Top Law Schools

Posted: **Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:12 am**

I've hard that billable hour requirements are lower at firms in secondary markets (ones that pay $90 - $120k / yr at the best firms). Is this true to the extent that work-life balance is significantly better, to a point to be worth the lower salary, or is it all pretty much hellish?

Disclaimer: This coming from a 0L

Posted: **Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:13 am**

i've noticed that a lot of people on this forum have duck-related usernames

Posted: **Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:26 am**

I've accepted such a job and the firm seems genuine about providing a work/life balance. They encourage community involvement, family, and 8-hour days (barring deadlines or special circumstances).

Although, I guess i won't really know what it's like until I start work after the bar.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:52 pm**

I've accepted a 2L SA position in a secondary market where "market" is between $110k and $120k. From all the research I've done and people I've talked with, the minimum billables of 1750-1800 hours are for real - no one expects anyone to bill much more than this. I even had a partner tell me that when associates have pulled 2000 hrs + in the past, the firm has sat the person down and told them to chill out.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:57 pm**

I worked as a paralegal in biglaw in NYC for four years and now I'm a paralegal in Boston biglaw. The hours are seriously very different. Even though you can work as many hours in a week when you're in the smaller market, you can do things like work from home or take breaks to go home and eat with your family rather than dining in a conference room in the office.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:58 pm**

fatduck wrote:i've noticed that a lot of people on this forum have duck-related usernames

And I haven't even seen Mallard in here for a while.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:00 pm**

I too took a job in a secondary market where I will not be billing more than 1800 hours a year. Generally speaking, they're telling you the truth about work-life balance. If there's a big case, then yeah, you'll be working hard, but by and large there is a reason you don't get paid as much.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:11 pm**

Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:24 pm**

lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A ~~tertiary~~ potato market?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:30 pm**

bump. this is a good question

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:32 pm**

paulinaporizkova wrote:bump. this is a good question

Wait....did you just bump something that was just posted on about 2 minutes ago?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:33 pm**

A'nold wrote:
paulinaporizkova wrote:bump. this is a good question
Wait....did you just bump something that was just posted on about 2 minutes ago?

yes, yes i did.

it was 6 minutes

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:35 pm**

lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?

I've always wondered if Texas is considered a secondary market.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:35 pm**

lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?

Here, NY, DC, LA, and sometimes Chicago, Boston, and San Francisco are considered major markets. What's interesting is that DC, Boston, and San Francisco are smaller by population than several other markets:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Metro_Areas

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:36 pm**

quakeroats wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
Here, NY, DC, LA, and sometimes Chicago, Boston, and San Francisco are considered major markets. What's interesting is that DC, Boston, and San Francisco are smaller by population than several other markets:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Metro_Areas

Here? You mean at Duke but not other schools?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:37 pm**

lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?

NY, DC, LA, SF, Chicago, and those big towns in Texas are the only primary markets. Everything else is secondary.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:39 pm**

Nogameisfair wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
NY, DC, LA, SF, Chicago, and those big towns in Texas are the only primary markets. Everything else is secondary.

if you are billing 100-1850 hours, what does that equate to in terms of working hours per week?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:40 pm**

paulinaporizkova wrote:
quakeroats wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
Here, NY, DC, LA, and sometimes Chicago, Boston, and San Francisco are considered major markets. What's interesting is that DC, Boston, and San Francisco are smaller by population than several other markets:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_Metro_Areas
Here? You mean at Duke but not other schools?

I mean on this forum.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:41 pm**

bbermud wrote:
Nogameisfair wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
NY, DC, LA, SF, Chicago, and those big towns in Texas are the only primary markets. Everything else is secondary.

if you are billing 100-1850 hours, what does that equate to in terms of working hours per week?

It depends on how efficient you are. 2 hours billed/3 hours worked is a good approximation.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:42 pm**

lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?

In the strictest sense, NYC and DC are the "primary markets." To this, people often add Chicago, LA, SF, Boston, Houston and DFW because there are a lot of firms there and the biggest among them tend to pay market. When people define "secondary markets" as markets with firms that don't pay 160, they're usually talking about places like ATL, Phoenix, San Antonio, Florida, San Diego, Sacramento, Seattle, etc.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:54 pm**

paulinaporizkova wrote:bump. this is a good question

Well I feel pretty confident in saying that DC and Chicago are primary markets.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:55 pm**

SBL wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
In the strictest sense, NYC and DC are the "primary markets." To this, people often add Chicago, LA, SF, Boston, Houston and DFW because there are a lot of firms there and the biggest among them tend to pay market. When people define "secondary markets" as markets with firms that don't pay 160, they're usually talking about places like ATL, Phoenix, San Antonio, Florida, San Diego, Sacramento, Seattle, etc.

I really want to move to Chicago post graduation and have not decided if Biglaw is for me yet. If didn't go Biglaw in Chicago, what sort or salary could I command granted I am not an idiot.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:00 pm**

bbermud wrote:
SBL wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
In the strictest sense, NYC and DC are the "primary markets." To this, people often add Chicago, LA, SF, Boston, Houston and DFW because there are a lot of firms there and the biggest among them tend to pay market. When people define "secondary markets" as markets with firms that don't pay 160, they're usually talking about places like ATL, Phoenix, San Antonio, Florida, San Diego, Sacramento, Seattle, etc.
I really want to move to Chicago post graduation and have not decided if Biglaw is for me yet. If didn't go Biglaw in Chicago, what sort or salary could I command granted I am not an idiot.

what school do you or will you go to?

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:05 pm**

paulinaporizkova wrote:
bbermud wrote:
SBL wrote:
lisjjen wrote:Define secondary markets? Is everything but LA and NY a secondary market? Would Houston and DFW or Seattle be considered a secondary market?

What would Boise be? A tertiary market?
In the strictest sense, NYC and DC are the "primary markets." To this, people often add Chicago, LA, SF, Boston, Houston and DFW because there are a lot of firms there and the biggest among them tend to pay market. When people define "secondary markets" as markets with firms that don't pay 160, they're usually talking about places like ATL, Phoenix, San Antonio, Florida, San Diego, Sacramento, Seattle, etc.
I really want to move to Chicago post graduation and have not decided if Biglaw is for me yet. If didn't go Biglaw in Chicago, what sort or salary could I command granted I am not an idiot.
what school do you or will you go to?

I'm in at Iowa so most likely there due to in state tuition. Waiting on 6 other schools. So for argument's sake, let's just say Iowa.

Posted: **Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:07 pm**

Jumping onto this. Where does Salt Lake rank in this sense. Would it qualify as a secondary, or more of tertiary market like the potato factory in Boise?

Top Law Schools

Work / Life balance in secondary markets Forum

Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets

Re: Work / Life balance in secondary markets