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Can anyone talk about the relative advantages/disadvantages of splitting summers at 2 firms? I am interested in working in the South, and a lot of firms split summers there. Also, a lot of southern firms traditionally no-offer a non-negligible number of summers, at least when compared to NYC/LA/etc.

Does splitting increase your chances of receiving an offer because you're summering at 2 firms?
Does splitting decrease your chances of receiving an offer because you're only at each firm for half of the program?

Also, is it wise to split between two firms when you don't have a solid idea of practice preference? I have little exposure to litigation but am not totally settled on transactional/corporate yet. Would it be foolish to do one split in a corp department and the other lit?

Career Services at Chicago said that they have seen more doing split summers with no offers than two offers.

They guessed that this is because employers are taking lower percentages of their classes ITE, and splitting makes it harder to impress and express as strong of interest.

TaipeiMort wrote:Career Services at Chicago said that they have seen more doing split summers with no offers than two offers.

They guessed that this is because employers are taking lower percentages of their classes ITE, and splitting makes it harder to impress and express as strong of interest.

Yes, this was my concern. But my--admittedly anecdotal--evidence suggests that in markets where splitting is de rigeur (i.e. the south, texas, etc), this may be less of an issue? Anyone agree/disagree?

i'm actually wondering about this too. assuming i even have the chance at splitting in two different cities, how is that looked upon?

Anonymous User wrote:Can anyone talk about the relative advantages/disadvantages of splitting summers at 2 firms? I am interested in working in the South, and a lot of firms split summers there. Also, a lot of southern firms traditionally no-offer a non-negligible number of summers, at least when compared to NYC/LA/etc.

Does splitting increase your chances of receiving an offer because you're summering at 2 firms?
Does splitting decrease your chances of receiving an offer because you're only at each firm for half of the program?

Also, is it wise to split between two firms when you don't have a solid idea of practice preference? I have little exposure to litigation but am not totally settled on transactional/corporate yet. Would it be foolish to do one split in a corp department and the other lit?

Splitting your summer allows you to try more than one firm on for size. You are interviewing firms as much as they are interviewing you so if you are lucky enough to split, you have more options. Most firms that I know of that have split summers try to only bring in the number of students they need to hire. The problem with that is the timeframe for those projections and firms get it wrong - a lot.

Splitting with two firms to determine your practice area is probably a good idea. You will know pretty quick if you don't like a particular practice.

It's really this simple:

If you're at a firm that only does a 6-8 week program, then you're an idiot if you don't attempt to split the rest of your summer with another firm/something else. If you're at a firm that does a whole summer program, it may not be in your best interest to split because you'll only be there half the summer while the other SA's will be there the entire time. The only exception to the later statement is if you summered with a firm during your 1L summer; in that case you'll probably be okay spending only 3 or 4 weeks with them as a 2L.


I'd like to add that in the South this really won't be much of a concern. Pretty much every firm that I know of has a 6-8 week program that is either in the first or second half of the summer. You'll split based on necessity/the fact that the system is made that way, not by choice.

What about splitting the summer with DOJ Honors? I would only do this if I could do the full summer with a firm, and then do 5-6 weeks with DOJ Honors. Is this possible? Also, can I just miss 1 week of classes if the timing does not, otherwise, work out.

I don't know of any firm or government agency that has a summer program that runs so long that it encroaches on the start of school.

As far as DOJ Honors, if they let you work only 6-8 weeks and you have an offer at a firm that has a program that is only 6-8 weeks, sure do it.

I'd just like to add that firms are not uniform with regard to how they react splitting. I'm currently splitting and both firms I'm splitting at are known for having their summer associates split and still giving offers. The best thing you can do is talk to others who previously summered at the firms you're considering splitting with and ask them how the firm treated split summers.

Imagine for a second that you are a hiring partner, and you have 30 summers, but only 29 jobs. All of your summers did fine work, basically what was expected, and none really stand out. But one of those 30 only spent half the summer with your firm, so nobody's really pulling for her because she didn't really have time to make any connections; plus she wanted to "try out" a different job, rather than spend the whole summer with you.

Who would you no-offer?

Renzo wrote:Imagine for a second that you are a hiring partner, and you have 30 summers, but only 29 jobs. All of your summers did fine work, basically what was expected, and none really stand out. But one of those 30 only spent half the summer with your firm, so nobody's really pulling for her because she didn't really have time to make any connections; plus she wanted to "try out" a different job, rather than spend the whole summer with you.

Who would you no-offer?

The one who came up with the most ridiculous hypos.

Or the fat kid...

this thread should probably be bumped as choices need to be made soon. any more thoughts on this?

Anonymous User wrote:I'd just like to add that firms are not uniform with regard to how they react splitting. I'm currently splitting and both firms I'm splitting at are known for having their summer associates split and still giving offers. The best thing you can do is talk to others who previously summered at the firms you're considering splitting with and ask them how the firm treated split summers.

I agree with this. Depends on what firms. I split with one firm who expects you to split and one firm where I was the only one splitting. Got two offers. Just depends.

Renzo wrote:Imagine for a second that you are a hiring partner, and you have 30 summers, but only 29 jobs. All of your summers did fine work, basically what was expected, and none really stand out. But one of those 30 only spent half the summer with your firm, so nobody's really pulling for her because she didn't really have time to make any connections; plus she wanted to "try out" a different job, rather than spend the whole summer with you.

