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I know that this topic has been discussed at length on the boards, but I've also heard rumors that 3L OCI is starting earlier this year than in previous years. When is the preferred time to begin submitting applications? I thought that conventional wisdom was to wait until after you have an offer decision from whichever firm you're summering at, but some have stated otherwise.

Our OCS said the same thing. I've heard from other people that reaching out to firms too early might be a red flag for them because it comes off as if you got no-offered or you're trying to jump ship before receiving an offer because something happened or something. But could be wrong? Lots of confusion here as well.

Anonymous User wrote:Our OCS said the same thing. I've heard from other people that reaching out to firms too early might be a red flag for them because it comes off as if you got no-offered or you're trying to jump ship before receiving an offer because something happened or something. But could be wrong? Lots of confusion here as well.

Thinking I will wait until mid-July perhaps.

Recent Grad who did 3L OCI:

I don't know who said wait until you have an offer in hand, but I don't think that's necessary. I would mail in mid-July and let firms know the dates you'll be in the area. Follow up again when you're 1 week out with those you haven't heard back from.

Most of the firms that hire 3Ls are 100% offer firms and I don't think they find it strange that you would mail while still working as a summer.

I was still interviewing and finding about CBs/offers in October and November. I'm skeptical that career services has a lot of insight or experience in this area.

Anonymous User wrote:Recent Grad who did 3L OCI:

I don't know who said wait until you have an offer in hand, but I don't think that's necessary. I would mail in mid-July and let firms know the dates you'll be in the area. Follow up again when you're 1 week out with those you haven't heard back from.

Most of the firms that hire 3Ls are 100% offer firms and I don't think they find it strange that you would mail while still working as a summer.

I was still interviewing and finding about CBs/offers in October and November. I'm skeptical that career services has a lot of insight or experience in this area.

Also a recent grad who did 3L recruiting. I would echo this 100%. I applied in late-July and some places told me it was a little early and that they'd reach out in a couple weeks. A few interviewed me immediately while I was still summering. Pretty much all wanted to know if I got an offer before they made me an offer but it wasn't a hang up at all. Also don't just apply to firms doing OCI. Apply to any firm you'd be interested in interviewing for. At least one firm I got a CB from never advertised that they were hiring 3Ls.

oblig.lawl.ref wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:Recent Grad who did 3L OCI:

I don't know who said wait until you have an offer in hand, but I don't think that's necessary. I would mail in mid-July and let firms know the dates you'll be in the area. Follow up again when you're 1 week out with those you haven't heard back from.

Most of the firms that hire 3Ls are 100% offer firms and I don't think they find it strange that you would mail while still working as a summer.

I was still interviewing and finding about CBs/offers in October and November. I'm skeptical that career services has a lot of insight or experience in this area.

Also a recent grad who did 3L recruiting. I would echo this 100%. I applied in late-July and some places told me it was a little early and that they'd reach out in a couple weeks. A few interviewed me immediately while I was still summering. Pretty much all wanted to know if I got an offer before they made me an offer but it wasn't a hang up at all. Also don't just apply to firms doing OCI. Apply to any firm you'd be interested in interviewing for. At least one firm I got a CB from never advertised that they were hiring 3Ls.

Did you apply using the firm's online application portals?

Anonymous User wrote:
Did you apply using the firm's online application portals?

First anon responding - Yeah, for places like Weil where it seems like they strongly prefer that. I would still follow up via email to recruiting.

As a clarification, I would probably use a more aggressive strategy if you don't have top grades. For those with great grades, if you want NY or whatever, book a 3- or 4-day trip there. You will absolutely get interviews, especially if you're fine with just general corp or general lit.

For those not in that position, I would try and work more qualitative angles like reaching out to alums at the firm or seeing if career services can help you get your foot in the door.

To echo the person above: Strongly agree, don't worry if the firm doesn't advertise that it's looking for 3Ls. Again, at least 90% of this hiring happens at V20 firms, and I can basically guarantee that every single one of the V20 is hiring 3Ls for the NY office (and main office if not NY).

anyone who didn't do a SA have any advice to offer on this subject?

General question. What do say about your 2L summer firm in the cover letter. I'm at a firm doing litigation but I really wanted corporate, I just got stuck at a smaller firm where this is what they do. Should I say something along the lines of I got great litigation experience but am interested in corporate which is why I'm applying to XYZ firm. Any advice is appreciated.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:
Did you apply using the firm's online application portals?

First anon responding - Yeah, for places like Weil where it seems like they strongly prefer that. I would still follow up via email to recruiting.

As a clarification, I would probably use a more aggressive strategy if you don't have top grades. For those with great grades, if you want NY or whatever, book a 3- or 4-day trip there. You will absolutely get interviews, especially if you're fine with just general corp or general lit.

For those not in that position, I would try and work more qualitative angles like reaching out to alums at the firm or seeing if career services can help you get your foot in the door.

