Top Law Schools

I'm sure there are a lot of threads like this but I truly have no idea. I was hoping for a higher score so I would know where I had a good shot, a bit disappointed with a 170 (I was practicing fairly consistently at 174-178). I scored -4 RC, -5 LR, -2 LG, -2 LR. I have a 3.97 GPA, but from a small private school in California (The Master's College). The school has a great academic reputation, but wouldn't have any samples for top law schools to go off when looking at my GPA (I think one grad went to Duke, that is as good as anyone has done, the Pre-Law program is very small).

Other aspects of my application:
- International (Canada) but not URM
- Ample work experience. I have owned a business for the past 3 years and have a lot of interesting clients, many in the legal industry.
- Soon to be published author (work-related). Currently co-authoring a book on marketing with other industry pros.
- Limited volunteer work, I really haven't had time to commit to anything steady. A few hours each summer.

I am most interested in Intellectual Property and Real Estate as far as areas of law go, and would like to practice on the US West Coast (Washington/Oregon). I was initially shooting for Stanford (of course, I would have considered Harvard and Yale with a higher score), but am also interested in Columbia, Georgetown, NYU, Berkeley, and Washington (WA).

I know little to nothing about schools besides what I have read in rankings, I don't think I actually know one person who has made it to law school. Is it possible I could still get into some of my target schools with a 170? Would it be a waste to apply to some of them? Does anyone else have any other schools they would recommend (US or Canada) for someone in my LSAT/GPA range? I will try to get into the best school I can, but financial aid will also need to be a consideration.

Also, the tutor I worked with sort of suggested I retake in September, since I have consistently been scoring in the 175+ range. The thought of that is a bit sickening, I worked very hard and improved from an initial diagnostic of 158 to 170 so I just can't imagine putting in all that work again to try to raise it by a few tough points. Thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

canuckabroad wrote:I'm sure there are a lot of threads like this but I truly have no idea. I was hoping for a higher score so I would know where I had a good shot, a bit disappointed with a 170 (I was practicing fairly consistently at 174-178). I scored -4 RC, -5 LR, -2 LG, -2 LR. I have a 3.97 GPA, but from a small private school in California (The Master's College). The school has a great academic reputation, but wouldn't have any samples for top law schools to go off when looking at my GPA (I think one grad went to Duke, that is as good as anyone has done, the Pre-Law program is very small).

Other aspects of my application:
- International (Canada) but not URM
- Ample work experience. I have owned a business for the past 3 years and have a lot of interesting clients, many in the legal industry.
- Soon to be published author (work-related). Currently co-authoring a book on marketing with other industry pros.
- Limited volunteer work, I really haven't had time to commit to anything steady. A few hours each summer.

I am most interested in Intellectual Property and Real Estate as far as areas of law go, and would like to practice on the US West Coast (Washington/Oregon). I was initially shooting for Stanford (of course, I would have considered Harvard and Yale with a higher score), but am also interested in Columbia, Georgetown, NYU, Berkeley, and Washington (WA).

I know little to nothing about schools besides what I have read in rankings, I don't think I actually know one person who has made it to law school. Is it possible I could still get into some of my target schools with a 170? Would it be a waste to apply to some of them? Does anyone else have any other schools they would recommend (US or Canada) for someone in my LSAT/GPA range? I will try to get into the best school I can, but financial aid will also need to be a consideration.

Also, the tutor I worked with sort of suggested I retake in September, since I have consistently been scoring in the 175+ range. The thought of that is a bit sickening, I worked very hard and improved from an initial diagnostic of 158 to 170 so I just can't imagine putting in all that work again to try to raise it by a few tough points. Thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

If you were scoring in the 175+ range then it's worth retaking. Apply to the entire T14 and some lower ranked schools for scholarship and leverage purposes.

^Agree with what he said. Good luck.

Still worth retaking for Stanford? As much as I'd love to get in to Harvard, Stanford is probably my top choice anyway...

170->175+ will matter so retake and apply to the entire T14. Even if you don't retake, apply to the entire T14. But you should retake.

Definitely worth a retake if Stanford's your top choice. It'd be worth it even if Stanford wasn't. It's almost always worth it to retake.

yep retake
stanford emphasizes gpa, sure
but 170 is still below median

Will I get into Columbia with a 170? I have very strong work experience plus some volunteer work.

You will likely get into Columbia. But you won't get any merit $ from there.

You would be crazy not to retake. You've demonstrated an ability to better than 170. And just a few more points will make you competitive at Stanford and Harvard, and in the running for better scholarships everywhere else. Those scholarships really matter. Columbia at full-price is basically a rejection because its clearly not worth its sticker price.

canuckabroad wrote:Still worth retaking for Stanford? As much as I'd love to get in to Harvard, Stanford is probably my top choice anyway...

It's definitely worth retaking for all schools, especially since you've performed consistently better in practice. It's not just about better chances at YHS; as others have said, it's also about potentially having ~$215K less debt from your other options at the beginning of repayment. With even just a jump to a 173, you'd be a virtual lock at Harvard, and you'd very likely have more than one full-ride offer in the T14.

Be aware, by the way, that it's "easier" to get into Harvard than Stanford, despite the latter's lower medians. Numbers are far less predictive at S than at H; with its tiny class size, S can afford to weigh non-numerical factors much more heavily.

nerd1 wrote:You will likely get into Columbia. But you won't get any merit $ from there.

wat


But yeah, based on your score range, I would retake.

nerd1 wrote:You will likely get into Columbia. But you won't get any merit $ from there.

Just wanted to kind of disagree with this. I was accepted to Columbia this year with 60k, and have a 170/3.7x. That said, I really do think they take need into account, so...

Also, retake.

Quick update:

I talked with Spivey because I was interested in how the other aspects of my application may be viewed. Karen was optimistic about my work experience distinguishing me from typical K-JD students, and said I am considered an International student (Canada) so might get a bit of a boost there. In addition, my LSAC GPA will actually be higher than I thought, since I did a semester of straight A+ in Canada (likely around a 4.03 when it is all put together).

Considering a retake, but may just adjust my goals and go for it. When I started my undergrad, I would have been happy getting into even Washington or Oregon, to even have a shot at Stanford/Columbia etc. is awesome.

Quick update:

I talked with Spivey because I was interested in how the other aspects of my application may be viewed. Karen was optimistic about my work experience distinguishing me from typical K-JD students, and said I am considered an International student (Canada) so might get a bit of a boost there. In addition, my LSAC GPA will actually be higher than I thought, since I did a semester of straight A+ in Canada (likely around a 4.03 when it is all put together).

Considering a retake, but may just adjust my goals and go for it. When I started my undergrad, I would have been happy getting into even Washington or Oregon, to even have a shot at Stanford/Columbia etc. is awesome.

Since you were PT'ing at 174-178, making a decision to not retake could cost you anywhere from $10k-$160k. 175+/4.03 would be considered for a bunch of named scholarships over a 170/4.03 (congrats on the high GPA btw).

You still have a chance at Stanford and a chance at Columbia, but there's no need to adjust your goals. You can potentially make a huge amount of money (through scholarships) by spending the next two months studying and taking a 100 question multiple choice test.

Given that a retake really can't hurt you, there's no reason not to.