Reasonable_Man Departing Mid-Law for Small-Law Forum

[98234872348]

I do agree that there are some shitty law jobs in the fields you described, but I also know there are some people making damn good money in those fields. I personally would not want to work in those fields, but all hope is not lost either if that's where a person ends up.

I personally think that if you're making decent money, or, at least enough live comfortably, it shouldn't matter what you do, but then again I'm not an elitist, either.

[romothesavior]

I do agree that there are some shitty law jobs in the fields you described, but I also know there are some people making damn good money in those fields. I personally would not want to work in those fields, but all hope is not lost either if that's where a person ends up.

I personally think that if you're making decent money, or, at least enough live comfortably, it shouldn't matter what you do, but then again I'm not an elitist, either.

Hey! That makes two of us! Glad to have you aboard.

[badwithpseudonyms]

Yeah, I've lost sight of what my argument is. Anyway, $70k is pretty close to the lower end of the bimodal distribution. I'm not sure what the effect of IBR is, but it doesn't liquidate the debt, does it?

FWIW, while $70k is closer to the lower end, the median for c/o 2008 was $72k. And under IBR you can have your remaining debt forgiven after 10 years PI work or 25 years shitlaw.

[reasonable_man]

Yeah, I've lost sight of what my argument is. Anyway, $70k is pretty close to the lower end of the bimodal distribution. I'm not sure what the effect of IBR is, but it doesn't liquidate the debt, does it?

Not sure, but thanks for the vote of confidence. So far what I've gotten from you is that my salary was too low and I worked in shitlaw...

[mallard]

Yeah, I've lost sight of what my argument is. Anyway, $70k is pretty close to the lower end of the bimodal distribution. I'm not sure what the effect of IBR is, but it doesn't liquidate the debt, does it?

Not sure, but thanks for the vote of confidence. So far what I've gotten from you is that my salary was too low and I worked in shitlaw...

Oh, I like you. You know that. I think we were discussing the "biglaw or bust" mindset, not your situation. Honestly, you're been a consistently great and informative poster and I have no doubt that you do a far above average job of putting yourself in the right place at the right time.

[Renzo]

This thread somehow keeps getting more embarrassing.

Congrats, RM.

And with that, I'm out.

[bilbobaggins]

I love how pushing paper at a huge law firm for a huge corporation isn't considered "shit law." Sounds pretty shitty to me.

[mallard]

I love how pushing paper at a huge law firm for a huge corporation isn't considered "shit law." Sounds pretty shitty to me.

Me too. I find the distinction technical and academic, which is why I was surprised when people were offended.

[keg411]

TBF as much as it might pain some of the more skeptical TLSers out there, I work at a firm that is pretty comparable to this.

Many lawyers here work about 50 hours a week (although obviously that is subject to increase depending on their particular caseloads) and are compensated between 100k and 200k. GRANTED this firm really doesn't seem to be too keen on hiring recent graduates and prefers lawyers to lateral in with a couple of years of work experience, and some lawyers here lateraled from "big law" (although we're not talking firms like skadden or kirkland), but I am just saying. These kind of jobs, though likely rare, do exist. In addition, which the environment isn't all hugs and cheerfulness, everyone is very congenial and there isn't a sense of cutthroat competition in any measure of the phrase.

We don't have any unicorns though...

I have a family friend at one of these types of firms. It's mostly laterals (he's a lateral from another midlaw firm that fell apart after one of the partners died), but they'll take a few SA's every year (typically from the local schools, not from T14's; the firm doesn't even recruit at the T14's though every once in a while they'll get one). They start around $100k/year. Of course, the firm is also on the NLJ250, so maybe it's more like BigLaw, but I wouldn't particularly classify it as so from what I know about it.

[A'nold]

Congrats RM! Your past law firm is the exact definition of midlaw from what I've seen.

[Drummingreg]

Congrats RM!

I don't know if this has been answered but; do you think your opportunity for advancement/making partner is better at your new firm?

[reasonable_man]

Mallard.. No harm, no foul.

As for partnership.. I don't think that anyone can count on it. I think that I had a shot at the place I am leaving and I think that I have a shot at the place I am going to.. Though it seems like the new place might have a shorter partnership track..

[ggocat]

As for partnership.. I don't think that anyone can count on it. I think that I had a shot at the place I am leaving and I think that I have a shot at the place I am going to.. Though it seems like the new place might have a shorter partnership track..

3) More autonomy (I hate having a boss lol);

If partnership doesn't come relatively quickly, do you see yourself hanging a shingle or starting a small firm yourself?

[reasonable_man]

As for partnership.. I don't think that anyone can count on it. I think that I had a shot at the place I am leaving and I think that I have a shot at the place I am going to.. Though it seems like the new place might have a shorter partnership track..

3) More autonomy (I hate having a boss lol);

If partnership doesn't come relatively quickly, do you see yourself hanging a shingle or starting a small firm yourself?

I never rule out the idea of opening a small firm down the line. I have several friends who have often discussed opening a firm with together, but at this stage, I think some more time at a firm is a good idea. Its absolutely an option I would consider down the line.

[reasonable_man]

So this wound up being the best decision I have ever made. Less hours (both actual and billable), a really great boss. Lots of perks and free benefits. And an office overlooking the Hudson. It is possible to be happy as a lawyer. I had no idea; but it can be done. If I walk outside of my office and see a unicorn, I'll know this was all a dream and will promptly fix this post.

[seespotrun]

So this wound up being the best decision I have ever made. Less hours (both actual and billable), a really great boss. Lots of perks and free benefits. And an office overlooking the Hudson. It is possible to be happy as a lawyer. I had no idea; but it can be done. If I walk outside of my office and see a unicorn, I'll know this was all a dream and will promptly fix this post.

Good for you, reasonable_man!

[paratactical]

So this wound up being the best decision I have ever made. Less hours (both actual and billable), a really great boss. Lots of perks and free benefits. And an office overlooking the Hudson. It is possible to be happy as a lawyer. I had no idea; but it can be done. If I walk outside of my office and see a unicorn, I'll know this was all a dream and will promptly fix this post.

Congrats, man! I am really happy for you!

[reasonable_man]

Thanks. Its been great. Much more interesting work as well. How is Boston?

[paratactical]

Going pretty well in the job department. Definitely not the billable fest that NYC was for me.

[Blindmelon]

Congrats RM!

[reasonable_man]

Congrats RM!

Thanks man.. Its been great so far.

[bogart]

RM, you mentioned that you worked while in school. Given that you went to a lower ranked school in a tough market, was it networking or grades that got you your start?

[reasonable_man]

RM, you mentioned that you worked while in school. Given that you went to a lower ranked school in a tough market, was it networking or grades that got you your start?

I worked for 2 years before LS, while in college at a largeish (180 Lawyers), firm in NYC. I also worked for a solo in LS, continuing to build my resume. Both of those things lead to my getting a summer associate position at my old firm (80 or so lawyers in NYC), which then lead me to finding my new position. If not for my networking, multiple years of experience obtained before and during law school and the fact that I was willing to work non-stop both in and out of school during law school, I have no question in my mind that I would be an angry, unemployed (or under-employed), grad.

In short, especially ITE, if you're going to go to a TTT (or really anything out of the very top level of law schools), you better be willling to fight to get where you want to be.