Quinn basically just not doing summers any more Forum

[trebekismyhero]

I'm not saying this move will make it easier for just anyone to get a biglaw job. I'm saying the whole SA thing has basically created a caste system. If you don't go down the biglaw route you are basically confined to a lesser career track for ever. I just want to see the profession open up more. This is heading in the right direction.

Thank god lawyers are finally making less money! You're dumb for assuming the caste system starts at Biglaw SA instead of T14.

^Truth

[minnbills]

I'm not saying this move will make it easier for just anyone to get a biglaw job. I'm saying the whole SA thing has basically created a caste system. If you don't go down the biglaw route you are basically confined to a lesser career track for ever. I just want to see the profession open up more. This is heading in the right direction.

Thank god lawyers are finally making less money! You're dumb for assuming the caste system starts at Biglaw SA instead of T14.

No, it starts after 1L, regardless of where you went to school.

[runinthefront]

I'm not saying this move will make it easier for just anyone to get a biglaw job. I'm saying the whole SA thing has basically created a caste system. If you don't go down the biglaw route you are basically confined to a lesser career track for ever. I just want to see the profession open up more. This is heading in the right direction.

Thank god lawyers are finally making less money! You're dumb for assuming the caste system starts at Biglaw SA instead of T14.

No, it starts after 1L, regardless of where you went to school.

I mean, at the latest, it starts as soon as you matriculate into school. There's a hierarchy that both firms and "prestigious" judges when they even conduct hiring for 1L summers. Why blame them for doing (what I'll admit is a rather crude form of) quality control? I just don't see how taking away SA positions thwart this.

[Elston Gunn]

Quinn is just going to hire people who did SAs at other firms. I don't understand how this is supposed to end the have/have nots thing that happens after OCI.

[dwyf]

Quinn is just going to hire people who did SAs at other firms. I don't understand how this is supposed to end the have/have nots thing that happens after OCI.

The only argument I see for it is that it will increase the number of spots open to 3Ls, whether they had a 2L SA or not. I'm guess that many people who go to Quinn after 3L will have had an SA, but that conceivably encourages the firms that lost summers to then engage in 3L hiring to fill the hole, etc etc. It's a not a huge boon to 3Ls who didn't get an SA, but every little bit helps.

I've never understood why there isn't more 3L hiring from big firms. Who wouldn't want to see four or six semesters of grades instead of two? Plus, you'll have a better sense of your staffing needs.

[trebekismyhero]

Quinn is just going to hire people who did SAs at other firms. I don't understand how this is supposed to end the have/have nots thing that happens after OCI.

The only argument I see for it is that it will increase the number of spots open to 3Ls, whether they had a 2L SA or not. I'm guess that many people who go to Quinn after 3L will have had an SA, but that conceivably encourages the firms that lost summers to then engage in 3L hiring to fill the hole, etc etc. It's a not a huge boon to 3Ls who didn't get an SA, but every little bit helps.

I've never understood why there isn't more 3L hiring from big firms. Who wouldn't want to see four or six semesters of grades instead of two? Plus, you'll have a better sense of your staffing needs.

I think a lot of it comes from the fact that it is a lot easier to compare students when they are all taking the same classes.

Plus as others have mentioned, while SA work is not that useful, getting to know the people at the firm and how the firm operates is rather useful.

[Arad]

but as someone who didn't make that cut, I could seriously give a fuck if some NYU 2L doesn't get free lunch every day and 30k in the bank for doing jack shit.

lol

[itbdvorm]

People were knocking down their doors the past several years despite working lots of their associates 2400+. Why would they care if the summer program goes away? As long as law students pick firms based on their Vault ranking instead of the overall law firm picture, this shit is going to happen. Plenty of people that summer at V50s are going to apply to QE 3L year. Plenty of clerks are going to apply to QE. They will have no problem getting top talent because law students dont care at all about making law firms pony up. If you are jobless, then I guess go work at QE, but law students are basically doing a disservice to the legal field working at QE.

My reaction exactly.

As far as I know, despite the "wear flip-flops brah!" attitude, working as a junior at Quinn is absolutely beyond miserable. But of course they are PRESTIGIOUS. So lots of people want to work there anyway for some reason (the number of "Quinn vs. TOPFIRM X" threads here as evidence).

This way, Quinn gets to save ~45*60K (assuming summer program actually costs all-in 2x salary) = ~$2.7 million with little marginal harm to their associate class size

They will hire 5 superstars to be the golden children, a couple of top clerks and a boatload of expendables.

