Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:29 am
3rd year CA. Shoot.
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Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:59 am
Are you billing this?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:09 am
No, but I could probably get away with something non-billable, either recruitment or attorney networking. Nobody curr about non-billable time though so why botherCounselorNebby wrote:Are you billing this?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:13 am
Have you begun exploring exit options?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:20 am
whenever i see a "so excited i got a cool project!!" post it's followed immediately by "that's adorable, it wears off." is that consistent with your experience? when was the last time you were excited about work and what was it? have you ever been excited to even a slight degree by non-legal work, like marketing or whatever?
what is the best taco place for lunch near your office or a courtroom you frequent?
what is the best taco place for lunch near your office or a courtroom you frequent?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:23 am
Not in any meaningful way, no. I glance at recruiter spam like anyone else, but since I am in lit my exit option is pretty much just lit somewhere else, and I like my firm so I don't see the point. I guess I could do government work, but my resume isn't strong enough for AUSA and I don't want to be a county prosecutor.CounselorNebby wrote:Have you begun exploring exit options?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:25 am
I don't know that it wears off for me. I like research and I like motion practice for the most part. The thing I get sick of is discovery, anyone who says they're excited about a motion to compel or a privilege log needs to cut down on their adderall intake.sprezz wrote:whenever i see a "so excited i got a cool project!!" post it's followed immediately by "that's adorable, it wears off." is that consistent with your experience? when was the last time you were excited about work and what was it? have you ever been excited to even a slight degree by non-legal work, like marketing or whatever?
what is the best taco place for lunch near your office or a courtroom you frequent?
Best taco place would out my location but there are tons and they're all amazing. I live in the land of drive thru tacquerias.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:40 am
was going to ask why CA, but this satisfactorily covers thatI live in the land of drive thru tacquerias.
i know tcr for a 0L/1L/2L/3L choosing between firms is always "zero percent," but how would you handicap your odds for (junior, if applicable) partnership? are we up to 5% yet? if so congrats!
what are your top outside work priorities that impact how you stagger your work schedule, and what sacrifices do you make to fit those things in? e.g. log in late to be there for dinner with SO/kiddos, stay late when you accidentally TLS, bill extra saturday hours to clear sunday morning for face paint/costume necessary to attend raiders games...
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 12:04 pm
Would you ever go vegan?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 12:14 pm
My firm has a shorter partnership track than most, so I've been told that my chances look pretty good, but obviously we're all one mistake away from that being a thing of the past so who knows.sprezz wrote:was going to ask why CA, but this satisfactorily covers thatI live in the land of drive thru tacquerias.
i know tcr for a 0L/1L/2L/3L choosing between firms is always "zero percent," but how would you handicap your odds for (junior, if applicable) partnership? are we up to 5% yet? if so congrats!
what are your top outside work priorities that impact how you stagger your work schedule, and what sacrifices do you make to fit those things in? e.g. log in late to be there for dinner with SO/kiddos, stay late when you accidentally TLS, bill extra saturday hours to clear sunday morning for face paint/costume necessary to attend raiders games...
I don't have any kids, so my top outside work priorities are mainly just the gym, fishing, reading, hanging out with my buddies, etc. and that can get fit in whenever.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 12:39 pm
How many fires do you put out a day? Is "oh my god, this has to filed by midnight, where are the exhibits" a regular occurrence?
When you write a motion/brief, are you generally confident that you didn't miss any huge issues/cases? Or do you sometimes read an objection/reply brief and think "Oh shit."
When you write a motion/brief, are you generally confident that you didn't miss any huge issues/cases? Or do you sometimes read an objection/reply brief and think "Oh shit."
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 12:51 pm
Unless I've blown it somehow (forgetting someone needed something by tomorrow) the firefighting is pretty minimal. I am working on one big case where opposing counsel files a ton of ex parte stuff, so I am often told "Hey, surprise, you're doing an opposition tonight" but that is sorta fun sometimes. Generally speaking the nice thing about litigation is that the deadlines are all set by the CCP, so it's not as though anything should be a surprise. I get the sense that the biggest fire drills are all in transactional work.banjo wrote:How many fires do you put out a day? Is "oh my god, this has to filed by midnight, where are the exhibits" a regular occurrence?
When you write a motion/brief, are you generally confident that you didn't miss any huge issues/cases? Or do you sometimes read an objection/reply brief and think "Oh shit."
I'm usually pretty confident in my research, so I don't worry too much about missing a big issue. Obviously missing a neat case is always a possibility though I try to make sure it doesn't happen. If we get ambushed with something in an opposition, it can always be dealt with in reply. Generally if it's an out of nowhere issue, it's because they're grabbing at straws.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:13 pm
what are your thoughts on the value of federal or state supreme court clerkships to lawyers as far as career benefits go? i hear people say clerking provides very good mentorship, is beneficial for networking, etc., but do you think it's really worth the forgone income and shorter life in biglaw?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:17 pm
Is litigator. Marking thread. May or may not answer questions.
