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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:34 am
by Anonymous User
thanks for your advice
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:41 am
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote:I just got a C+ in tax, which is a problem because I want to be a tax attorney. I'm not surprised I did poorly on the exam; I just don't know what I should say to any future employers. What happened was, while I studied hard for the class, something very bad happened to me less than a week before the final. It's one of those things that, if I tell an employer, it will make them slightly uncomfortable. The school offered to reschedule my exams, but I took the exams anyway because I had to make arrangements immediately afterwards to deal with the ordeal. My grades are not normally this bad, but I'm not at the top of the class either.
Do I still have a chance to be a tax attorney? Or has that boat sailed already?
Take whatever they call the "next" tax class at your school and get an A- or better in it. Then your story is credible.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:41 am
by mephistopheles
say goodbye to those sweet, sweet days of tinkering with post-1986 tax shelters, my friend
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:18 am
by dead head
Who has exams now? Or is this "C+" the translation of a Chicago grade?
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:11 am
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote:
Take whatever they call the "next" tax class at your school and get an A- or better in it. Then your story is credible.
I can't add any classes at this point and will have to wait until next January to have another grade. What do I do tell employers during the summer?
dead head wrote:Who has exams now? Or is this "C+" the translation of a Chicago grade?
I should have clarified. This was for first semester. I didn't want to checked grades until the other thing was at least partially taken care of because it would have just made everything worse. It's been a bad couple of months, and probably this semester's grades are going to be shit too.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:40 am
by subtle
Anonymous User wrote:Anonymous User wrote:
Take whatever they call the "next" tax class at your school and get an A- or better in it. Then your story is credible.
I can't add any classes at this point and will have to wait until next January to have another grade. What do I do tell employers during the summer?
dead head wrote:Who has exams now? Or is this "C+" the translation of a Chicago grade?
I should have clarified. This was for first semester. I didn't want to checked grades until the other thing was at least partially taken care of because it would have just made everything worse. It's been a bad couple of months, and probably this semester's grades are going to be shit too.
Can you take a leave of absence? It sounds like if you've got legit stuff going on for long enough, such that it's affecting more than one set of grades, you should just take some time. Get your shit sorted.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:20 am
by dead head
subtle wrote:
Can you take a leave of absence? It sounds like if you've got legit stuff going on for long enough, such that it's affecting more than one set of grades, you should just take some time. Get your shit sorted.
Plus, if you take a leave of absence you will likely be able to do OCI again, which may or may not be of much assistance depending on how your 1L grades were and how well you sell the reasons for your leave.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:35 pm
by Anonymous User
Keep in mind, though, firms won't be that sympathetic. The 60 year old partner you interview with has likely worked through the illness and death of one or both of his parents, and there's a 50/50 chance he's also worked through a divorce. There's an expectation that as an adult and a professional, you can keep your shit together even in rough waters.
subtle wrote:Anonymous User wrote:Anonymous User wrote:
Take whatever they call the "next" tax class at your school and get an A- or better in it. Then your story is credible.
I can't add any classes at this point and will have to wait until next January to have another grade. What do I do tell employers during the summer?
dead head wrote:Who has exams now? Or is this "C+" the translation of a Chicago grade?
I should have clarified. This was for first semester. I didn't want to checked grades until the other thing was at least partially taken care of because it would have just made everything worse. It's been a bad couple of months, and probably this semester's grades are going to be shit too.
Can you take a leave of absence? It sounds like if you've got legit stuff going on for long enough, such that it's affecting more than one set of grades, you should just take some time. Get your shit sorted.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:10 pm
by NotMyRealName09
Anonymous User wrote:Keep in mind, though, firms won't be that sympathetic. The 60 year old partner you interview with has likely worked through the illness and death of one or both of his parents, and there's a 50/50 chance he's also worked through a divorce. There's an expectation that as an adult and a professional, you can keep your shit together even in rough waters.
subtle wrote:Anonymous User wrote:Anonymous User wrote:
Take whatever they call the "next" tax class at your school and get an A- or better in it. Then your story is credible.
I can't add any classes at this point and will have to wait until next January to have another grade. What do I do tell employers during the summer?
dead head wrote:Who has exams now? Or is this "C+" the translation of a Chicago grade?
I should have clarified. This was for first semester. I didn't want to checked grades until the other thing was at least partially taken care of because it would have just made everything worse. It's been a bad couple of months, and probably this semester's grades are going to be shit too.
Can you take a leave of absence? It sounds like if you've got legit stuff going on for long enough, such that it's affecting more than one set of grades, you should just take some time. Get your shit sorted.
Oof. This is harsh, but valid. You want to go into tax and a got a C+ in tax. You can explain all day, but there are hundreds of other students with As in tax. I don't know that any employer will overlook that no matter how hard you insist you are really better than that grade suggests.
My gut says high-level tax practice is out for you fresh out of law school. Who knows long term, but a c+ is bad for a highly specialized field of law full of people who aced tax all day - and who LOVE tax. A c+ does not scream "I love tax."
