How to be a Prosecution/PD Gunner? Forum

[uygup12]

I'm hoping to intern at one of the suburban Philadelphia offices (Bucks, Chester, Delaware, Montgomery) this summer, and I was wondering if anyone has had experience with any of them.

[Anonymous User]

How do NYC's 5 PDs compare to DC PDS in terms of competitiveness?

[Tanicius]

How do NYC's 5 PDs compare to DC PDS in terms of competitiveness?

Legal Aid and Brooklyn were, at least in my experience, total crap shoots. Bronx is supposedly pretty intensive, though I'd say Legal Aid was as well, just without the benefit of knowing that any of my interview panelist opinions were of consequence to the head hiring coordinator when she made the callback decisions.

In reality, all of these offices are crapshoots. PDS just tends to be a lot more transparent on what part if the process you're in.

[Anonymous User]

I just recently accepted a job at Mecklenburg County PD for this upcoming summer - I'm a 2L currently. I know a lot about what I'll do, my duties, etc - but can anyone speak on what the culture or anything you heard or experienced? Honestly, the interview I had with them was awesome and I'm stoked for this summer.

Also, how likely are they to hire their 2Ls for post-grad work? Thanks!

[CaptainLeela]

Welcome to TLS

[Anonymous User]

I just recently accepted a job at Mecklenburg County PD for this upcoming summer - I'm a 2L currently. I know a lot about what I'll do, my duties, etc - but can anyone speak on what the culture or anything you heard or experienced? Honestly, the interview I had with them was awesome and I'm stoked for this summer.

Also, how likely are they to hire their 2Ls for post-grad work? Thanks!

PM me

Can anyone chime in the same info about New Hampshire? Culture, experiences, etc?

[Anonymous User]

I just recently accepted a job at Mecklenburg County PD for this upcoming summer - I'm a 2L currently. I know a lot about what I'll do, my duties, etc - but can anyone speak on what the culture or anything you heard or experienced? Honestly, the interview I had with them was awesome and I'm stoked for this summer.

Also, how likely are they to hire their 2Ls for post-grad work? Thanks!

PM me

Can anyone chime in the same info about New Hampshire? Culture, experiences, etc?

Whoops, just re-read your earlier post. Culture up here is good. They put in a good amount of effort to have events for the interns. The overall office culture is really different county to county. Some offices grab beers after work, other offices mostly run to pick their kids up from school. Just totally depends on where you want to be geographically. We gave some offers to 2Ls for permanent work at the end of their summer (ie these folks got to start 3L with a job in hand, pretty awesome in the pd job hunt).

[Anonymous User]

I'm hoping to intern at one of the suburban Philadelphia offices (Bucks, Chester, Delaware, Montgomery) this summer, and I was wondering if anyone has had experience with any of them.

A friend of mine interned at Montco 2 summers ago. Didn't seem like anything special from what I heard tbh. Not sure what the other counties are like.

[Anonymous User]

I've heard from a guy at my old internship that a lot of people jump ship from PD to work in policy, like in a think tank capacity. Anyone know anyone who did this. TBF the guy at the internship was a little odd and actively trying to ferret out any non-true believers.

[Displeased]

I've heard from a guy at my old internship that a lot of people jump ship from PD to work in policy, like in a think tank capacity. Anyone know anyone who did this. TBF the guy at the internship was a little odd and actively trying to ferret out any non-true believers.

I wouldn't say "a lot of people" do it, but its not unheard of. I know a few people who have gone from being a PD to working for the ACLU. At CLEs and PD conferences I've heard lectures from people who started as PDs but then founded or joined a criminal law nonprofit.

But I would say that in my experience, most people who leave the PDs office either 1) become prosecutors, 2) go private, or 3) go federal. The high turnover in PDs offices is largely due to newbies quitting, people getting a couple years experience then going private, or just plain switching offices (moving from being a podunk PD in rural Pensyltucky to being a PD in Pittsburgh, or vice versa).

Offhand, I know of several people who left the PDs office to work for law school's OCS, enough to make me think that law schools are making an active effort to recruit PDs to help their students find jobs in the public sector. Might just be a coincidence though.

[Anonymous User]

Any one have experience getting a school-year law clerk position with a criminal defense/white collar firm? SAing at a big firm this summer, but I'm curious if I can do this without stepping on any toes, or if it's worthwhile, in order to get some general experience in the area.

[BlueLotus]

I have a callback interview with the Defender Association of Philadelphia Child Advocacy Unit. Any idea as to what to expect? Hypos?

