Class of 2013 will be part of the "Lost Generation" Forum

[redsox]

You have the true makings of a lemming.

Explain.

[09042014]

I don't see the need to bullshit about the economy being bad forever. The truth is outside of the t14 + UCLA, Tex, Vandy, and USC, the majority of law students weren't getting well paying jobs even when shit was booming.

The only thing that changed is now half of T7-14 aren't getting them either.

Paying stick below CCN is a gamble. Paying Sticker below USC is financial suicide. If the economy gets better, below USC is still a huge fucking gamble.

[romothesavior]

--ImageRemoved--

[rando]

If you can't handle condescending attitudes and assholes, then you are in the wrong profession. Grow a tougher hide plebe. You say you have done the research. Yes I am sure you read a few books and articles. Good for you. Have you done any empirical research? Have you talked to recent grads, law firm HR managers or legal recruiters? Or do you take what your law school says as gospel? You have the true makings of a lemming. See this is the problem I forecast in the future. Many of you will be crying for a student loan bailout when you can't find jobs that will enable you to lead a normal life while serving your non-dischargeable student loans. I would sympathize for a bailout for the Classes of 2009 and 2010 moreso than the subsequent classes. At least the classes after 2010 had prior knowledge of the anemic economy and took the gamble/plunge anyway. That is reckless behavior that does not merit any taxpayer empathy or bailout.

You justify being an asshole by saying that there are asshole lawyers out there?

Empirical research? Do you know what that means? It does not mean talking to recent grads etc.

And you follow this with going on a rant about how we shouldn't get bailed out of our loans. Uhh, you started this thread. And no one is advocating the position that you are lambasting.

If you want to be taken seriously then you need to have at least a small grain of credibility. You make rash generalizations that make no sense to someone not taking out loans to go to school or to many of the TLS posters that are going to T14 schools with a very solid probability of entering a well-paying job upon graduation. Whether that is the right profession for each of us is a different question. But it is certainly not one for you to answer preemptively.

[lostjake]

I like the generalization TTTGrad does. Most people on this site, it seems, are either getting substantial scholarships at riskier schools, or attending schools with decent odds. Is it gambling? Sure. Are many of us already faced with years of unemployment/underemployment due to our undergraduate degrees, many of which were sought simply to proceed to the JD? Absolutely. For a lot of us, this situation blew up after we were dedicated to this track. It's hard, Junior year of undergrad, to decide that you're suddenly going to become an engineer, or a Doctor.

The assumption that we decided this year to become lawyers=Fail.

The assumption that we have better options= fail.

If you have 20K in undergrad loans and you're a humanities major you're still going to be on IBR for twenty years, or whatever. At least, for 90% of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_costs

[005618502]

I dont undestand why we, posters, give this guy our time with comments and feed back. He is probably some unemployed, fat, bald man who went to some Tier 4 law school. The only thing we do by providing comments and feedback is give him a good laugh as he sits at home waiting for his food stamps to come in the mail.

Obviously he does not take this site seriously or he wouldnt refer to us as "kids" and basically call us dumbasses. We should not be arguing with someone who provides 0 evidence to prove his point.... oh besides the fact that we are stupid.... and obviously he doesnt understand that many of us are going to schools T14 or UT, UCLA, Vandy with scholarships and actually going to succeed. Will it happen for everyone? no way.

And how is it that i have a test prep tutor who is a 3L at UT who is graduating below 30% (class rank) and has a job lined up at Jones Day to start out making 160,000 a year. Oh and he only has COL debt... roughly 30,000 i would say.

EDIT: damn i just gave into his game and tried to respond to him. Well so much for anything i just said

[Anonymous User]

Dude, face it; money or no money, jobs or no jobs, shit economy or great economy, being a lawyer is just what some people WANT to do...so yeah, some of us here are going to tell you where to stick it because we could care less that you're spewing the same story about risk over and over again. Personally, if I end up $150k in debt (with my scholly, I won't, BTW) and waiting tables with my J.D. I WILL NOT REGRET IT.

