Williams & Connolly v. Kirkland et al. Forum

[Anonymous User]

Interested in trial and appellate lit.

[Anonymous User]

What school if I may ask?

[Elston Gunn]

You should explain your hesitation about taking W&C a bit more because otherwise everyone is just going to reflexively tell you to take it. It's the clear best-of-the-best place to do litigation in D.C. in most people's minds, especially compared to the other places you are considering.

The main reason people IME don't take W&C is because either they think they might want to do regulatory (or even corporate) work/aren't fully committed to litigation, or because they are worried about W&C's reputation for being a somewhat more demanding place to work.

You seem set on litigation, so the first part isn't an issue. As for hours, well, it's hard to tell, although I'm almost positive they're not going to be better at Kirkland.

The last reason could be because you're really, really set on appellate (which you don't seem to be, anyway). But even then, W&C has become strong in that area, though as I understand it, it's pretty much all down to one partner. Of your options, Jones Day stands out as the one place that probably has a stronger appellate group (maybe Sidley?), but I believe these are places where you really need to have a feeder clerkship/SCOTUS to get into the group. In that case, you may as well take W&C now, and if you do end up with those kind of credentials, you won't have trouble switching over to one of the shops with the elite appellate groups.

[Anonymous User]

IMO, TCR for what OP wants to do is as follows:
1) take W&C now
2) apply for USCA clerkships in feeder circuits
3) Summer at W&C and if offer and no clerkship, do litigation at W&C then re-apply to feeder clerkships w/ 1-2 years WE on the rez
4) If you get offer and clerkship, take the feeder clerkship and re-apply to appellate lit groups or lit boutiques after COA (or even SCOTUS if you can get one) clerkship ends.

[Elston Gunn]

IMO, TCR for what OP wants to do is as follows:
1) take W&C now
2) apply for USCA clerkships in feeder circuits
3) Summer at W&C and if offer and no clerkship, do litigation at W&C then re-apply to feeder clerkships w/ 1-2 years WE on the rez
4) If you get offer and clerkship, take the feeder clerkship and re-apply to appellate lit groups or lit boutiques after COA (or even SCOTUS if you can get one) clerkship ends.

Sure, though this basically assumes that what OP wants is to do the most selective/prestigious thing at every turn. Unless he's deadset on appellate, there's no reason he needs to gun to leave the top litigation firm in Washington just because a few other places might be marginally more selective. Same goes for only applying to feeder judges. (No idea what a "feeder circuit" is by the way, except for D.C. Cir., I guess. There are feeders in the midwest and non-feeders in NYC.)

Search for that recent litigation boutique thread--it's not like those places are dreams come true either.

[Anonymous User]

You don't get an offer at Williams and Connolly. Instead, you have to call them and ask to come back. I'd do more inquiry into whether you can go back to W&C without a clerkship. My impression is its a de facto requirement but trial court, etc would be acceptable.

[Anonymous User]

IMO, TCR for what OP wants to do is as follows:
1) take W&C now
2) apply for USCA clerkships in feeder circuits
3) Summer at W&C and if offer and no clerkship, do litigation at W&C then re-apply to feeder clerkships w/ 1-2 years WE on the rez
4) If you get offer and clerkship, take the feeder clerkship and re-apply to appellate lit groups or lit boutiques after COA (or even SCOTUS if you can get one) clerkship ends.

Sure, though this basically assumes that what OP wants is to do the most selective/prestigious thing at every turn. Unless he's deadset on appellate, there's no reason he needs to gun to leave the top litigation firm in Washington just because a few other places might be marginally more selective. Same goes for only applying to feeder judges.

Search for that recent litigation boutique thread--it's not like those places are dreams come true either.

true. i suppose my analysis hinged solely on the supposition that the OP wanted appellate lit. iirc, its exceedingly difficult to get into any respectable appellate lit group in DC w/o first having either COA or COA+SCOTUS on the resume.

In DC, even in the JD Issues & Appeals Group, the majority of associates have COA and/or SCOTUS clerkships

[Anonymous User]

You don't get an offer at Williams and Connolly. Instead, you have to call them and ask to come back. I'd do more inquiry into whether you can go back to W&C without a clerkship. My impression is its a de facto requirement but trial court, etc would be acceptable.

This isn't true, btw. They don't give out offers after the summer because based on the type of people that they tend to select (top of class at T14 interested in litigation), these people tend to go on to clerkships, but there is no requirement. I've been told by partners, associates, and summers both during the interviewing phase and outside in just conversation that while a lot of people clerk, there is no requirement whatsoever.

[Anonymous User]

It's also not quite accurate that you have to "ask to come back." SAs are told: "call when you want to come back, and we'll give you your offer then." They just don't extend offers at the end of the summer so as to avoid potential complications with judges.

[Anonymous User]

OP here. I don't want to pigeonhole myself to appellate from the start, but that's eventually what I want do. All points make sense. Thanks.

[Anonymous User]

It's also not quite accurate that you have to "ask to come back." SAs are told: "call when you want to come back, and we'll give you your offer then." They just don't extend offers at the end of the summer so as to avoid potential complications with judges.

What's your source on this info. Scared to death of accepting a potential offer from this firm on the off chance I strike out w clerkship apps.

[Anonymous User]

It's also not quite accurate that you have to "ask to come back." SAs are told: "call when you want to come back, and we'll give you your offer then." They just don't extend offers at the end of the summer so as to avoid potential complications with judges.

What's your source on this info. Scared to death of accepting a potential offer from this firm on the off chance I strike out w clerkship apps.

I have heard this from current associates, summers, and numerous people I've interviewed with.