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Focus on the LSAT for now. None of these questions can be answered until you have a real score to work with.

Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Barack O'Drama wrote:Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Not necessarily true. I had a much lower GPA and got into a number of T14s with money. LSAT was 16x

GreekOmega12 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Not necessarily true. I had a much lower GPA and got into a number of T14s with money. LSAT was 16x

Oh there are absolutely exceptions! I just am giving numbers to be "safe" if you will and tried to tie the numbers to those who received any $$$ scholarships. But you are 100% right. My friend who is a URM applied last cycle with a 3.2 and a 167 and broke into the T14. He did get rejected and waitlisted from Berkley on down. The URM/splitter cycles are so unpredictable it is always hard to say. Though URM boost, good softs, and a good overall app can work magic!

Echoing the others. Focus on getting the best score possible first!

With your GPA, I think you have a very good shot at getting into a T-14 if you have an LSAT score above 165. Unless you have an LSAT that's 170+, your chances at getting a full ride at any of the T-14 (even T-25 schools) are very unlikely.

You can make your 3.4 work. As a URM, a 3.4 is not at all a death sentence. AND schools love an upward GPA trend (Admissions Dean of Duke - Dean Hoye told me that during my interview). I'd highly recommend writing a GPA addendum to go with your application, just so it's obvious that your lower GPA is a result of your STEM classes.

Barack O'Drama wrote:

GreekOmega12 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Not necessarily true. I had a much lower GPA and got into a number of T14s with money. LSAT was 16x

Oh there are absolutely exceptions! I just am giving numbers to be "safe" if you will and tried to tie the numbers to those who received any $$$ scholarships. But you are 100% right. My friend who is a URM applied last cycle with a 3.2 and a 167 and broke into the T14. He did get rejected and waitlisted from Berkley on down. The URM/splitter cycles are so unpredictable it is always hard to say. Though URM boost, good softs, and a good overall app can work magic!

Okay, well let's assume the best AND worst case scenario.
What are your responses to the original post if I get a 165 vs a 170?
Understanding that these would be drastically different scenarios, of course.

eli_1812 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:

GreekOmega12 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Not necessarily true. I had a much lower GPA and got into a number of T14s with money. LSAT was 16x

Oh there are absolutely exceptions! I just am giving numbers to be "safe" if you will and tried to tie the numbers to those who received any $$$ scholarships. But you are 100% right. My friend who is a URM applied last cycle with a 3.2 and a 167 and broke into the T14. He did get rejected and waitlisted from Berkley on down. The URM/splitter cycles are so unpredictable it is always hard to say. Though URM boost, good softs, and a good overall app can work magic!

Okay, well let's assume the best AND worst case scenario.
What are your responses to the original post if I get a 165 vs a 170?
Understanding that these would be drastically different scenarios, of course.

I can give you some predictions, but they are not going to be very helpful for a couple reasons. One problem is the sample size of URMS is relatively small and even going to mylsn.info, I am not seeing a whole lot in the way of these numbers. In any case, I'll give you a good idea of what you're going to need to have a shot at getting in. This is assuming the rest of your app is golden (LOR, PS, DS, Why x)

So lets see how you'd fair with a 170.

I think you're likely to be out at Y and S. I can't even say you'd get in with a 180. (Although with that you never know?)

You could have a shot at H with a 170. I would say a coin's flip chance. Definitely worth applying to!

Columbia, Chicago, NYU. Likely in play with a 170. You'll probably snag 2/3.

As for the rest of the T14 You have a better than coin's flip chance with a 170. Again, splitter cycles and URM cycles in particular are so strange sometimes, so no one can say for sure. But I would bet money with a 170 you could probably get the rest of the T14. You likely won't get be looking at any full ride scholarships, but perhaps $ from the lower T14.

Now let's say you get a 165.

HYS likely out of play.

CCN I would guess with a 165 you would get 1/3 of these schools. Maybe even 2. I know a urm that got Columbia and NYU with a 3.14 and 165. So you can feel confident you can snag one or two of these.

And you'll likely be in play for the rest of the T14.

The main difference between the 165-170 is going to be amount and chances of scholarships from the schools you do get admitted to. And of course, the chances are going to increase BIG TIME! Also, to be honest I think without a 170+ you chances are Harvard become really low.

