Why do people love to hate GULC? Forum

[runinthefront]

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[eriedoctrine]

i don't see gulc as being significantly underperforming its peer schools vandy and ut
from a pure placement perspective, that is

Actually, Vandy's latest employment numbers on LST have a slight edge of GULC.

BL + CL at GULC: 46.5%
BL + CL at Vandy: 45.1%

BUT when you factor in all types of employment (including public interest, gov., and small firm work like nealric wants to factor in) Vandy has a score of 85.9% to GULC's 83.7%.

Almost double the percentage of fed clerks, lower unemployment score, and way lower COL and more generous scholarships. GULC needs to get it together and slash their class size.

Eh, you have to take into consideration the location of the jobs as well. DC>TN, and 20% stay in TN.

[baal hadad]

i don't see gulc as being significantly underperforming its peer schools vandy and ut
from a pure placement perspective, that is

Actually, Vandy's latest employment numbers on LST have a slight edge of GULC.

BL + CL at GULC: 46.5%
BL + CL at Vandy: 45.1%

BUT when you factor in all types of employment (including public interest, gov., and small firm work like nealric wants to factor in) Vandy has a score of 85.9% to GULC's 83.7%.

Almost double the percentage of fed clerks, lower unemployment score, and way lower COL and more generous scholarships. GULC needs to get it together and slash their class size.

Eh, you have to take into consideration the location of the jobs as well. DC>TN, and 20% stay in TN.

Depends what you want to do

If you want to work in healthcare tn is a great place to be

[baal hadad]

Also DC is a fetid swampy shithole

[FKASunny]

Also, it's not like Tennessee was a backup for those 20%. It's really hard to land a gig in Nashville, even from top of the class at vandy

[stellina]

Personally, I'd pick Vandy bc of its more national reach.

GULC's fairly regional: it only places 34% of their grads outside of their top 3 most frequent destinations. Vandy places 58%.

QED.

[JCougar]

GULC - A good school whose employment numbers are under performing relative to its peer schools.

i actually disagree

i don't see gulc as being significantly underperforming its peer schools vandy and ut
from a pure placement perspective, that is

I feel like no one has acknowledged this sly dig at GULC and I feel like it should be acknowledged even if it is obvious

I was about to acknowledge it yesterday, but then got distracted by some real work. I thought it was pretty clever.

[Moneytrees]

Legitimate question- if Georgetown's median drops to 167 as many have predicted, can we expect any sort of reaction by the administration? Will we finally see a smaller class and a shift towards better scholarship offers? Prestige and reputation alone are not realistically going to keep Georgetown's medians at t14 levels.

It's been discussed that Georgetown just doesn't care about what other schools are offering, scholarship wise. But can't the administration see that this strategy could eventually lead to lower medians? Do they not foresee that if something doesn't change, Vandy/UCLA/UT will likely all be considered legitimate peers, if not straight up better schools, in 10 years time? Maybe they are just banking that relative prestige will keep Georgetown ahead of the pack. Or maybe they just don't give a fuck.

[JCougar]

Also DC is an overpriced, fetid swampy shithole

FTFY

[JCougar]

Legitimate question- if Georgetown's median drops to 167 as many have predicted, can we expect any sort of reaction by the administration? Will we finally see a smaller class and a shift towards better scholarship offers? Prestige and reputation alone are not realistically going to keep Georgetown's medians at t14 levels.

It's been discussed that Georgetown just doesn't care about what other schools are offering, scholarship wise. But can't the administration see that this strategy could eventually lead to lower medians? Do they not foresee that if something doesn't change, Vandy/UCLA/UT will likely all be considered legitimate peers, if not straight up better schools, in 10 years time? Maybe they are just banking that relative prestige will keep Georgetown ahead of the pack. Or maybe they just don't give a fuck.

I doubt it. GTTTown has significant endowment problems (in that it barely has one). They have to fund their overpriced faculty salaries and meager scholarships via cross-subsidized tuition from admitting a ton of students that pay sticker.

I doubt they want their median to drop...the problem is that they just have no other choice right now.

[20141023]

.

[Moneytrees]

Legitimate question- if Georgetown's median drops to 167 as many have predicted, can we expect any sort of reaction by the administration? Will we finally see a smaller class and a shift towards better scholarship offers? Prestige and reputation alone are not realistically going to keep Georgetown's medians at t14 levels.

It's been discussed that Georgetown just doesn't care about what other schools are offering, scholarship wise. But can't the administration see that this strategy could eventually lead to lower medians? Do they not foresee that if something doesn't change, Vandy/UCLA/UT will likely all be considered legitimate peers, if not straight up better schools, in 10 years time? Maybe they are just banking that relative prestige will keep Georgetown ahead of the pack. Or maybe they just don't give a fuck.

I doubt it. GTTTown has significant endowment problems (in that it barely has one). They have to fund their overpriced faculty salaries and meager scholarships via cross-subsidized tuition from admitting a ton of students that pay sticker.

I doubt they want their median to drop...the problem is that they just have no other choice right now.

Interesting. Yeah, that makes sense. Why is it that they have endowment problems?

[arklaw13]

Also, it's not like Tennessee was a backup for those 20%. It's really hard to land a gig in Nashville, even from top of the class at vandy

Can confirm. Got more callbacks in DC than in Nashville.