[Manali]

Does the Defender Association of Philadelphia (Criminal) formally ding you? Or do they just give you the silent treatment if they are not interested? I had a screener on October 23.

[Anonymous User]

Does the Defender Association of Philadelphia (Criminal) formally ding you? Or do they just give you the silent treatment if they are not interested? I had a screener on October 23.

They'll send an email ding if you had a screener. Based on prior years, you can probably expect to hear pretty soon either way.

[Manali]

I'm hoping to intern at one of the suburban Philadelphia offices (Bucks, Chester, Delaware, Montgomery) this summer, and I was wondering if anyone has had experience with any of them.

A friend of mine interned at Montco 2 summers ago. Didn't seem like anything special from what I heard tbh. Not sure what the other counties are like.

Also interested in the suburban Philly PDs offices. I'd love to hear any perspectives.

[Anonymous User]

I made a new thread about a resume question on how to list trial experience best on my resume..

Any help would be appreciated!

http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... 3&t=258093

[whitespider]

Hey everyone, quick question...

I'm interested in prosecution work after graduation. I know that 1L summer work generally doesn't matter, but would it raise red flags if I accepted a legal internship at a large regional ACLU office for the summer?

It seems like interesting work and a good opportunity, but I don't want to potentially alienate any future interviewers.

Thanks for any advice!

[Anonymous User]

Lateraling as a PD?

Looking for a little anonymous advice here, thanks in advance! By way of background I got my current PD job offer while I was still in law school. SO, not in law, did not have a job at that time. Plan was that SO would move to where my PD job was but she got a very geographic specific job before I graduated law school. She's moving up in her job and there are no opportunities for her where my PD job is located. Great PD office where she's located and I'm thinking about throwing an app their way.

When I took the job I got sent a letter saying that the expectation was that I would work for them for at least 3 years. This definitely wasn't like an employment contract, more of a gentleman's agreement if you will. I've done a good portion of that time but feel a little awkward throwing out applications before that time is up. I feel like the other office might be curious about it but I mostly worry about asking for letters of reference etc.. I also don't exactly have the trial experience I was hoping to have this deep in. The people at my office are very cool and understanding, I'm just looking for advice on potentially trying to bail a little be earlier than I'm supposed to.

Edited to add that the other office hires a class out of law school. I'd be happy to be hired on as a new lawyer for the training. I feel like they'd be happy because they could pay me less. Not sure about the best way to bring this up either.

Thanks!

[Tanicius]

Lateraling as a PD?

Looking for a little anonymous advice here, thanks in advance! By way of background I got my current PD job offer while I was still in law school. SO, not in law, did not have a job at that time. Plan was that SO would move to where my PD job was but she got a very geographic specific job before I graduated law school. She's moving up in her job and there are no opportunities for her where my PD job is located. Great PD office where she's located and I'm thinking about throwing an app their way.

When I took the job I got sent a letter saying that the expectation was that I would work for them for at least 3 years. This definitely wasn't like an employment contract, more of a gentleman's agreement if you will. I've done a good portion of that time but feel a little awkward throwing out applications before that time is up. I feel like the other office might be curious about it but I mostly worry about asking for letters of reference etc.. I also don't exactly have the trial experience I was hoping to have this deep in. The people at my office are very cool and understanding, I'm just looking for advice on potentially trying to bail a little be earlier than I'm supposed to.

Edited to add that the other office hires a class out of law school. I'd be happy to be hired on as a new lawyer for the training. I feel like they'd be happy because they could pay me less. Not sure about the best way to bring this up either.

Thanks!

No, don't offer to work as a starting lawyer. That throws your credibility as an experienced lawyer right under the bus and will make you look weird and foolish.

When you are asking to switch into a different office, you should really look at it more like you're doing that new office a favor. You have experience, and it's a somewhat different experience than the other lawyers who have worked there the entire time. You throwing you hat in the ring means they don't have to hire a newb instead.

I wouldn't really care about the 3-year "expectation". That's silly and they would shitcan you in an instant if budget cuts required it. The new office should be well aware that it can be awkward to just ask your current employer for their thoughts when they don't know you're looking to move. I'm sure they encounter this all the time and I would trust them to be discreet.

[Anonymous User]

Thanks for the response. Yeah, they actually kind of telegraphed during training that they'd let us go if bar results came back negative. I guess I should also add that I was a 2L intern at the place I'm looking at. I applied to work there after school but they weren't going to be able to let me know before my current job offer expired. I'm thinking the first person to reach out to would be the attorney that ran the internship program?

Thanks Again!

