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Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:54 pm
by Anonymous User
I have decided to drop one of my two secondary journals. I was told by my OCS that they will contact employers. I already have an offer. Will this affect anything?
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:02 pm
by MrAnon
Sounds like douchebag city. Do they know where you work? if not, don't tell. If they know then so what? Ever see the editor in chief not wash his hands in the restroom? Maybe you should call his employer and tell them about it.
If you are on 2 journals it won't affect anything. If you are on 1 journal it won't affect anything. A compelling reason to drop is always helpful.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:24 pm
by LawyerBlog
The only way it should make a difference is if your firm is looking for an excuse to rescind an offer. If so, it would be a sleazy thing for the firm to do, but these times are first times for a lot of things. Otherwise, no one expects 2 journals anyway.
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Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:55 am
by ToTransferOrNot
MrAnon wrote:Sounds like douchebag city. Do they know where you work? if not, don't tell. If they know then so what? Ever see the editor in chief not wash his hands in the restroom? Maybe you should call his employer and tell them about it.
If you are on 2 journals it won't affect anything. If you are on 1 journal it won't affect anything. A compelling reason to drop is always helpful.
YEah, because informing employers that the applicant's resume is now inaccurate is such a douche move. Particularly after someone has agreed to be on a journal - thus taking a spot someone else could have had.
Here's hoping there's an indication on OP's transcript re: the dropped journal, too. That's what happens here. Call to the employer, indication on the transcript, and it shows up on C&F. Don't agree to do things you won't do. OP was an idiot to agree to do two journals, but once you've obligated yourself to doing it, you do it.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 12:41 pm
by concurrent fork
LawyerBlog wrote:The only way it should make a difference is if your firm is looking for an excuse to rescind an offer. If so, it would be a sleazy thing for the firm to do, but these times are first times for a lot of things. Otherwise, no one expects 2 journals anyway.
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It is not sleazy to rescind an offer if double journal membership played a role in hiring. The bottom line is that the committee made a decision based on inaccurate information. OP: they almost certainly will not rescind, but be proactive and tell the recruiting dept.
ToTransferOrNot wrote:MrAnon wrote:Sounds like douchebag city. Do they know where you work? if not, don't tell. If they know then so what? Ever see the editor in chief not wash his hands in the restroom? Maybe you should call his employer and tell them about it.
If you are on 2 journals it won't affect anything. If you are on 1 journal it won't affect anything. A compelling reason to drop is always helpful.
YEah, because informing employers that the applicant's resume is now inaccurate is such a douche move. Particularly after someone has agreed to be on a journal - thus taking a spot someone else could have had.
Here's hoping there's an indication on OP's transcript re: the dropped journal, too. That's what happens here. Call to the employer, indication on the transcript, and it shows up on C&F. Don't agree to do things you won't do. OP was an idiot to agree to do two journals, but once you've obligated yourself to doing it, you do it.
+1
Since OCI is so early now, many applicants could just drop LR/journal after receiving an offer. Schools
should notify employers to deter this type of practice (and the ethical implications/shafting of classmates which can ensue).
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:58 pm
by Bosque
Why were you on two to begin with? Seems like a good way to kill your grades and your work quality at the journals.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:25 pm
by LawyerBlog
A double journal will never be the difference for getting an offer.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:59 pm
by Kohinoor
Bosque wrote:Why were you on two to begin with? Seems like a good way to kill your grades and your work quality at the journals.
Not if you plan to quit one or both.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:01 pm
by concurrent fork
LawyerBlog wrote:A double journal will never be the difference for getting an offer.
No one is arguing that it will. That said, I can't pretend to know how 250 hiring committees view that kind of commitment on a resume.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:17 pm
by Anonymous User
I'm on two and it's really not that bad. The editors know that a lot of people are on two and they balance the work schedules.
Would I go back and change things? Can't say that I would. I got an offer at my top choice. Who knows what was or wasn't the deciding factor.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 3:22 pm
by rando
Kohinoor wrote:Bosque wrote:Why were you on two to begin with? Seems like a good way to kill your grades and your work quality at the journals.
Not if you plan to quit one or both.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 7:46 pm
by Anonymous User
There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
People don't get jobs because they were on the Journal of Law and Social Change.
If I could change anything from 1L, I would never have agreed to be on a secondary, and wouldn't have given a second thought to law review write-on wasteland.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 8:46 pm
by ToTransferOrNot
Anonymous User wrote:There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
People don't get jobs because they were on the Journal of Law and Social Change.
If I could change anything from 1L, I would never have agreed to be on a secondary, and wouldn't have given a second thought to law review write-on wasteland.
I only got one offer through 2L OCI. I was on the wait list for that job for over a month. All of my interviewers had my secondary journal circled on the resume when I went in for my interviews.
Is it possible that I would have gotten the job without the journal? Sure. But your post is hyperbole and a half.
Also - you're a fool if you think that an editorial board position on a secondary doesn't make up for at least a bit of pain not having LR does to a resume, when clerkship season roles around. Is it a significant aid? No - but it helps a bit, and a bit is the difference between striking out and having a job, ITE.
Long story short - you're wrong.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 8:54 pm
by Anonymous User
ToTransferOrNot wrote:Anonymous User wrote:There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
People don't get jobs because they were on the Journal of Law and Social Change.
If I could change anything from 1L, I would never have agreed to be on a secondary, and wouldn't have given a second thought to law review write-on wasteland.
I only got one offer through 2L OCI. I was on the wait list for that job for over a month. All of my interviewers had my secondary journal circled on the resume when I went in for my interviews.
Is it possible that I would have gotten the job without the journal? Sure. But your post is hyperbole and a half.
