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New position isn't set in stone yet. I'm just forward thinking a bit. But you make a good point.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
When you lateral, you fill out a background form with contact info for a reference at your current employer. On the two laterals that I've made, I've been able to ask them to hold off on contacting my current employer until I've given notice. You'll of course already have an offer in hand, which is contingent on passing your background and conflicts check.Anonymous User wrote:At what point does the new place start putting in calls to references to make sure you aren't a loser? I would like to think its once you already have the offer in hand. And I'm assuming it makes sense to preempt those reference calls by informing people in advance? Wouldn't want that call coming out of nowhere to a partner who is counting on me.
never really heard of this. In my experience, firms don't contact the employer to ask about the lateral candidates. they usually will do a background check and call your references but that's about itBiglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
I know at least some firms do it. It makes sense to me. You would at least want to confirm the guy isn't about to be fired for cause for downloading kiddie porn at work or something like that.gk101 wrote:never really heard of this. In my experience, firms don't contact the employer to ask about the lateral candidates. they usually will do a background check and call your references but that's about itBiglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
That's nice. I overheard my recruiting coordinator verifying employment of one of our lateral candidates a few weeks ago, so I know at least my firm does it. I guess your big NYC firm is just a caring, compassionate place (since that's what big NYC firms are known for, of course).Anonymous User wrote:This is terrible and wildly inaccurate advice. We (a big NYC firm) NEVER call a candidate's current employer because we're not total assholes and understand that folks don't want to be outed as shopping for a new gig.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
Or you're full of shit. What I'm describing is such entrenched NY practice that it makes me question whether you are what you claim to be.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:That's nice. I overheard my recruiting coordinator verifying employment of one of our lateral candidates a few weeks ago, so I know at least my firm does it. I guess your big NYC firm is just a caring, compassionate place (since that's what big NYC firms are known for, of course).Anonymous User wrote:This is terrible and wildly inaccurate advice. We (a big NYC firm) NEVER call a candidate's current employer because we're not total assholes and understand that folks don't want to be outed as shopping for a new gig.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
...and what is it that I claim to be?Anonymous User wrote:Or you're full of shit. What I'm describing is such entrenched NY practice that it makes me question whether you are what you claim to be.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:That's nice. I overheard my recruiting coordinator verifying employment of one of our lateral candidates a few weeks ago, so I know at least my firm does it. I guess your big NYC firm is just a caring, compassionate place (since that's what big NYC firms are known for, of course).Anonymous User wrote:This is terrible and wildly inaccurate advice. We (a big NYC firm) NEVER call a candidate's current employer because we're not total assholes and understand that folks don't want to be outed as shopping for a new gig.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
You overheard your recruiting coordinator verifying employment? Are you next door or something? This is just bizarre to me.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:That's nice. I overheard my recruiting coordinator verifying employment of one of our lateral candidates a few weeks ago, so I know at least my firm does it. I guess your big NYC firm is just a caring, compassionate place (since that's what big NYC firms are known for, of course).Anonymous User wrote:This is terrible and wildly inaccurate advice. We (a big NYC firm) NEVER call a candidate's current employer because we're not total assholes and understand that folks don't want to be outed as shopping for a new gig.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
It's obvious bullshit. No one who had worked in biglaw for more than a couple of years would even lie that way, since if you've had friends go through the lateralling process you generally learn how it goes. It benefits no firm to have a reputation as a place where if you sniff around an offer, they'll ice you at your current employer. No one would interview.glitched wrote:You overheard your recruiting coordinator verifying employment? Are you next door or something? This is just bizarre to me.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:That's nice. I overheard my recruiting coordinator verifying employment of one of our lateral candidates a few weeks ago, so I know at least my firm does it. I guess your big NYC firm is just a caring, compassionate place (since that's what big NYC firms are known for, of course).Anonymous User wrote:This is terrible and wildly inaccurate advice. We (a big NYC firm) NEVER call a candidate's current employer because we're not total assholes and understand that folks don't want to be outed as shopping for a new gig.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:If the place you're going to has any sense, it will have already contacted folks you worked with to make sure you're not some loser. So, in all likelihood, your current employer probably already knows you're leaving (or at least attempting to leave).
Yeah, it might have been after offer acceptance. I hadn't thought about that, but it freaked me out enough that I'm not just going to trust that these big, friendly biglaw firms aren't screwing associates over behind their backs. Have we all forgotten the Great Lathaming?A. Nony Mouse wrote:At what stage was the verification? I can see a firm calling after an offer has been extended and/or accepted, but during the interview process seems less likely. Or could it have been verification of a previous job, but not the current job?
Or different firms have different policies, of course.
I mean, I know it's against the law in many states (like California) to say bad stuff about former employees, but it's 100% legal to ask whether someone 1) is currently working somewhere and 2) if not, whether or not the employer would take the employee back.romothesavior wrote:There is no way firms call the current employer about a potential lateral without express permission. No way.
Anonymous User wrote:It's obvious bullshit. No one who had worked in biglaw for more than a couple of years would even lie that way, since if you've had friends go through the lateralling process you generally learn how it goes. It benefits no firm to have a reputation as a place where if you sniff around an offer, they'll ice you at your current employer. No one would interview.
I've heard of unscrupulous cold-call type recruiters snitching on their clients, but never other firms. It simply does not happen, and purported V20 associate is either not being truthful or is just astonishingly clueless / not as involved in recruiting as he makes himself out to be.
Yeah, a previous employer, not their current employer. No way in hell a major law firm would screw over a potential applicant like that. Looks like you got a little confused as to what was going on in that call, dude.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:I mean, I know it's against the law in many states (like California) to say bad stuff about former employees, but it's 100% legal to ask whether someone 1) is currently working somewhere and 2) if not, whether or not the employer would take the employee back.romothesavior wrote:There is no way firms call the current employer about a potential lateral without express permission. No way.
Eh, there's no proof one way or another as to what was going on, and I'm cynical enough not to just blindly accept all the bullshit "best practices" that firms are supposedly STRICTLY adhering to. There are benefits to asking former employers about former employees, which is why almost every other field of employment requires references.romothesavior wrote:Yeah, a previous employer, not their current employer. No way in hell a major law firm would screw over a potential applicant like that. Looks like you got a little confused as to what was going on in that call, dude.Biglaw_Associate_V20 wrote:I mean, I know it's against the law in many states (like California) to say bad stuff about former employees, but it's 100% legal to ask whether someone 1) is currently working somewhere and 2) if not, whether or not the employer would take the employee back.romothesavior wrote:There is no way firms call the current employer about a potential lateral without express permission. No way.