[Desert Fox]

fobstory.jpeg

[First Offense]

Why are you guys are so sure that this won't impact their recruiting ability?

Poaching 3L's and clerks will be harder than recruiting 2Ls. Sure they'll fill a class, but with less "desirable" recruits. Which is probably NBD, but it goes against their striving to recruit more elite students.

Also - their earlier hiring schedule relative to most firms gave them first pick of some people that just wanted to avoid it all together. Now the people they're going to try to hire have spent at least a summer, if not a summer + time clerking getting to know about the profession as a whole. Any time spent in that situation will lead any reasonable person to the conclusion that Quinn is shit.

[Chrstgtr]

How do you think this will affect hiring overall? If lit does not pick up again this year the 60 SA litigation spots will not be an insignificant subtraction from the total number of "elite" litigation SA gigs.

[JusticeJackson]

.

[Anonymous User]

Why are you guys are so sure that this won't impact their recruiting ability?

Poaching 3L's and clerks will be harder than recruiting 2Ls. Sure they'll fill a class, but with less "desirable" recruits. Which is probably NBD, but it goes against their striving to recruit more elite students.

I think this post assumes that Quinn needs to recruit. I take this move as a sign that they're overstaffed.

Quinn Chicago is dead as a doornail.

[Chrstgtr]

Why are you guys are so sure that this won't impact their recruiting ability?

Poaching 3L's and clerks will be harder than recruiting 2Ls. Sure they'll fill a class, but with less "desirable" recruits. Which is probably NBD, but it goes against their striving to recruit more elite students.

I think this post assumes that Quinn needs to recruit. I take this move as a sign that they're overstaffed.

Other recent stories about Quinn fit this narrative as well.

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/work-dri ... fun-stuff/

[Anonymous User]

Anecdotally, NY and SF are very, very busy still.

Chicago has always been slower.

[TheColonel]

For what its worth, I believe Patterson Belknap started doing this a couple years ago. Not quite the same level as Quinn, but I've heard anecdotally that they're a great firm (interesting work, well-respected, and as close as NYC gets to a lifestyle firm).

[dixiecupdrinking]

This is hopelessly anecdotal, but I have encountered a number of Quinn associates who have lateralled elsewhere and none who have lateralled to Quinn (nor can I imagine what kind of person would spend a year or two in big law and think "I'd like to go somewhere else's where I can work even more hours for worse bosses for the same money and with less administrative support").

I dissent.

[Desert Fox]

fobstory.jpeg

[lavarman84]

I'm not saying this move will make it easier for just anyone to get a biglaw job. I'm saying the whole SA thing has basically created a caste system. If you don't go down the biglaw route you are basically confined to a lesser career track for ever. I just want to see the profession open up more. This is heading in the right direction.

A different career track does not necessarily mean lesser.

[Desert Fox]

fobstory.jpeg

[MCFC]

http://www.therecorder.com/id=120273116 ... 0602194025

Strategy seems to involve saying "best litigation firm in the world" a lot.

[Anonymous User]

in general the whole SA program is kind of dumb. it's expensive for firms, and cuts into money that could be used for salaries and pro bomo causes. it's a lot of fun for summers but the stress of trying to get an offer makes every activity less fun than it would be if done at associate orientation.

i'm sure it's useful in knowing if someone can produce consistently good work product and can fit into the office, but changing the interviewing system could accomplish this much quicker and cheaper. i think the quinn system makes more sense, but if you're only recruiting summers that were unhappy at another firm you may have an incoming class that consists predominately of people likelier to be disgruntled at any firm.

[rpupkin]

in general the whole SA program is kind of dumb. it's expensive for firms, and cuts into money that could be used for salaries and pro bomo causes. it's a lot of fun for summers but the stress of trying to get an offer makes every activity less fun than it would be if done at associate orientation.

i'm sure it's useful in knowing if someone can produce consistently good work product and can fit into the office, but changing the interviewing system could accomplish this much quicker and cheaper. i think the quinn system makes more sense, but if you're only recruiting summers that were unhappy at another firm you may have an incoming class that consists predominately of people likelier to be disgruntled at any firm.

Combination of lack of capitalization, typos, and anon strongly suggests that author is a QE lackey.

[84651846190]

doesnt quinn hire like 100 laterals a year

...and fire about the same number every year

[Anonymous User]

For a $30k signing bonus, I would consider taking my T14 3.9 and my 2L summer at a V10 and jumping ship to Quinn. I assume they know I'm not alone...