Top Law Schools

This late in the season...have been working my contacts and have landed an interview at a firm...BUT I'm median at a T2. How do I spin my shitty GPA into an offer? I have multiple people vouching for me (partners they used to work with etc.), but there it is...my shitty GPA that I have to bring into the interview with me. Am I just screwed or can I salvage it?

Your negative attitude is not going to help you, friend. Just be super prepared and enthusiastic (but not desperate) and go get it.

IAFG wrote:Your negative attitude is not going to help you, friend. Just be super prepared and enthusiastic (but not desperate) and go get it.

Appreciate the comment...in all reality I am thrilled about the firm and the opportunity and when I get in there I won't be some debbie downer (That's just not who I am as a person) I just want to know if there is anything I can do to spin last year's bloodbath. My work experience is legit, I just dont know how far that will get me.

Anonymous User wrote:This late in the season...have been working my contacts and have landed an interview at a firm...BUT I'm median at a T2. How do I spin my shitty GPA into an offer? I have multiple people vouching for me (partners they used to work with etc.), but there it is...my shitty GPA that I have to bring into the interview with me. Am I just screwed or can I salvage it?

Sell your good qualities, and don't bring up the GPA unless asked. But have a good explanation.

TBF, it's probably a courtesy interview.

Desert Fox wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:This late in the season...have been working my contacts and have landed an interview at a firm...BUT I'm median at a T2. How do I spin my shitty GPA into an offer? I have multiple people vouching for me (partners they used to work with etc.), but there it is...my shitty GPA that I have to bring into the interview with me. Am I just screwed or can I salvage it?

Sell your good qualities, and don't bring up the GPA unless asked. But have a good explanation.

TBF, it's probably a courtesy interview.

That's exactly what I'm worried about. IS there really a good explanation? "Look bro, I fucked up" doesnt seem like a good one haha. I dont test well is TTTT...

Anonymous User wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:This late in the season...have been working my contacts and have landed an interview at a firm...BUT I'm median at a T2. How do I spin my shitty GPA into an offer? I have multiple people vouching for me (partners they used to work with etc.), but there it is...my shitty GPA that I have to bring into the interview with me. Am I just screwed or can I salvage it?

Sell your good qualities, and don't bring up the GPA unless asked. But have a good explanation.

TBF, it's probably a courtesy interview.

That's exactly what I'm worried about. IS there really a good explanation? "Look bro, I fucked up" doesnt seem like a good one haha. I dont test well is TTTT...

So I am a bit above median at a T-1 and I was interviewing with a large-ish regional firm where everyone else seemed to be from either really good schools/had really good grades. I got asked "I see you did really well at your undergrad, why did your law grades drop?" I focused on the fact that I did really well in our pass/fail legal writing class and also on the fact that law exams are quite different. I think if you point to your strengths, and if you've worked before school you probably can do the work, you'll be fine. Also, is this a screener or a cb? I didn't get asked about grades at any cbs. I think at the cb stage it's really more about fit than grades.

I would say courtesy interview as well to be honest, not to be a jerk.

I had 10 cb's with V100 firms out of CCN. I have 2 bad grades on my transcript. I have excellent work experience and I have very strong interviewing skills. I didn't convert a single V100 cb into an offer. I converted both of my NLJ 250 cb's into offers using the exact same responses, dressing up just a nice, etc. I feel like my grades were the nail in the coffin at the V100 firms, I believe that the hiring committee couldn't get past them.

Anecdotal obviously, no reason why you shouldn't give this 100% effort and hope for the best.

Anonymous User wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:This late in the season...have been working my contacts and have landed an interview at a firm...BUT I'm median at a T2. How do I spin my shitty GPA into an offer? I have multiple people vouching for me (partners they used to work with etc.), but there it is...my shitty GPA that I have to bring into the interview with me. Am I just screwed or can I salvage it?

Sell your good qualities, and don't bring up the GPA unless asked. But have a good explanation.

TBF, it's probably a courtesy interview.

That's exactly what I'm worried about. IS there really a good explanation? "Look bro, I fucked up" doesnt seem like a good one haha. I dont test well is TTTT...

Did you do any better second semester? Did you do well in any classes? Do you notice any pattern in which classes you did well on? (If you did well writing, you could spin it as finding you're better at the "practical" classes than the theoretical; if you did better in contracts, you could use it as an opportunity to reinforce your interest in transactions, if that's applicable, etc.).

Also, can you tie your poorer grades to any positive quality about you that makes you unique among your classmates?

Best of luck! I had a courtesy interview that was just devastating at the beginning of this process, but recently had another interview through networking that was not a courtesy. If they actually have a spot this late in the game, a lot of the top students from top schools with decent personalities have already accepted positions, so your numbers won't look as bad compared with others still looking, particularly if you can make up for them with your personality and other selling points. It'll still be an uphill battle, but certainly one worth fighting!

I honestly believe that nothing is a courtesy interview this late in the game; this is time from a very busy peoples' day you're taking. Go into it thoroughly prepared as if you have a real shot. May not get it, but anything less will be determinative that you won't.

Whether or not it is a courtesy interview doesn't change anything. You still want to go in there and put your best foot forward. Don't waste time thinking about any of that.

Be enthusiastic and interesting. I'm sure you can do that since you've already networked well with these attorneys.

Good luck

No hope if you don't have Allen Emonds.

Just go in there and tell them you don't belong there because of your mediocre GPA. That's what you seem to be telling me.

To Clarify a little bit...

I am interviewing for a specific practice group. All my work experience relates to that group so I have 4 different jobs I can talk about (and have good recommendations from all my bosses if they follow up with them). On the experience front I'm a perfect fit, so I'm hoping that translates well.