What the Hell would be the point of life if you never did shit you love because there was a lot of risk? Would it make a whole lot of sense break of your engagement to the love of your life just because some internet poster gave you really sobering divorce statistics?? Your warnings remind me a lot of when I used to go big wave surfing during black out conditions...people would warn me, over and over, how risky and dangerous it was. It was legitimate concern, I listened, I considered it; then I decided that it was WORTH THE RISK. Some people are going to decide the same way with law.

Cool story, bro. But we've heard it before. For most of us, we've considered this information closely and already made the decision based on a number of factors including (GASP!) ones that have nothing to do with statistics and job prospects.

[TTTGrad]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

[09042014]

I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days.

LOL what a clown you are.

[Bildungsroman]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

tl;dr

Although I think it could be properly summed up as the feeble wailing of the dried-out husk of a former man, degraded to dust by his own incompetence.

[dk8]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

you are incredibly stupid. everything you post is the exact same strawman-attacking screed. tell us more about how we'll be fucked if we aren't in the top quarter at Yale.

[daesonesb]

I like the generalization TTTGrad does. Most people on this site, it seems, are either getting substantial scholarships at riskier schools, or attending schools with decent odds. Is it gambling? Sure. Are many of us already faced with years of unemployment/underemployment due to our undergraduate degrees, many of which were sought simply to proceed to the JD? Absolutely. For a lot of us, this situation blew up after we were dedicated to this track. It's hard, Junior year of undergrad, to decide that you're suddenly going to become an engineer, or a Doctor.

The assumption that we decided this year to become lawyers=Fail.

The assumption that we have better options= fail.

If you have 20K in undergrad loans and you're a humanities major you're still going to be on IBR for twenty years, or whatever. At least, for 90% of them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_costs

FTW. Being in a small amount of debt does NOT make Law School more appealing. That 20k debt will be there if you do or if you don't go to law school, so it should not change anything at all.

Weigh law school based on its costs and benefits. Are you willing to pay the cost of law school, given that odds are you aren't gonna be making more than 60k a year?

That has to be a part of the decision making process. You need to be OK with being poor for a long time after law school. You need to understand that your mortgage and your debt repayments are probably gonna eat through around 50% of your after tax income, and that shit will be tight. If you are planning on having 3 or 4 kids with someone who wants to do the stay-at-home thing, odds are you won't have enough leftover cash to save for their college.

You may be one of the very few lucky ones, but the odds are not on your side, not even at a T-14.

This shit is serious, and I find it funny that "Get into T-14 or get a scholarship" is the best advice anyone gets or gives on this board.

[TTTGrad]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

[d34d9823]

Kids,

--ImageRemoved--

[Anonymous User]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

If TTTGrad is to be believed, our streets would be replete with BMWs driven by bus drivers and plumbers.

[General Tso]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

Big deal...dookie truck drivers in my city earn 286.5k to start, plus bonuses! Unfortunately they only interview bottom 25% Seton Hall school of law graduates

[daesonesb]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

Alright, I agree with your premise that law is being hit hard right now, but you are being a fucking toolshed. I tried to summarize the reasonable argument behind what you were saying, so that we could have an intelligent discussion, and you just went on with your dickish posturing.

Stop antagonizing people. It's a terrible way to get anyone to listen. It's a waste of time for you, me and everyone else here. If you have reasonable shit to say, go ahead and say it. Otherwise, get the hell out. There are better ways to get human contact in this world than verbally abusing strangers you don't know.

[09042014]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

Alright, I agree with your premise that law is being hit hard right now, but you are being a fucking toolshed. I tried to summarize the reasonable argument behind what you were saying, so that we could have an intelligent discussion, and you just went on with your dickish posturing.

Stop antagonizing people. It's a terrible way to get anyone to listen. It's a waste of time for you, me and everyone else here. If you have reasonable shit to say, go ahead and say it. Otherwise, get the hell out. There are better ways to get human contact in this world than verbally abusing strangers you don't know.

But he's a millionaire, listen to him.

