~3.1 at one of MVP
Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 2:17 am
Am I screwed out of biglaw?
Should I just drop out?
Should I just drop out?
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https://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=144306
3.3 curvemegaTTTron wrote:What's the curve, or your rank?
Okay, well first off, it doesn't sound that bad. Try to find last years list of ranking for 1Ls, usually posted on the website somewhere. You have another semester to bring shit back up. You don't want to hear it but you should focus on that right now (talking to profs, figuring out how to do better, focusing on rocking second semester)Anonymous User wrote:3.3 curvemegaTTTron wrote:What's the curve, or your rank?
no idea wtf my rank is.
OP, are you on a scholly (getting in-state)?Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
everything=full loans. Out of state.megaTTTron wrote:OP, are you on a scholly (getting in-state)?Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
Cav's credited. But I'd stick it out for this year. You need to (a) talk to all your profs, (b) read some of the guides on here for success, make a plan (this will involve changing your habits), (c) get ahold of past exams for your spring classes and start familiarizing, (d) try to lock up some good experience for this summer.Anonymous User wrote:everything=full loans. Out of state.megaTTTron wrote:OP, are you on a scholly (getting in-state)?Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you'reprobablynot going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans),you might think aboutdroppingout.But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
Don't listen to that stuff dude. I'm a non-URM with a 3.20 (3.0 first semester) and am working at a V15 firm. You would be amazed at what good interview skills can do- keep studying and don't let anyone tell you that below median grades eliminate you.Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
Meh, he doesn't need to shift above median. Near median and killer interview skills and a good bid strategy can still win the day at MVP [the bottom 1/3 is going to be permafucked no matter what tho] (now, on my part, I just HOAP and PRAY that I'm not so far below median that even a recovery to around median is out of the cards).Anonymous Loser wrote:3L here. Many of my classmates have made dramatic improvements in their GPA's since fall semester of 1L year. Unfortunately, no on cares. All of the critical hiring decisions relevant to large law firms are made almost exclusively on the basis of 1L grades. This means that the OP has a very limited opportunity to raise his GPA: even straight A's spring semester will likely not shift his GPA much above median. The OP may well graduate with latin honors after padding his GPA with 2L and 3L seminars, but by that point many employment opportunities will be foreclosed. Moreover, after doing so poorly fall semester, there is little reason to believe that the OP will surpass his classmates, the majority of whom are much better at law school than he is.
"Killer interview skills" are a rarity. That's why grades and school are such an important part of the equation for most people.Veyron wrote:Meh, he doesn't need to shift above median. Near median and killer interview skills and a good bid strategy can still win the day at MVP [the bottom 1/3 is going to be permafucked no matter what tho] (now, on my part, I just HOAP and PRAY that I'm not so far below median that even a recovery to around median is out of the cards).Anonymous Loser wrote:3L here. Many of my classmates have made dramatic improvements in their GPA's since fall semester of 1L year. Unfortunately, no on cares. All of the critical hiring decisions relevant to large law firms are made almost exclusively on the basis of 1L grades. This means that the OP has a very limited opportunity to raise his GPA: even straight A's spring semester will likely not shift his GPA much above median. The OP may well graduate with latin honors after padding his GPA with 2L and 3L seminars, but by that point many employment opportunities will be foreclosed. Moreover, after doing so poorly fall semester, there is little reason to believe that the OP will surpass his classmates, the majority of whom are much better at law school than he is.
You may have done fine, but most people in your shoes didn't.Anonymous User wrote:Don't listen to that stuff dude. I'm a non-URM with a 3.20 (3.0 first semester) and am working at a V15 firm. You would be amazed at what good interview skills can do- keep studying and don't let anyone tell you that below median grades eliminate you.Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
+1 Again, good interview skills are rare.Cavalier wrote:You may have done fine, but most people in your shoes didn't.Anonymous User wrote:Don't listen to that stuff dude. I'm a non-URM with a 3.20 (3.0 first semester) and am working at a V15 firm. You would be amazed at what good interview skills can do- keep studying and don't let anyone tell you that below median grades eliminate you.Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
I've also heard-tell of stories of 3.2s at Penn winding up at V ranked firms last year. I also know top 20% at T-14s that have struck out entirely. A great deal comes down to presentation, more then I think most people give credit for. That being said, below median is in for a tough slog.Cavalier wrote:You may have done fine, but most people in your shoes didn't.Anonymous User wrote:Don't listen to that stuff dude. I'm a non-URM with a 3.20 (3.0 first semester) and am working at a V15 firm. You would be amazed at what good interview skills can do- keep studying and don't let anyone tell you that below median grades eliminate you.Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
The proof is in the results. When you have 10 interviews and walk away with 9 offers, you'll know you're a good interviewer.Veyron wrote:I've also heard-tell of stories of 3.2s at Penn winding up at V ranked firms last year. I also know top 20% at T-14s that have struck out entirely. A great deal comes down to presentation, more then I think most people give credit for. That being said, below median is in for a tough slog.Cavalier wrote:You may have done fine, but most people in your shoes didn't.Anonymous User wrote:Don't listen to that stuff dude. I'm a non-URM with a 3.20 (3.0 first semester) and am working at a V15 firm. You would be amazed at what good interview skills can do- keep studying and don't let anyone tell you that below median grades eliminate you.Cavalier wrote:I'm guessing Virginia since quite a few 1L grades were released today. If you enter OCI with around a 3.1, you're probably not going to get big law, and if that's what you came to law school for (or if you are depending on big law to pay off your loans), you might think about dropping out. But you should consider (a) your chances of improving your grades next semester, and (b) how strong of a job applicant you will be. If you think you are capable of pulling your GPA closer to the median, and you have other factors in your favor (good work experience, good interviewing skills, etc.), staying in law school may still be wise.
One thing I'm interested in, how can I objectively assess my interview abilities. I've done mock interview-ish stuff with some biglaw and midlaw partners who are acquaintances of mine and gotten good reviews (didn't solicit feedback, reviews were unprompted). However, these people were pre-disposed to be friendly - I can't imagine them telling me that I suck.
This happens? If so, is it really the only way to evaluate interview skills.The proof is in the results. When you have 10 interviews and walk away with 9 offers, you'll know you're a good interviewer.
I've also heard-tell of stories of 3.2s at Penn winding up at V ranked firms last year. I also know top 20% at T-14s that have struck out entirely. A great deal comes down to presentation, more then I think most people give credit for. That being said, below median is in for a tough slog.
One thing I'm interested in, how can I objectively assess my interview abilities. I've done mock interview-ish stuff with some biglaw and midlaw partners who are acquaintances of mine and gotten good reviews (didn't solicit feedback, reviews were unprompted). However, these people were pre-disposed to be friendly - I can't imagine them telling me that I suck.
IMO, mock interviews only fix glaring turnoffs you might have. Most people are simply average interviewers, so they'll leave mock interviews not really knowing where they stand. The really good interviewers will leave mock interviews with an actual interview scheduled for a later date with the firm.
Veyron wrote:
This happens? If so, is it really the only way to evaluate interview skills.
I mean, I think I have a fair shot at getting an interview at some of these firms (assuming no grade epic fail) but that is more because conversations over the years with these guys have given me a really, really good idea what qualities these firms look for and have allowed me to tailor my resume and experiences accordingly.