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Do the Hamilton/Butler scholarships no longer exist? I can't find anything about them on the Columbia website anymore...

They definitely exist, but like many named scholarships, there aren't official pages on the school websites.

MrAdultman wrote:They definitely exist, but like many named scholarships, there aren't official pages on the school websites.

it's just odd because there actually was a page about them over the summer, and now it's gone

april_ludgate wrote:

MrAdultman wrote:They definitely exist, but like many named scholarships, there aren't official pages on the school websites.

it's just odd because there actually was a page about them over the summer, and now it's gone

Maybe they're renaming them? I'm sure Columbia isn't eliminating scholarships.

What's the general wisdom on the numbers you need for either of these scholarships? I'm at both 75ths, non-URM but don't know if/think that's enough...

cavalier1138 wrote:

april_ludgate wrote:

MrAdultman wrote:They definitely exist, but like many named scholarships, there aren't official pages on the school websites.

it's just odd because there actually was a page about them over the summer, and now it's gone

Maybe they're renaming them? I'm sure Columbia isn't eliminating scholarships.

Hopefully. They now have a whole list of scholarships, but all offered only to those who also qualify for financial aid. Frustrating for me as someone whose parents have money but won't give me any of it (already have loans from undergrad as well) and is really counting on some merit money

april_ludgate wrote:Hopefully. They now have a whole list of scholarships, but all offered only to those who also qualify for financial aid. Frustrating for me as someone whose parents have money but won't give me any of it (already have loans from undergrad as well) and is really counting on some merit money

Loans also qualify as financial aid. You're being overly paranoid.

virginia_direwoolf wrote:What's the general wisdom on the numbers you need for either of these scholarships? I'm at both 75ths, non-URM but don't know if/think that's enough...

I believe the general consensus is a 3.8+/174+ for a Hamilton, which would mean above both 75ths. Being at both 75ths probably gives you a good chance at a Butler, but there are plenty of threads on here that go into more detail than I can recall offhand.

EDIT: For a shot at a Hamilton, that is.

The Speed of Love wrote:

virginia_direwoolf wrote:What's the general wisdom on the numbers you need for either of these scholarships? I'm at both 75ths, non-URM but don't know if/think that's enough...

I believe the general consensus is a 3.8+/174+ for a Hamilton, which would mean above both 75ths. Being at both 75ths probably gives you a good chance at a Butler, but there are plenty of threads on here that go into more detail than I can recall offhand.

EDIT: For a shot at a Hamilton, that is.

You could also be Aaron Burr if you want a shot at a Hamilton.

I'll be here all week.

I thought that merit scholarships were evaluated separately. Are you saying that if you don't qualify for financial aid or fill out a FASA then you will not be considered for any merit scholarships? Is this true for all schools?

onecard wrote:I thought that merit scholarships were evaluated separately. Are you saying that if you don't qualify for financial aid or fill out a FASA then you will not be considered for any merit scholarships? Is this true for all schools?

It's not exactly that. The merit scholarships are qualifying that you must be eligible for financial aid because this is important for their accounting purposes. And this is an incredibly low bar to be qualified. When Columbia offers you a Hamilton scholarship, it will be contingent on meeting federal loan program acceptance based on your financial profile. You'll get the merit scholarship because of your application materials, but it's still somewhat contingent.

I see. Than this is not a true "merit" scholarship, since it also contingent on the applicants (and parents) financial profile. So someone with wealthy parents is not able to qualify for a scholarship at Columbia, no matter what their application looks like. Okay, although this does not seem quite fair. In college, one does not have to fill out a FASA in order to be offered money based on academics, the schools want top applicants and are willing to offer $ to get them, financial aid eligible or not. Do you know if this is true of all scholarships in the T13?