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:43 pm
by mr.hands
Take as many classes as you can with higher medians (medians at 3.5+). Add 1 tax class for that semester and crush it. Then you have a higher cumulative and a credible story
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:38 pm
by subtle
I think firms can and will expect you to keep your shit together in the sense that if you are going to choose to stay in school for the semester, they expect you to give it your all and do well. I don't know that they expect you not to take the time that you need to get your life in order. For me, it would be a judgment call. I, obviously, am not a hiring partner, but I would imagine it's something along those lines.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:33 pm
by Anonymous User
I don't want to say what happened, but it doesn't happen to a lot of people and even a 60 year old partner who has worked through deaths and divorce may be a little uncomfortable if I told him/her. I took my finals out of sheer stubbornness and refusal to let it get the best of me. That turned out to be a bad idea.
I won't deny taking time off would hurt my chances at biglaw. If I take time off, it's because I still have to deal with more of the aftermath, and I refuse to let my grades drop more. If stubbornness didn't save my grade in tax, it definitely won't save this semester's grades.
Anonymous User wrote:Keep in mind, though, firms won't be that sympathetic. The 60 year old partner you interview with has likely worked through the illness and death of one or both of his parents, and there's a 50/50 chance he's also worked through a divorce. There's an expectation that as an adult and a professional, you can keep your shit together even in rough waters.
subtle wrote:
Can you take a leave of absence? It sounds like if you've got legit stuff going on for long enough, such that it's affecting more than one set of grades, you should just take some time. Get your shit sorted.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:22 pm
by Gooner91
I hope you got some help for whatever happened to you. Make sure to take care of yourself.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 7:56 pm
by dead head
Anonymous User wrote:
I won't deny taking time off would hurt my chances at biglaw. If I take time off, it's because I still have to deal with more of the aftermath, and I refuse to let my grades drop more. If stubbornness didn't save my grade in tax, it definitely won't save this semester's grades.
It won't hurt your chances at biglaw, because right now you basically have zero chance. No SA and bad 2L grades isn't going to get you anything if you stay the course and try your luck at 3L OCI, especially if your grades this semester are consistent with last semester (which sounds likely). If you really want to maximize your biglaw chances (which probably won't be great even so), then an immediate leave of absence and another crack at 2L OCI is likely your best chance.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 9:50 am
by lgleye
dead head wrote:Anonymous User wrote:
I won't deny taking time off would hurt my chances at biglaw. If I take time off, it's because I still have to deal with more of the aftermath, and I refuse to let my grades drop more. If stubbornness didn't save my grade in tax, it definitely won't save this semester's grades.
It won't hurt your chances at biglaw, because right now you basically have zero chance. No SA and bad 2L grades isn't going to get you anything if you stay the course and try your luck at 3L OCI, especially if your grades this semester are consistent with last semester (which sounds likely). If you really want to maximize your biglaw chances (which probably won't be great even so), then an immediate leave of absence and another crack at 2L OCI is likely your best chance.
++1, dead-on. Immediate application for leave is your only way out because if your school grants it, agrees with your assessment that the disastrous event was a legit excuse. Right here, without divulging the nature of that event, your claim of its impact sounds hollow to us, and you are beginning to sound like a whiner. Like others have said here, shit happens to everyone........the measure of your character and employability is how you deal with it. Lastly, dead-head is right......the fact that you didn't get anything from your 2L OCI doesn't bode well for 3L OCI. Even at T14, your chances at Biglaw were near-dead long before your disastrous event.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Fri Apr 04, 2014 10:23 am
by Anonymous User
IDK how bad a C+ in tax will hurt being a tax lawyer. A lot of interviewers talk about how they got a C+ in a class but now focus on that area of law, and are successful. They're more big picture oriented here - on a particular day anything can happen. From your description this seems like an assault, sexual assault, etc. I don't know if any lawyer is expected to work through that. I also don't know how you could explain this story in an interview without getting too personal. If it makes people uncomfortable they'll just take someone else. Personally, I would go out of my way to try to understand your circumstances, but I don't know if others are as empathetic.
Re: T10, No SA, Bad 2L Grades, what now?
Posted: Sat May 24, 2014 1:11 pm
by Anonymous User
Anonymous User wrote:IDK how bad a C+ in tax will hurt being a tax lawyer. A lot of interviewers talk about how they got a C+ in a class but now focus on that area of law, and are successful. They're more big picture oriented here - on a particular day anything can happen. From your description this seems like an assault, sexual assault, etc. I don't know if any lawyer is expected to work through that. I also don't know how you could explain this story in an interview without getting too personal. If it makes people uncomfortable they'll just take someone else. Personally, I would go out of my way to try to understand your circumstances, but I don't know if others are as empathetic.
OP and yes, that is what happened. I decided to address only the facts and quickly move on to another story. ("I was ___ a week before my finals and took second semester off to deal with the situation. Everything worked out in the end, and after trial, I went on to work at my summer job, where I _____. This experience has shown me ____. I'm interested in ___ and ___ because ____")
I know I'm not a great candidate. I just hope a firm somewhere won't hold it against me. My 1L grades were not terrible (No C's, some B's, some A's). I struck out because of very bad bidding.