[dk8]

While you kids cry in 3 years, bus drivers such as John Nelson (featured in the link below) will be banking $160K a year with no student loan debt. So much for the modern day prestige of a JD. I guess many of you (those that will strike out at OCI) will find shitlaw redeeming. After all, there is no shame in making $50-60K a year while working 2,100-2,300 hours per year.

http://host.madison.com/news/local/inte ... 03286.html

Alright, I agree with your premise that law is being hit hard right now, but you are being a fucking toolshed. I tried to summarize the reasonable argument behind what you were saying, so that we could have an intelligent discussion, and you just went on with your dickish posturing.

Stop antagonizing people. It's a terrible way to get anyone to listen. It's a waste of time for you, me and everyone else here. If you have reasonable shit to say, go ahead and say it. Otherwise, get the hell out. There are better ways to get human contact in this world than verbally abusing strangers you don't know.

lol at expecting this dude to have an intelligent conversation. he can't do anything but post anecdotal links and parrot JDU talking points verbatim.

[Mr. Matlock]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

Jesus fucking christ!!! When I grow old I hope I'm as cool a soft bitch as you! Oh WAIT! I am older, wife, kid, house, $$, and going to law school for free!!

Fuck off shit head!! I'll do whatever the fuck, when ever the fuck, I want!!!!!

*Lights cigar and blows smoke on crusty old shit-head's post*

[sluguy14]

[daesonesb]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

Jesus fucking christ!!! When I grow old I hope I'm as cool a soft bitch as you! Oh WAIT! I am older, wife, kid, house, $$, and going to law school for free!!

Fuck off shit head!! I'll do whatever the fuck, when ever the fuck, I want!!!!! *Lights cigar and blows smoke on crusty old shit-head's post*

Are you really? I always took you for a 20 something. I guess you are young at heart.

Edit: either that or my sarcasm detector is off today.

[06132010]

[Mr. Matlock]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

Jesus fucking christ!!! When I grow old I hope I'm as cool a soft bitch as you! Oh WAIT! I am older, wife, kid, house, $$, and going to law school for free!!

Fuck off shit head!! I'll do whatever the fuck, when ever the fuck, I want!!!!! *Lights cigar and blows smoke on crusty old shit-head's post*

Are you really? I always took you for a 20 something. I guess you are young at heart.

Edit: either that or my sarcasm detector is off today.

Nope, it's true, I'm an old man. Well, at least much older than most here. And I am enjoying a nice Rocky Patel Edge right now as well!! (Thanks for the young at heart line. I do try!!)

[vanwinkle]

Fair enough. I see many of you have drank the Kool-Aid and there is no sense in talking you out of making a grave mistake. The purpose of my post is to provide constructive notice so that later you kids won't cry "how were we supposed to know that a incurring debt to obtain a JD was a bad decision?" I intend to print these threads and save them for a time when a congressman/woman will attempt to grandstand on behalf of the middle-class to bail out the grads. I have paid millions in taxes throughout my lifetime and I will be damned if my taxpaying dollars will go to help some hapless kids that decided to take a reckless risk in going to law school to obtain what is essentially a worthless degree these days. If you are going to a T5 on a full ride (no conditions on the scholarship as "scholly" kids are placed in the same section so they can compete against each other, inevitably resulting in the loss of the scholarship), you are going to be fine. The rest of you will feel the wrath of this profession. Being a lawyer just to be a lawyer (or the tired justice seeker, pursuer of truth, voice for the voiceless dreck) is a poor excuse to tie yourself to indentured debt servitude for your life. Yes the economy is terrible. Going to law school is a cowards' way to hide from the recession. Not only is it cowardly, it will be the financial downfall for many of you. I hope the economy rebounds and that I am proven wrong. However, as a seasoned lawyer who has seen many things in his lifetime, our economy will only get worse. If you thought the housing bubble burst was bad, the student loan bubble bust will be worse. You have been warned.

Thanks to IBR, your tax dollars will be used to pay off my student debt, and you can't do anything to stop it. HTH.