I'm pretty sure being eligible for financial aid in this context means only that you are qualified to take out loans, not that you show financial need. Students can take out loans for the cost of attendance regardless of their personal wealth, but they need to be eligible/qualified to take out loans - that is, they're a US citizen and they have good enough credit for the loan. So no, they're merit scholarships, not need-based.

onecard wrote:I see. Than this is not a true "merit" scholarship, since it also contingent on the applicants (and parents) financial profile. So someone with wealthy parents is not able to qualify for a scholarship at Columbia, no matter what their application looks like. Okay, although this does not seem quite fair. In college, one does not have to fill out a FASA in order to be offered money based on academics, the schools want top applicants and are willing to offer $ to get them, financial aid eligible or not. Do you know if this is true of all scholarships in the T13?

I am almost certain this is false. You may need to fill out FAFSA for technical reasons, but receiving the Hamilton / Butler is not in any way "contingent" on your financial profile, or anything to do with it whatsoever. Pretty sure the Hamilton and Butler are merit only.

My understanding is unnamed scholarships - not the Butler and Hamilton, as they're named - are technically a combination of merit and financial aid - but, even there, common knowledge is that the former is weighted far more heavily than the latter.

onecard wrote:I see. Than this is not a true "merit" scholarship, since it also contingent on the applicants (and parents) financial profile. So someone with wealthy parents is not able to qualify for a scholarship at Columbia, no matter what their application looks like. Okay, although this does not seem quite fair. In college, one does not have to fill out a FASA in order to be offered money based on academics, the schools want top applicants and are willing to offer $ to get them, financial aid eligible or not. Do you know if this is true of all scholarships in the T13?

Wow, you're really bad at understanding how financial aid works. It's not whether you would qualify for need-based aid, it's whether you would qualify for federally-backed loans generally. In order to get federally-backed loans, you have to fill out a FAFSA. So you can be offered a full ride merit scholarship based on your application, but you'll still have to qualify under federal programs in order for the school to qualify that tuition grant under that full ride tuition scholarship.

Edit: scooped by Nony

cavalier1138 wrote:

april_ludgate wrote:

MrAdultman wrote:They definitely exist, but like many named scholarships, there aren't official pages on the school websites.

it's just odd because there actually was a page about them over the summer, and now it's gone

Maybe they're renaming them? I'm sure Columbia isn't eliminating scholarships.

There was no page about them last year this time either. Maybe they put something up over the summer and took it down.

Great, thanks for the info. And yes, I never learned about how financial aid works, I was fortunate and I figured it was pointless since I knew I wouldn't be getting any. FWIW, I never filled out any applications for student aid when applying to college, and I did receive numerous $ awards, including two "free rides", perhaps they would have had me fill them out if I had accepted the offers? I ultimately wound up attending a school that did not offer any merit aid at all, so that ended my education about it. I am glad to have stumbled upon this thread, I will certainly be filling out those apps for law school. Thanks again for the help.

Pozzo wrote:

The Speed of Love wrote:

virginia_direwoolf wrote:What's the general wisdom on the numbers you need for either of these scholarships? I'm at both 75ths, non-URM but don't know if/think that's enough...

I believe the general consensus is a 3.8+/174+ for a Hamilton, which would mean above both 75ths. Being at both 75ths probably gives you a good chance at a Butler, but there are plenty of threads on here that go into more detail than I can recall offhand.

EDIT: For a shot at a Hamilton, that is.

You could also be Aaron Burr if you want a shot at a Hamilton.

I'll be here all week.

Petition to rename Columbia back to King's College.

Semi-related/unrelated: does anyone know if Columbia still hands out full tuition public interest scholarships? They have specific awards for graduating students but there was chatter a couple years ago on TLS about a scholarship that is awarded with admission/matriculation.

Is this still a thing? Also can't find anything on their website.

blerggggg wrote:Semi-related/unrelated: does anyone know if Columbia still hands out full tuition public interest scholarships? They have specific awards for graduating students but there was chatter a couple years ago on TLS about a scholarship that is awarded with admission/matriculation.