[Anonymous User]

Same anonymous as before. I've managed to get two acquittals since my last post so I'm feeling more confident going forward trying to move geographically. Given that I'm posting anonymously I'm going to add that SO is in NYC and that I'm trying to move to a PD over there from my current PD. It seems like a lot of the PD's there are looking for people for their civil practice. As a lot of the places grow more holistic it seems like they struggle to find people essentially willing to be PD's but not do criminal work. I'm wondering who applies for these jobs. I can't imagine anyone without the PD mindset trying to work as a lawyer for a PD, but I also can't imagine that type of person not being a PD. I will do this work in whatever capacity I can if possible but I also feel like it may be awkward telling people that I'm all in to be a housing attorney for their PD org when my only experience is criminal.

Anyone have any thoughts? I hope this will be useful for other folks in the future and that I don't just kill this thread again. Thanks!

[Anonymous User]

Same anonymous as before. I've managed to get two acquittals since my last post so I'm feeling more confident going forward trying to move geographically. Given that I'm posting anonymously I'm going to add that SO is in NYC and that I'm trying to move to a PD over there from my current PD. It seems like a lot of the PD's there are looking for people for their civil practice. As a lot of the places grow more holistic it seems like they struggle to find people essentially willing to be PD's but not do criminal work. I'm wondering who applies for these jobs. I can't imagine anyone without the PD mindset trying to work as a lawyer for a PD, but I also can't imagine that type of person not being a PD. I will do this work in whatever capacity I can if possible but I also feel like it may be awkward telling people that I'm all in to be a housing attorney for their PD org when my only experience is criminal.

Anyone have any thoughts? I hope this will be useful for other folks in the future and that I don't just kill this thread again. Thanks!

NYC area PD here: I don't agree that offices struggle to find civil attorneys, or that few applicants want to work in those fields with these offices. I suspect you are seeing more of these postings because hiring for civil positions, unlike for criminal positions, is less tied to a rigid yearly class system. The holistic offices in the NYC area are some of the better respected indigent service providers so these are seen as desirable positions for civil applicants. So, although there may be more postings throughout the year, that doesn't necessarily indicate that there are more positions available or that the office is struggling to fill them. In my anecdotal experience, PD colleagues have typically (but not always) struggled to convince offices that they are absolutely committed to switching to a civil field, and almost everyone I know who lateraled went from criminal to criminal.

As a previous commenter said, your experience will be valued and you should approach your lateral job search with a lot of confidence. I can tell you that in NYC trials are relatively rare, especially at the misdemeanor level, so if you were in the position to win two acquittals in a little over a month you almost certainly have more trial experience than would a NY attorney with your years of practice, and offices are likely to especially value that experience.

[Anonymous User]

Hey thanks a ton! I think that "struggle" was probably too strong a word. But I will say that a lot of the people that I know who were interested in civil public interest really couldn't stomach the whole "working with guilty people" thing. I mean I never got any grief but it definitely didn't seem like any of those folks would be actively pursuing jobs with PDs.

I'm actually really interested in becoming more versed in civil law. Since I'm anonymous I won't bs you guys, I don't want to feel like criminal is all I'll ever be able to do. I'd also just really like to be able to be marketable to non-profits outside of public defense so that I can legitimately try to get other jobs if it becomes necessary to move again etc..

Trials are actually pretty rare here as well. I was co-counsel on a felony early on and then didn't have anything until this recent run. So that's over a year with no jury trials. I do have pretty strong ties to NYC. I worked for a civil non-profit one semester and then BDS that summer.

I really appreciate your reply and hope I'm able to come down and get to work soon. Thanks!

[Kivan]

Hey everyone, quick question...

I'm interested in prosecution work after graduation. I know that 1L summer work generally doesn't matter, but would it raise red flags if I accepted a legal internship at a large regional ACLU office for the summer?

It seems like interesting work and a good opportunity, but I don't want to potentially alienate any future interviewers.

Thanks for any advice!

Nobody would care as long as you have some type of experience with a prosecution office.

I was a prosecutor for several years and I interned for the Federal Defender's Office AND Criminal Defense attorney.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have specific advice on Cook County prosecutor jobs and collar counties (Lake, Dupage, Kane, Will, McHenry)? T30 3L, meh grades, graduating no debt, using 7-11 student license in downstate Illinois county while finishing up law school. Super Illinois resume, but nothing tying me to Chicago. Mostly wondering how to go about finding a gig after graduation. Current plan was to just blast letters asking to work for internship, take one I'd be ok with, move somewhere close, start interning pre or post bar in July, and shoot for a post-bar job. Would really appreciate advice specific to Chicago collar counties if anyone has attempted something like this. Help!