[JCougar]

Legitimate question- if Georgetown's median drops to 167 as many have predicted, can we expect any sort of reaction by the administration? Will we finally see a smaller class and a shift towards better scholarship offers? Prestige and reputation alone are not realistically going to keep Georgetown's medians at t14 levels.

It's been discussed that Georgetown just doesn't care about what other schools are offering, scholarship wise. But can't the administration see that this strategy could eventually lead to lower medians? Do they not foresee that if something doesn't change, Vandy/UCLA/UT will likely all be considered legitimate peers, if not straight up better schools, in 10 years time? Maybe they are just banking that relative prestige will keep Georgetown ahead of the pack. Or maybe they just don't give a fuck.

I doubt it. GTTTown has significant endowment problems (in that it barely has one). They have to fund their overpriced faculty salaries and meager scholarships via cross-subsidized tuition from admitting a ton of students that pay sticker.

I doubt they want their median to drop...the problem is that they just have no other choice right now.

Interesting. Yeah, that makes sense. Why is it that they have endowment problems?

Historically, they were just poor with fundraising and managing their money. That started to change maybe 15 years ago or so, but by then, well, time value of money...other peer schools were way ahead of them.

Their business model as a law school is basically a result of their lack of endowment. The only way they can spend lavishly like other T14s is by admitting a gigantic class where most people pay sticker, and then by admitting a bunch of transfer students after 1L. Of course, now that national sticker price has jumped the shark at all law schools, and accurate employment data is now a lot easier to access, they can't afford to match the discounts other schools are handing out.

This isn't just a one-year problem for GTown. It's going to be an ongoing problem from here on out. It's going to take some strategic/creative thinking on their part to keep the "T14" intact in the near future.

FWIW, George Washington is in a similar bind.

[03152016]

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leit ... _scho.html
outdated but interesting

[JCougar]

http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leit ... _scho.html
outdated but interesting

Yeah, I've seen that before. I wish we could get an updated version. The blog post is from 2006, but the numbers are from 2000.

[BigZuck]

Cougs, how do you know that historically they were bad with money and things changed 15 years ago? Not saying you're wrong but where did you get that/how do you know so much about GULC's history?

[JCougar]

Wow...one thing I forgot about was how ND was on that list. And yet they're still stingy with scholarships, to the point where their median has significantly declined.

[JCougar]

Cougs, how do you know that historically they were bad with money and things changed 15 years ago? Not saying you're wrong but where did you get that/how do you know so much about GULC's history?

http://georgetownvoice.com/2009/09/24/g ... d-footing/

That article relates to the parent university. The law school's own endowment, when considered separately, isn't as bad as I thought it was (although it's still bad when you consider $ per student), but this gives one reason to believe that they probably get 0 help from the parent university.

[BigZuck]

Cougs, how do you know that historically they were bad with money and things changed 15 years ago? Not saying you're wrong but where did you get that/how do you know so much about GULC's history?

http://georgetownvoice.com/2009/09/24/g ... d-footing/

That article relates to the parent university. The law school's own endowment, when considered separately, isn't as bad as I thought it was (although it's still bad when you consider $ per student), but this gives one reason to believe that they probably get 0 help from the parent university.

Thanks

Yeah, the Dean was crying poor when I met him, guess there might have been some truth to what he was saying. Quite the pickle.

[baal hadad]

Cougs, how do you know that historically they were bad with money and things changed 15 years ago? Not saying you're wrong but where did you get that/how do you know so much about GULC's history?

http://georgetownvoice.com/2009/09/24/g ... d-footing/

That article relates to the parent university. The law school's own endowment, when considered separately, isn't as bad as I thought it was (although it's still bad when you consider $ per student), but this gives one reason to believe that they probably get 0 help from the parent university.

Thanks

Yeah, the Dean was crying poor when I met him, guess there might have been some truth to what he was saying. Quite the pickle.

so u r saying the Dean is not well endowed

[BigZuck]

Cougs, how do you know that historically they were bad with money and things changed 15 years ago? Not saying you're wrong but where did you get that/how do you know so much about GULC's history?

http://georgetownvoice.com/2009/09/24/g ... d-footing/

That article relates to the parent university. The law school's own endowment, when considered separately, isn't as bad as I thought it was (although it's still bad when you consider $ per student), but this gives one reason to believe that they probably get 0 help from the parent university.

Thanks

Yeah, the Dean was crying poor when I met him, guess there might have been some truth to what he was saying. Quite the pickle.

so u r saying the Dean is not well endowed

I mean, he didn't just plop his endowment right down on the table. But that's the sense I got, yeah

[UnicornHunter]

WoTC beat you to it:




In all seriousness, there are scenarios where it would make sense to go to the Law Center. Examples I can think of:

1) Government employees who are interested in the part time program.
2) People with no DC area ties who a) want to work in DC and b) would rather be unemployed than work in NYC and c)did not get into UVA and d) have some reason not to care about the cost of law school (scholly, family, GI bill, etc...)

[20141023]

.

[UnicornHunter]

1) Government employees who are interested in the part time program.
2) People with no DC area ties who a) want to work in DC and b) would rather be unemployed than work in NYC and c)did not get into UVA and d) have some reason not to care about the cost of law school (scholly, family, GI bill, etc...)

lol who are these people?

Maybe not long term unemployed, just be cooler with not having a job at graduation than doing NYC big law.

The point is they are few and far between.