Is this still a thing? Also can't find anything on their website.

It was a thing as recent as last cycle. I don't think there was anything about it on their website then either.

Pozzo wrote:

The Speed of Love wrote:

virginia_direwoolf wrote:What's the general wisdom on the numbers you need for either of these scholarships? I'm at both 75ths, non-URM but don't know if/think that's enough...

I believe the general consensus is a 3.8+/174+ for a Hamilton, which would mean above both 75ths. Being at both 75ths probably gives you a good chance at a Butler, but there are plenty of threads on here that go into more detail than I can recall offhand.

EDIT: For a shot at a Hamilton, that is.

You could also be Aaron Burr if you want a shot at a Hamilton.

I'll be here all week.

I see you. No one else acknowledges your comedic genius but I see you.

Concrete info about these fellowships seems surprisingly hard to find, so wanted to follow up with a couple related questions here. Interested in info for named scholarships at both columbia and places like NYU/chicago. (Assuming you exceed the ~3.8/174 threshold above)

How important are softs for these types of fellowships, and what kinds of softs matter? Does prestige matter, or do they just want numbers + substance? Would a few years WE in, say, PI law be a huge boost? Could some WE (say, finance/IB) be a detriment?

Really, really, really stupid question - feel free to mock: there's no special app or anything to be considered for these fellowships, beyond the normal application, is there? Like you just submit the normal apps and LORs and paperwork and stuff, and if they admit you, they'll just tell you at that point if they've decided to give you a Hamilton etc.?

If I'm missing a thread that covers this stuff please direct my attention!

searching61 wrote:Concrete info about these fellowships seems surprisingly hard to find, so wanted to follow up with a couple related questions here. Interested in info for named scholarships at both columbia and places like NYU/chicago. (Assuming you exceed the ~3.8/174 threshold above)

How important are softs for these types of fellowships, and what kinds of softs matter? Does prestige matter, or do they just want numbers + substance? Would a few years WE in, say, PI law be a huge boost? Could some WE (say, finance/IB) be a detriment?

Really, really, really stupid question - feel free to mock: there's no special app or anything to be considered for these fellowships, beyond the normal application, is there? Like you just submit the normal apps and LORs and paperwork and stuff, and if they admit you, they'll just tell you at that point if they've decided to give you a Hamilton etc.?

If I'm missing a thread that covers this stuff please direct my attention!

I've also been scouring the internet about these scholarships. They keep this information as secretive as a Beyonce album release x(

No special application, I believe adm screens all apps and then cherry picks certain applications they think should be considered. As far as I can tell, there is no formula to the Butler/Hamilton other than being above both 75ths. My guess is that Columbia identifies students they think could go to HYS to then try to lure them with scholarship money. Also guessing they use the scholarships to diversify their incoming class. So I think the whole "will this soft help me" is irrelevant because they could cherry pick an application for any number of reasons. the scholarships are just mechanisms to inflate their medians and diversify the class (... which makes total sense).

The PI scholarship is even more hush hush. I'm hoping they don't limit students to being above 75th on both, because then I'm a goner. I know NYU has extended their PI scholarship to people at median, curious if Columbia (or any school that offers PI-focused scholarships) do the same.

blerggggg wrote: The PI scholarship is even more hush hush. I'm hoping they don't limit students to being above 75th on both, because then I'm a goner. I know NYU has extended their PI scholarship to people at median, curious if Columbia (or any school that offers PI-focused scholarships) do the same.

Based on what I know of Columbia's PI scholarship, I wouldn't compare it to the RTK. NYU admissions has nothing to do with RTK scholars; everyone who is admitted to the school and submits a statement of interest/LORs for RTK is considered for that scholarship by a totally independent committee that doesn't consider numbers in granting the scholarship.

This is all helpful, thanks, glad I'm not missing something obvious. Wasn't even aware of Columbia's PI fellowship, good to have on the radar