Who would you no-offer?

Depends on a lot of other factors. Your point is taken, but as I said above, this is just a possibility, not a probability.

What's the likelihood that a top V5 firm would allow me to split my summer with a top consulting firm in the same city?

Anonymous User wrote:

Renzo wrote:Imagine for a second that you are a hiring partner, and you have 30 summers, but only 29 jobs. All of your summers did fine work, basically what was expected, and none really stand out. But one of those 30 only spent half the summer with your firm, so nobody's really pulling for her because she didn't really have time to make any connections; plus she wanted to "try out" a different job, rather than spend the whole summer with you.

Who would you no-offer?

The one who came up with the most ridiculous hypos.

Or the fat kid...

Ridiculous hypos can actually persuade. I'm all about ridiculous hypos.

Question re Texas:
I spend first half in a 6-8 week program. Can I just peace out of summer employment and get a tan on the southern shores of Italy, or will the first half firm think ill of me for not summering the second half?

Anonymous User wrote:Question re Texas:
I spend first half in a 6-8 week program. Can I just peace out of summer employment and get a tan on the southern shores of Italy, or will the first half firm think ill of me for not summering the second half?

No problem just leave them your hotel number so they can forward your offer.

Don't ever for any reason split with two private sector entities. It's about the most sure-fire way I can think of to prove that you aren't really committed to a firm, and they'll remember that when it's time to make offer decisions.

Some firms allow splits with PI outfits (a few even pay you while you're there). This is slightly less dicey. Personally I wouldn't risk it, but you can certainly sell it to a firm as "I want to work here at your firm, but this summer is my last chance to do _______, and I think it will make me a more well-rounded lawyer when I hopefully come back here in a year."

Question re Texas:
I spend first half in a 6-8 week program. Can I just peace out of summer employment and get a tan on the southern shores of Italy, or will the first half firm think ill of me for not summering the second half?

If you are completing the firms full-length summer, then fuck yeah--vacation ahoy. If you are talking about trying to work a shorter than standard (for that firm) summer, or essentially "split" your summer so you can lay on the beach, you have found a good way to make sure you have plenty of time to lay your unemployed ass on the beach after graduation

what about for people considering (or likely to get) clerkships? would that make splitting less terrible, because you are not as reliant on an end-of-summer offer to get a job? i've been told looking for a job after a clerkship is essentially a way to redo the job search process, albeit with an offer in hand. but so many clerks go to firms other than the ones they summered at...so is this as big a concern?

Renzo wrote:Don't ever for any reason split with two private sector entities. It's about the most sure-fire way I can think of to prove that you aren't really committed to a firm, and they'll remember that when it's time to make offer decisions.

Some firms allow splits with PI outfits (a few even pay you while you're there). This is slightly less dicey. Personally I wouldn't risk it, but you can certainly sell it to a firm as "I want to work here at your firm, but this summer is my last chance to do _______, and I think it will make me a more well-rounded lawyer when I hopefully come back here in a year."

Question re Texas:
I spend first half in a 6-8 week program. Can I just peace out of summer employment and get a tan on the southern shores of Italy, or will the first half firm think ill of me for not summering the second half?

If you are completing the firms full-length summer, then fuck yeah--vacation ahoy. If you are talking about trying to work a shorter than standard (for that firm) summer, or essentially "split" your summer so you can lay on the beach, you have found a good way to make sure you have plenty of time to lay your unemployed ass on the beach after graduation

Your advice probably holds for any market besides Texas. In TX, firms encourage splits (with most firms essentially mandating them by only having a six week "first half" program at the very beginning of summer) and not splitting can be taken as a negative (as in, you couldn't secure something second half).

Yes, in Texas, split summers are pretty much standard. It's very rare to have a Texas firm that has a full summer program.

kalvano wrote:Yes, in Texas, split summers are pretty much standard. It's very rare to have a Texas firm that has a full summer program.

This is even more true of Birmingham firms. All of the major players in the market only offer 6 week programs.

Anonymous User wrote:

kalvano wrote:Yes, in Texas, split summers are pretty much standard. It's very rare to have a Texas firm that has a full summer program.

This is even more true of Birmingham firms. All of the major players in the market only offer 6 week programs.

Yep. You have to split in the Ham.

Anonymous User wrote:

kalvano wrote:Yes, in Texas, split summers are pretty much standard. It's very rare to have a Texas firm that has a full summer program.

This is even more true of Birmingham firms. All of the major players in the market only offer 6 week programs.

Same in Tennessee

First, a global note: no employer is looking to "ding" you for whatever reason they can, just to do it. They do it to differentiate between candidates *when they have to*. If there is no need to differentiate, there is no need to ding or to no-offer.

Firms wouldn't allow you to split or pay you to come for 6-8 weeks if they didn't view you as a potential candidate for full-time employment. They are not looking to no-offer people, because their business model is based on robust associate hiring and 100% offer rates are becoming the norm once again. Is your risk of being no-offered higher? Maybe, but I don't think there's enough data to say one way or the other. The important thing is that the two firms you choose are not hesitant/wary about it, that you work your tail off at *both* jobs, and that you make it clear (through your actions, not just by saying so) that you are not splitting just so you can hedge your bets, take a vacation in a west coast market, or some other stupid reason. Remember, the presumption when you are an SA is that you will get an offer if you are a good fit, are competent at your job, and come across as taking the position seriously. Do these things and I think you will do OK.