To begin with, all they wanted was a Cover Letter and Resume. Sent those in and then had my connections put in a good word. The next day I got the interview, but they want me to bring my transcript and writing samples. Since it's not the normal app. process I keep thinking this is all just a courtesy. I personally know people that got dinged from my school with much better stats than I have. Whatever, Ce la vie.

rad lulz wrote:Just go in there and tell them you don't belong there because of your mediocre GPA. That's what you seem to be telling me.

Not quite sure where you got this from. Im going to go in there and sell the shit outta myself, I just wanted advice on how to spin the GPA, thanks though.

PMan99 wrote:No hope if you don't have Allen Emonds.

Already have that taken care of. All hope is not lost.

Thanks for the advice thus far, much appreciated. Keep it coming.

FitterHappier289 wrote:I honestly believe that nothing is a courtesy interview this late in the game; this is time from a very busy peoples' day you're taking. Go into it thoroughly prepared as if you have a real shot. May not get it, but anything less will be determinative that you won't.

Courtesy interviews are risk-free ways of saving face when somewhat important (but not quite important enough) call in favors. What does a partner care if he has to talk to some law student for a half hour? They'll always find somebody.

That isn't to say the OP shouldn't make the Hail Mary and give it all he has.

This doesn't sound like a courtesy interview anymore. You said you have perfect Work Experience for this job, and that's why they are interested.

I'd say (ONLY if asked, don't bring it up) "I was a little rusty at taking exams after working, and I failed to learn how to write a law exam, but I feel my experience in BLAH BLAH makes me ideal for this job."

Desert Fox wrote:I'd say (ONLY if asked, don't bring it up) "I was a little rusty at taking exams after working, and I failed to learn how to write a law exam, but I feel my experience in BLAH BLAH makes me ideal for this job."

Good advice Desert Fox, that's how I've been thinking about addressing it, if at all...try to always refer back to my W.E. so they dont forget I actually know something about what I'd be doing for them.

HeavenWood wrote:when somewhat important (but not quite important enough) call in favors.

SO, what would make the person Important Enough then? I have a few partners at other firms vouching for me...theyve known me personally for almost a decade, and they have weekly interactions with the partners I'm interviewing with. Is it just b/c they are 1 firm removed from the hiring committee? Just curious for the opinion is all.

Anywho, again, thanks for the advice.

This is usually firm specific. But from what I've heard important enough has to be either important partner within firm or more ideally important client of the firm.

Desert Fox wrote:This doesn't sound like a courtesy interview anymore. You said you have perfect Work Experience for this job, and that's why they are interested.

I'd say (ONLY if asked, don't bring it up) "I was a little rusty at taking exams after working, and I failed to learn how to write a law exam, but I feel my experience in BLAH BLAH makes me ideal for this job."

This. Work experience matters to law firms. A lot. As much as grades. Sometimes more.

More importantly, ASSUME IT'S THIS. If you go in there thinking it's a courtesy interview, you're completely fucked. Confidence is critical in virtually all social encounters, and this is no exception.

I had good-but-not-amazing grades at a middling law school and always did pretty well once I was able to get myself into an interview, because at that point they're looking more at you as a person and less at who you are on paper.

Good luck.

Desert Fox wrote:This doesn't sound like a courtesy interview anymore. You said you have perfect Work Experience for this job, and that's why they are interested.

I'd say (ONLY if asked, don't bring it up) "I was a little rusty at taking exams after working, and I failed to learn how to write a law exam, but I feel my experience in BLAH BLAH makes me ideal for this job."

I'd go with something along the lines of DF's answer. I wouldn't try to spin too much. Just say law school exams take some getting used to. Plenty of people at these firms had some mediocre grades in law school too. Grades are an easy way to sort through relatively similar stacks of resumes. If you have relevant work experience, I'd bet that's what they are looking at.

If this is a callback I would be shocked if you are asked about it.

PlessFightsFire wrote:If this is a callback I would be shocked if you are asked about it.

I've had interviewers go through my transcript in a CB, including a very awkward 5 minute interview (that was supposed to last 30 minutes). He needs to prep a response.

Desert Fox wrote:

PlessFightsFire wrote:If this is a callback I would be shocked if you are asked about it.

I've had interviewers go through my transcript in a CB, including a very awkward 5 minute interview (that was supposed to last 30 minutes). He needs to prep a response.

Fair point. I dunno, I guess this late I would expect people interviewing you to have familiarity. PM me the firm desertfox? I'm curious

PlessFightsFire wrote:

Desert Fox wrote:

PlessFightsFire wrote:If this is a callback I would be shocked if you are asked about it.

I've had interviewers go through my transcript in a CB, including a very awkward 5 minute interview (that was supposed to last 30 minutes). He needs to prep a response.

Fair point. I dunno, I guess this late I would expect people interviewing you to have familiarity. PM me the firm desertfox? I'm curious

OP said he hasn't sent them a transcript yet, which means they probably don't know his GPA yet.

Desert Fox wrote:OP said he hasn't sent them a transcript yet, which means they probably don't know his GPA yet.

Unless it's listed on his resume.

Btw, I'm in a very very very similar position as OP (similar story, similar grades, similar ranked firm, but T25 school), so this thread is quite helpful for me, too. Good luck OP!

Anonymous User wrote:Unless it's listed on his resume.

Btw, I'm in a very very very similar position as OP (similar story, similar grades, similar ranked firm, but T25 school), so this thread is quite helpful for me, too. Good luck OP!

OP Here,
1. There is no way Im putting Median-Fu#%ed on my resume, so no, they dont know it yet. I spoke with the Dean of Career services and he said my GPA prob. won't factor in given my situation so that makes me feel a ton better. He said to be prepared to divert the convo back to my W.E. if that happens.

2. Good luck to you my friend. It's nice to know I'm not the only one rocking the median boat. There is hope!