Again, this is all speculation and I just literally went to mylsn and plugged in the numbers. And while someone may reply to this post with "I got in with a 3.4/164) understand that they are outliers. It could be a stellar LOR/PS/Interview, or amazing work experience. Or maybe they just got the right adcomm to read their app first. Too many variables honestly to make any solid predictions.

Just focus on getting that 170. If you can land a high 160s score, you should be ok. But if you want T6, 170+ is the way to go.

Barack O'Drama wrote:

eli_1812 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:

GreekOmega12 wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Yeah, as Nacho said, it would be hard to say without a solid LSAT score.

With a 3.4 it will be an uphill battle to enter the T14 and even more challenging to get T6. Even as a URM, the top schools tend to have GPA floors.

Focus on the LSAT. You will likely need a high 170s to break into the T6, especially in you want scholarships. Go to mylsn.info and you can play around with some numbers.

Good luck

Not necessarily true. I had a much lower GPA and got into a number of T14s with money. LSAT was 16x

Oh there are absolutely exceptions! I just am giving numbers to be "safe" if you will and tried to tie the numbers to those who received any $$$ scholarships. But you are 100% right. My friend who is a URM applied last cycle with a 3.2 and a 167 and broke into the T14. He did get rejected and waitlisted from Berkley on down. The URM/splitter cycles are so unpredictable it is always hard to say. Though URM boost, good softs, and a good overall app can work magic!

Okay, well let's assume the best AND worst case scenario.
What are your responses to the original post if I get a 165 vs a 170?
Understanding that these would be drastically different scenarios, of course.

I can give you some predictions, but they are not going to be very helpful for a couple reasons. One problem is the sample size of URMS is relatively small and even going to mylsn.info, I am not seeing a whole lot in the way of these numbers. In any case, I'll give you a good idea of what you're going to need to have a shot at getting in. This is assuming the rest of your app is golden (LOR, PS, DS, Why x)

So lets see how you'd fair with a 170.

I think you're likely to be out at Y and S. I can't even say you'd get in with a 180. (Although with that you never know?)

You could have a shot at H with a 170. I would say a coin's flip chance. Definitely worth applying to!

Columbia, Chicago, NYU. Likely in play with a 170. You'll probably snag 2/3.

As for the rest of the T14 You have a better than coin's flip chance with a 170. Again, splitter cycles and URM cycles in particular are so strange sometimes, so no one can say for sure. But I would bet money with a 170 you could probably get the rest of the T14. You likely won't get be looking at any full ride scholarships, but perhaps $ from the lower T14.

Now let's say you get a 165.

HYS likely out of play.

CCN I would guess with a 165 you would get 1/3 of these schools. Maybe even 2. I know a urm that got Columbia and NYU with a 3.14 and 165. So you can feel confident you can snag one or two of these.

And you'll likely be in play for the rest of the T14.

The main difference between the 165-170 is going to be amount and chances of scholarships from the schools you do get admitted to. And of course, the chances are going to increase BIG TIME! Also, to be honest I think without a 170+ you chances are Harvard become really low.

Again, this is all speculation and I just literally went to mylsn and plugged in the numbers. And while someone may reply to this post with "I got in with a 3.4/164) understand that they are outliers. It could be a stellar LOR/PS/Interview, or amazing work experience. Or maybe they just got the right adcomm to read their app first. Too many variables honestly to make any solid predictions.

Just focus on getting that 170. If you can land a high 160s score, you should be ok. But if you want T6, 170+ is the way to go.

awesome answer, for what it's worth. thanks a ton!

Nachoo2019 wrote:Focus on the LSAT for now. None of these questions can be answered until you have a real score to work with.

Okay, well let's assume the best AND worst case scenario.
What are your responses to the original post if I get a 165 vs a 170?
Understanding that these would be drastically different scenarios, of course.

eli_1812 wrote:

Nachoo2019 wrote:Focus on the LSAT for now. None of these questions can be answered until you have a real score to work with.

Okay, well let's assume the best AND worst case scenario.
What are your responses to the original post if I get a 165 vs a 170?
Understanding that these would be drastically different scenarios, of course.

O'Drama hit the nail on the head with his post! I would have to echo everything he said