Also - you're a fool if you think that an editorial board position on a secondary doesn't make up for at least a bit of pain not having LR does to a resume, when clerkship season roles around. Is it a significant aid? No - but it helps a bit, and a bit is the difference between striking out and having a job, ITE.
Long story short - you're wrong.
circling lines on resumes doesn't mean shit. all of my interviewers had circled my study abroad experience and hometown, but I didn't get offers because I spent a year in Cairo.
most judges (particularly the more competitive ones) select law review as one of their screening qualifications in Oscar, so that secondary journal editorial board spot probs isn't being seen.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:01 pm
by ToTransferOrNot
Which explains how I got screening interviews with judges that supposedly had Law Review listed as a requirement, right?
ITE, turning down a resume line = stupid move. A secondary journal isn't the strongest resume line in the world, but it's better than nothing. And yeah, when the two circled things are my GPA and my journal, it's circled at every interview, and I end up one of 11 people who get hired, it means that it at least caught the interviewer's eye.
Further, almost every person in my SA class was on a journal - either LR or a secondary (only one exception, and he was interested in corporate anyway).
But whatever, if you'd rather have a few extra hours to drink, bully on you. I'll keep the resume line.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:29 pm
by concurrent fork
Anonymous User wrote:There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
Quite the opposite. At least half a dozen interviewers asked me about responsibilities on my secondary journal. Two of them served on the exact same journal and commented on how they thought it was a great experience.
Also, there is no need for this to be anonymous.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:38 pm
by Anonymous User
concurrent fork wrote:Anonymous User wrote:There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
Quite the opposite. At least half a dozen interviewers asked me about responsibilities on my secondary journal. Two of them served on the exact same journal and commented on how they thought it was a great experience.
Also, there is no need for this to be anonymous.
I wonder if this is school dependent. None of my interviewers even mentioned my secondary (which might be one of the top two or three at my school, but I don't think that means much). Everyone I know at my CCN is on a secondary, so maybe it's just so standard that it's not worth noticing?
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 9:40 pm
by ToTransferOrNot
Anonymous User wrote:concurrent fork wrote:Anonymous User wrote:There should be a stickied thread that reads: Secondary journals are worthless, only no one at your school will tell you that, otherwise there would be no one to staff the aforementioned pointless journals.
Quite the opposite. At least half a dozen interviewers asked me about responsibilities on my secondary journal. Two of them served on the exact same journal and commented on how they thought it was a great experience.
Also, there is no need for this to be anonymous.
I wonder if this is school dependent. None of my interviewers even mentioned my secondary (which might be one of the top two or three at my school, but I don't think that means much). Everyone I know at my CCN is on a secondary, so maybe it's just so standard that it's not worth noticing?
The thing is, if everyone is on a secondary at your school, then it becomes noticeable if you don't have that resume line. Either way, it's noticeable.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:00 pm
by MrAnon
OP says he has an offer. Not that he just completed 2L OCI. I take that to mean he has already summered at the firm. When he gave them his resume he was on the journal. It has been over a year. Now he wants to quit. It is not a lie. When an employer hires you he understands that circumstances may change. Employer is free to live with that or not, but its not a lie.
I grant that a 2L who just secured a summer job and summarily quits his journal raises more than an eyebrow.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:23 pm
by 20160810
Since I don't really care what happens to OP one way or the other, I'll offer the following advice: Quit one of them and chance it. Sure, they *might* tell your employer, but that sounds like BS to me. How would they even know where you've accepted? Plus which, I'm sure you could explain to your firm why you needed to drop one secondary journal to focus on your grades. I doubt that two illustrious semesters of cite-checking the family law journal will really be the difference between them wanting to employ you and otherwise.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:47 pm
by ToTransferOrNot
SBL wrote:Since I don't really care what happens to OP one way or the other, I'll offer the following advice: Quit one of them and chance it. Sure, they *might* tell your employer, but that sounds like BS to me. How would they even know where you've accepted? Plus which, I'm sure you could explain to your firm why you needed to drop one secondary journal to focus on your grades. I doubt that two illustrious semesters of cite-checking the family law journal will really be the difference between them wanting to employ you and otherwise.
At the schools I've been at, the journal has the authority to force the information, if it's necessary for some reason. Given the amount of headache someone quitting would cause, I can pretty much guarantee that any editorial board would take the time. My secondary did it once last year - a 3L didn't get his Comment done, so his journal membership was revoked, the employer was contacted, etc. And this was after all of the staffer's cite-checking responsibilities were over (3Ls don't do any of that) - so the staffer's failure didn't actually inconvenience anyone.
Missing out on the cite-checking isn't going to be what would make an employer raise an eyebrow. It speaks to a person's ability to complete the tasks they have agreed to do - which is basically the #1 thing employers care about (and, for summer associates, one of the most frequent reasons for a no-offer is
taking on too many assignments and subsequently backing out of them - precisely what OP is going to do here). Employers care about a person's ability and desire to fulfill their obligations.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:54 pm
by Renzo
It would never, never, never have occured to me to join two journals, even if my school didn't forbid it. Why is TLS full of people who a) thought it would be a good idea, and b) are surprised when it turned out not to be.
Re: Dropping one of two secondary journals
Posted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 10:56 pm
by ToTransferOrNot
Renzo wrote:It would never, never, never have occured to me to join two journals, even if my school didn't forbid it. Why is TLS full of people who a) thought it would be a good idea, and b) are surprised when it turned out not to be.
I know someone who did Law Review (ended up EIC,) a secondary (ended up EIC,) and Moot Court.
Pretty sure that she's a robot. Great person, but a robot.