So it really doesn't matter what the stated rate is.

Though I've heard that firms like CSM essentially only take cases that not only open the floodgates but bomb the levys. Dunno how much of that is flame.

Maybe true for litigation (doubtful though), but definitely flame for corporate. They take what they can get - same as any other firm. Firms only turn down deals if there's a conflict or if they lack expertise in the subject matter. More and more deals are getting legal fee caps.

Anonymous User wrote:I'm a summer at a small boutique in a secondary market, and my firm bills me at 140 an hour. Who's to say if that actually ends up on the client bill, but I know if I was a client I wouldn't pay it. Especially since it takes me as a summer like 2x as long to do stuff cause im lost as fuck.

which is why you're billed at less than half of what they cost... it's not like clients expect lawyers to spend 100% of their time doing pure intellectual shit

why does some dude in law school think he can authoritatively speak to how summers are billed?

Not at CSM, but I know that summers are included on budgets at my firm. No idea if it ends up billed or not, but some things are pitched as having summers work on them. Similarly, some clients refuse to have summers staffed on matters, billable or not.

My firm has rates on the intranet, but I'm nearly positive, based on conversations, it never goes to the client.

Cravath summer here - I'm fairly certain that we get billed out to clients. I've also heard that there has never been a summer class that has not been profitable to the firm over the summer. Maybe it's not true. I've also traveled with the firm, and regularly worked nights/weekends on matters. I'd say this is common, in corp at least.

I'm trying to think of something less valuable to a client than a summer associate working on their file... Yep, I've got nothing. The idea that a client would pay $295 an hour for a summer associate (i.e. someone who knows less than even a really lousy paralegal) is sort of disturbing.

I'm an SA and had a partner call me and ask me to make sure all my hours were entered for a matter because she was putting together a request for attorney's fees.

yeah because people who have been googling shit their whole life can't navigate westlaw. i dont see why summers would be that bad at research. i was prolly better at researching in law school than i am now since i did it a lot then and do it never now.

JohannDeMann wrote:yeah because people who have been googling shit their whole life can't navigate westlaw. i dont see why summers would be that bad at research. i was prolly better at researching in law school than i am now since i did it a lot then and do it never now.

Trolling Westlaw blindly takes time. Not knowing the basics of what you're doing also takes time. That time is billed to the client. You would be shocked at the number of young attorneys I encounter with no understanding of how to properly work Westlaw and conduct solid research. Its disturbing. I stand by my position -- there is no summer associate worth $295 an hour.

reasonable_man wrote:I stand by my position -- there is no summer associate worth $295 an hour.

What's your position on first years being billed at $450 an hour?

If you are able to bill, you are gonna bill at least $250+

Regardless of if you are Cravath or any other big NY firm

I wouldn't be surprised if support staff doing work that could be billed would be at similar if not higher rates

I know $295/hr sounds like a lot of money but just think about how much investment banks are making per deal. Just google M&A advisory fees and calculate how many hours that your whole group would have to bill to even match half of that. If anything we should be laughing at law firms for charging so little.

sinfiery wrote:If you are able to bill, you are gonna bill at least $250+

Regardless of if you are Cravath or any other big NY firm

I wouldn't be surprised if support staff doing work that could be billed would be at similar if not higher rates

DPW legal assistants bill for $100-300 easy. http://cases.gcginc.com/mst/467_10244.pdf

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