To echo the person above: Strongly agree, don't worry if the firm doesn't advertise that it's looking for 3Ls. Again, at least 90% of this hiring happens at V20 firms, and I can basically guarantee that every single one of the V20 is hiring 3Ls for the NY office (and main office if not NY).

Many thanks for this. Two additional questions:
1. Is it credited to wait until after the July 4 holiday weekend to start sending in applications? Or am I already behind in that regard? I've been reaching out to recruiters for informational interviews and have had a couple of bites. I'm going up to Manhattan in a few weeks for a screener at one firm.

2. Since I've sent emails asking for informational interviews at all of the firms to which I intend to apply, is it overkill to now send in a separate application to the recruiter, with a cover letter, transcripts, and resume? The informational requests included both my transcript and resume. Or should I use the online application system?

Have callback with V5 next week. But they gave me an offer before during 2L OCI. Meeting two more V5s in early August, didn't bid on these two during 2L OCI at all so this is my first time talking to them. Fwiw my career office told me to wait until late August or early September to reach out to any firms.

ETA: just emailed them in June after my 2L grades came out. Didn't say where I was summering when I emailed them.

Is all the advice here so far (can start applying now even before getting an offer from 2L SA, apply even if nothing is officially advertised) NYC-specific? DC 2L SA here interested mostly in other DC firms. Currently at a 100% offer firm.

Anonymous User wrote:Have callback with V5 next week. But they gave me an offer before during 2L OCI. Meeting two more V5s in early August, didn't bid on these two during 2L OCI at all so this is my first time talking to them. Fwiw my career office told me to wait until late August or early September to reach out to any firms.

ETA: just emailed them in June after my 2L grades came out. Didn't say where I was summering when I emailed them.

What did you say in your email?

Just said I'm a rising 3L at CCN and I'm summering at a firm in [City] but that I wanna switch to NYC. Didn't attach any materials. Just wanted to get a sense for their timeline.

I think what I'm worried about most is the possibility that reaching out to other firms would get back to the firm I'm currently summering at and jeopardize something. Are my worries rational, and if so is there anything I can do to really limit the chance that could happen?

I do know someone last year who interviewed with a firm that then called the firm he summered with to see if he had received an offer. His SA firm wasn't exactly thrilled to receive that phone call. However, this was well after people would have heard about offers, so I kind of doubt it would've happened while summer programs were still in progress?

Just a rising 3L myself, but I've heard firms only do that when they are prepared to extend an offer, so you should be okay.

So when is everyone planning on starting their applications? Middle of July?

Anonymous User wrote:So when is everyone planning on starting their applications? Middle of July?

I was thinking last week of July, but the above posts have me rethinking. Maybe I'll start earlier and do some A/B testing.

Anonymous User wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:So when is everyone planning on starting their applications? Middle of July?

I was thinking last week of July, but the above posts have me rethinking. Maybe I'll start earlier and do some A/B testing.

Several in my career office have said the 2nd to last week in July. Otherwise, they said that applications will get lost in the midst of the firms planning for 2L OCI.

Not really timeline related, but friend who is an SA at Weil told me they're planning on doing a fair amount of hiring through 3L OCI, litigation and corp.

Anonymous User wrote:Have callback with V5 next week. But they gave me an offer before during 2L OCI. Meeting two more V5s in early August, didn't bid on these two during 2L OCI at all so this is my first time talking to them. Fwiw my career office told me to wait until late August or early September to reach out to any firms.

ETA: just emailed them in June after my 2L grades came out. Didn't say where I was summering when I emailed them.

Have you thought about NALP rules regarding accepting an offer? If I remember correctly, you only have about a month to accept an offer with a firm you weren't previously with, whereas October 1st is deadline for your 2L SA. If you get an offer shortly after your interview next week (which is plausible given quick nyc turnaround), you may be in a pickle.

Anon from above. I figured that they wouldn't actually give me an offer until I got an offer from my summer firm. But CSM is the only firm I'd maybe consider over this one and I don't mind accepting this one and leaving csm and other firms on the table if the timing forces me to

Anonymous User wrote:Anon from above. I figured that they wouldn't actually give me an offer until I got an offer from my summer firm. But CSM is the only firm I'd maybe consider over this one and I don't mind accepting this one and leaving csm and other firms on the table if the timing forces me to

How did you go about contacting the firm you had an offer at previously but declined? I'm in sort of a similar situation, but had an offer from this firm in a different market and am now interested in their NY office. Advice?

Ummm I just emailed the hiring partner that emailed me when I declined my offer and just asked if I could reapply for an associate position because my circumstances had changed etc.. Someone from recruiting called me within a few hours to ask why I wanted to switch and told me to send them my grades as soon as I had them. Grades came out early June and they got back to me a few days ago with cb invitation. I dunno I didn't say anything elaborate or lengthy.