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My counselor told me that the way to get into corporate law is to have worked at a corporation. He said that every law school has a certain focus. Getting into a law school that focuses on big law is what I need to do, and the best way to do that is to have some work experience in a big corporation. Apparently, there are some things I should be learning about corporation or big companies by working in one, and a Law School focusing on Biglaw typically hires an applicant who does so.

Your counselor is an idiot. Well-intentioned, I'm sure. But an idiot.

If you want to work in biglaw, you want to go to the T14. If you want to go to the T14, you need a high LSAT and high GPA. You absolutely do not have to have corporate work experience to get into law school, and it has little-to-no effect when interviewing for biglaw jobs.

cavalier1138 wrote:Your counselor is an idiot. Well-intentioned, I'm sure. But an idiot.

Can't improve on this. Not only do biglaw firms not care whether you worked in a corporation, but it's unlikely that much substantive knowledge would transfer (particularly if you're only going to be there for six months or a year or something).

Your counselor doesn't know shit and should be fired.

It is a benefit to have this experience, but not for law school. You'll interview better, have connections that could be helpful and probably be better early in your career than a clone of you without the experience. For getting into law school, there's no value and everything I mentioned is unascertainable and theoretical (i.e. in many cases it will have 0 value).

No, it's not at all necessary. I mean, if you want to work in a corporation then go for it, but you do not NEED to.

I'm always astounded by how little pre-law advisors actually know about law school. It's almost like they've never attended law school or practiced law before.

Prelaw advisors and counsellors are inept.

Absolutely not.

In my opinion it's best not to take law school related advice from anyone who either hasn't gone to law school or hasn't been through the process of applying to law schools. From my experience most people who don't have the experience but still try giving advice have no idea what they're talking about. Occasionally you'll get good guidance but more often than not you'll get crap like what your advisor is spewing. Almost everything you need to know can be found somewhere on the Internet.

So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

only work experience I ever had was waiting tables and working at a children's trampoline park.

Your counselor is on bath salts.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

Law schools absolutely do care about your GPA. You can write an addendum, but it's still a low GPA. If you say "ya it's low, but that's because I was working as an undergrad", I don't think that shit's gonna fly.

Just get a high LSAT and get as high of a GPA as possible. Don't worry about everything else. Put yourself in the best position to get into a T-14/strong regional in an area you want to work in, and then you can decide whether you want to take a year off and work before going to law school.

Wolfie91 wrote:only work experience I ever had was waiting tables and working at a children's trampoline park.

Your counselor is on bath salts.

This is unfair to bath salts.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

Sure, other things matter. But not if your GPA and LSAT are too low for the school to accept you in the first place. So if you're a 169/3.8 applying to NYU, and I'm a 169/3.8 applying to NYU, my work experience might get me admitted over you. But if the difference was that we were exactly the same except for your having worked in a corporate setting and my having worked as a chef, then all bets are off.

Oh, and Yale, Stanford, and Berkeley can pretend that they "look beyond numbers" all they want. Their medians say otherwise.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

Like 95% of the time. The very very tip top schools can select people will great numbers AND great work experience/etc., but great numbers without anything else will take you a VERY long way, and great experience without great numbers will not.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

That's not just "the consensus on this forum." That's what the data actually bears out (check LSN).

Also I second the rec that your counselor needs to be fired. If that's the kind of advice you are getting than I shudder as to what he's been telling other students.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

To a large extent, the reviewers don't have complete control over whether to accept you. These things are strategized at different points of the year around the numbers. They're not interpreting your #'s as "well, the 3.3 is low but the resume shows they worked 20 hours a week so I'm going to treat the 3.3 like a 3.6". If you're below the #'s you're essentially automatically rejected unless you have something really special. Working hard isn't really special. The fact you may have been disadvantaged relative to wealthier students is unfair, but the reviewers aren't gods trying to make the world a fairer place. They are ordinary men and women just trying to hit their quota.

The schools you mentioned are all really GPA focused. It's rare anyone sub-3.8 gets in. Looking beyond the #'s doesn't mean they're taking a 3.3 over a 3.8 because the 3.3 provided for their family of Syrian refugees by working 60 hour weeks while in college. It means that it's possible a 4.0 180 will be rejected, because they come across as an asshole or a 3.8 170 may get in over a 4.0 175, because they' both hit the #'s, but the former seems more impressive.

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

Law schools care about three things, in this order:
LSAT
GPA
Everything else

lmao he shouldn't be fired because of it. Come on now. He's just stupid. It's not like he's intentionally trying to hijack this guy's chances of getting into law school. He just doesn't know any better.

Wolfie91 wrote:lmao he shouldn't be fired because of it. Come on now. He's just stupid. It's not like he's intentionally trying to hijack this guy's chances of getting into law school. He just doesn't know any better.

I also assume that this kids counselor may know one guy who worked a at a corp for a few years and then got good grades at a T2 and was one of the lucky ones to hustle and land biglaw. So he's extrapolating from that one datapoint

HonestAdvice wrote:

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

The schools you mentioned are all really GPA focused. It's rare anyone sub-3.8 gets in.

Uhh a 3.8 is higher than the 25th percentile GPA of all of those schools. a 3.8 is higher than Berkeley law's 50th percentile GPA.

pleaseberkeley wrote:

HonestAdvice wrote:

pleaseberkeley wrote:So Law Schools don't care about a low GPA due to working hours, any essays, letters of recommendations from professors, work experience or internships?

Is the general consensus on this board that letters and essays are there for a formalized process, but literally just get a high GPA and LSAT score? Like unless you are applying to Yale, Stanford, or Berkeley (the ones which I have heard actually look beyond numbers) just get as high of an LSAT and GPA possible? Nothing matters but GPA and LSAT correct?

The schools you mentioned are all really GPA focused. It's rare anyone sub-3.8 gets in.

Uhh a 3.8 is higher than the 25th percentile GPA of all of those schools. a 3.8 is higher than Berkeley law's 50th percentile GPA.

Yale's 25th is 3.86, with a median of 3.93. Stanford's is a 3.78 with a 3.89 median. So a 3.8 is barely above Stanford's 25th, and it isn't above Yale's.

I'm not quite sure what your goal is in this thread. Do you want someone to pat you on the head and tell you that your application will be extra-special? That you'll get in through sheer moxie and charm? Because that isn't happening.

Wolfie91 wrote:lmao he shouldn't be fired because of it. Come on now. He's just stupid. It's not like he's intentionally trying to hijack this guy's chances of getting into law school. He just doesn't know any better.

Complete incompetence is a very good reason to fire someone. The reason college is so expensive is because people like this guy never get fired.

If a lawyer told you that two spouses can't be convicted of the same crime, would you remain his client?

philepistemer wrote:

Wolfie91 wrote:lmao he shouldn't be fired because of it. Come on now. He's just stupid. It's not like he's intentionally trying to hijack this guy's chances of getting into law school. He just doesn't know any better.

Complete incompetence is a very good reason to fire someone. The reason college is so expensive is because people like this guy never get fired.

If a lawyer told you that two spouses can't be convicted of the same crime, would you remain his client?

An isolated instance where his counselor was trying to give a student advice to get work experience does not warrant the counselor being fired, no. Most of us agree that work experience is credited before heading off to law school. His counselor extrapolated this notion by saying it was necessary to get into a good school, and he was wrong.

No, don't fire the guy. Let him know what we said for future reference. What the fuck.