Also, here:
Also, here:
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:19 pm
Lol I don't go to courtsprezz wrote:whenever i see a "so excited i got a cool project!!" post it's followed immediately by "that's adorable, it wears off." is that consistent with your experience? when was the last time you were excited about work and what was it? have you ever been excited to even a slight degree by non-legal work, like marketing or whatever?
what is the best taco place for lunch near your office or a courtroom you frequent?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:19 pm
I was a federal clerk and thought it was extremely valuable, because I now practice frequently in that district, know the preferences of the various judges, know the local rules like the back of my hand, etc. More generally, I think it's useful because it allows you to see all manner of litigators up close and personal for a year, so you can kinda tell what is effective and what isn't. I also think that having seen so many terrible jokes of attorneys practicing in court, you become a whole lot less nervous as a young attorney on your first few law and motion hearings. You come to realize there's no grand magic to the whole thing, you just stand up and explain your motion for a few minutes.danmiller4545 wrote:what are your thoughts on the value of federal or state supreme court clerkships to lawyers as far as career benefits go? i hear people say clerking provides very good mentorship, is beneficial for networking, etc., but do you think it's really worth the forgone income and shorter life in biglaw?
ETA while I have no experience with a state court clerkship because they don't have those in CA and I didn't do one, I have zero doubt it would also be valuable. I actually think a trial court clerkship might be prefereable to supreme court for the reasons I discussed above, but obviously far less so prestige wise.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:35 pm
I do!baal hadad wrote:Lol I don't go to courtsprezz wrote:whenever i see a "so excited i got a cool project!!" post it's followed immediately by "that's adorable, it wears off." is that consistent with your experience? when was the last time you were excited about work and what was it? have you ever been excited to even a slight degree by non-legal work, like marketing or whatever?
what is the best taco place for lunch near your office or a courtroom you frequent?
/doesn't like going to court
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:36 pm
Besides Prosecutor/PD/PI work, is there any way a young attorney might have the opportunity to speak in a courtroom? Or is it reserved for older partners? I'm a bit stuck on which route to pursue because I think I'd like litigation, but I want to speak and present ideas etc.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:37 pm
Given that you already noted exit options for litigators seem to be just "more litigation," do you ever think about what you would try and do if, at some point in your career, you decide you don't want to be a litigator anymore?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:44 pm
i can tell you that small firm plaintiff's work will get you in the courtroom extraordinarily quicklyAnonymous User wrote:Besides Prosecutor/PD/PI work, is there any way a young attorney might have the opportunity to speak in a courtroom? Or is it reserved for older partners? I'm a bit stuck on which route to pursue because I think I'd like litigation, but I want to speak and present ideas etc.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:48 pm
prezidentv8 wrote:Is litigator. Marking thread. May or may not answer questions.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:57 pm
If you had to choose one taco accessory to forgo forever, would it be sour cream or shredded cheese?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 2:14 pm
Sure. Most litigators I know even at big firms have done some law and motion work certainly by their second or third years. I go to court infrequently, but regularly. My 2 cents is that litigating in court is fun and all, but at the end of the day if the goal is to be really good it's worth it to redshirt for a few years if you can work directly with litigators who are really good.Anonymous User wrote:Besides Prosecutor/PD/PI work, is there any way a young attorney might have the opportunity to speak in a courtroom? Or is it reserved for older partners? I'm a bit stuck on which route to pursue because I think I'd like litigation, but I want to speak and present ideas etc.
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 2:16 pm
I think if I got really burned out with firm life I would probably just become a high school history teacher somewhere, maybe take it as an excuse to leave CA since I can't do that now without taking another bar exam. If I wanted to keep practicing law, I would probably just go solo and do consumer bankruptcy cases.Anonymous User wrote:Given that you already noted exit options for litigators seem to be just "more litigation," do you ever think about what you would try and do if, at some point in your career, you decide you don't want to be a litigator anymore?
Re: Litigators taking questions from law students
Posted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 2:32 pm
OP here. Sorry, I don't seem to understand too well; so if I want to get good at it, it's worth sitting on the sidelines for a bit to learn how it all works, and then I'm guessing lateraling somewhere where speaking and presenting ideas is more possible?Anonymous User wrote:Sure. Most litigators I know even at big firms have done some law and motion work certainly by their second or third years. I go to court infrequently, but regularly. My 2 cents is that litigating in court is fun and all, but at the end of the day if the goal is to be really good it's worth it to redshirt for a few years if you can work directly with litigators who are really good.Anonymous User wrote:Besides Prosecutor/PD/PI work, is there any way a young attorney might have the opportunity to speak in a courtroom? Or is it reserved for older partners? I'm a bit stuck on which route to pursue because I think I'd like litigation, but I want to speak and present ideas etc.