q Forum

[muggman2015]

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[lastsamurai]

Wow those are some pretty serious C&F issues I think. Better focus on nailing that LSAT and definitely owning up to those past issues in at least an addendum. I know schools typically don't worry as much about one off lighter infractions, but I'm not sure how they'd feel about those.

That said, I think that if anyone could overcome big C&F issues, it would be a URM with a 3.9+ and strong LSAT. You should also check out the criteria for passing the Bar exam in whichever jurisdiction you plan to practice.

[muggman2015]

The seriousness is what worries me. Im PT'ing around 172, testing next month. SEveral of my undergrad Profs and all of my recommenders are aware of these cases as well. Does is not show some sort of determination and resolve top overcome such challenges yet still present such numbers? Two of my advisors are bar admitted and channeled me towards the community work in efforts to mitigate.

[Magical Trevor]

The really important part isn't the law school acceptance, it's the bar admission. You need to figure out where you want to practice and start looking at those requirements and try to contact people who are actually involved in that process.

[muggman2015]

Thats what I have been under the impression of as well. Thank you. By the time I'm up for the bar, 2018, these instances will be nearly ten years old. I haven't been in any thing remotely close to trouble since.

[lizaregina]

The seriousness is what worries me. Im PT'ing around 172, testing next month. SEveral of my undergrad Profs and all of my recommenders are aware of these cases as well. Does is not show some sort of determination and resolve top overcome such challenges yet still present such numbers? Two of my advisors are bar admitted and channeled me towards the community work in efforts to mitigate.

I don't know if it shows a determination to overcome challenges when you're the one that created the challenges tbh. But I do think the numbers show a refocusing in a positive direction.

[muggman2015]

The cases are a reflection of the challenges, not the challenges themselves. Product of the environment. While I'm solely responsible for my actions, i doubt many could grow up where i grew up and have those numbers.

[muggman2015]

or even make it through undergrad. Does a smoker beating lung cancer not demonstrate determination?

[lizaregina]

or even make it through undergrad. Does a smoker beating lung cancer not demonstrate determination?

No, it shows they have a form of lung cancer that is responsive to treatment.

Sure, overcoming less fortunate circumstances does take determination (in part) and your crimes show a stumble in the road toward overcoming. But they themselves are not evidence of determination.

Or, to use your analogy, you smoked and got cancer as a result of your smoking but you're rehabilitated and now you've quit smoking and are focused on staying healthy/getting healthier.

[SemperLegal]

The cases are a reflection of the challenges, not the challenges themselves. Product of the environment. While I'm solely responsible for my actions, i doubt many could grow up where i grew up and have those numbers.

You don't have numbers. You have a number, a GPA. Practice scores are worth nothing.

I would be concerned about applications because you went from Aggravated assault A to a concealed firearm, people who work at law school are: 1) Risk adverse, 2) terrified of the existence of firearms.

I would try to put a little more distance between you and those charges by working at-risk mentoring program run by the state or a university, especially if you had some minor charges as a juvenile. Adcomms and Bar examiners are naive idealists, but it doesn't take a much experience in the real world to detect red flags in an organization dedicated to at-risk and disadvantaged youth run by someone with youthful charges of violence and weapons possession.

[muggman2015]

I work in such a program now as directed by a Prof who is an attorney. Does the overwhelming support of faculty at my university not mean anything? They are aware of these transgressions as well.

[muggman2015]

Im not going to worry too much about this. coming to TLS forums was kind of like a WebMD mistake. I believe I'm in good hands with my advisors and professors who support me 100% and are fully aware of surrounding details. thanks though good luck everyone.

[lizaregina]

I work in such a program now as directed by a Prof who is an attorney. Does the overwhelming support of faculty at my university not mean anything? They are aware of these transgressions as well.

It might help with the admissions issue but not necessarily with the bar. This is why you need to follow the above advice and contact an attorney who can help you figure out the C+F issues for the bar.

[muggman2015]

Ok cool ill focus on C&F and the Bar. Thanks

[SemperLegal]

I work in such a program now as directed by a Prof who is an attorney. Does the overwhelming support of faculty at my university not mean anything? They are aware of these transgressions as well.

Not really, bar examiners arent going to ask your UG professors and law schools just read the LOR as a check in the box application.

Im not going to worry too much about this. coming to TLS forums was kind of like a WebMD mistake. I believe I'm in good hands with my advisors and professors who support me 100% and are fully aware of surrounding details. thanks though good luck everyone.

Its interesting that you wanted the advice when you thought it would support what you already know, but when its cautious, its garbage. Also, I would be careful trusting only people who work for your UG. Its almost universally known that Academics have literally no idea how different professional school is from normal grad school (and have zero experience with the modern C&F process). They are not going to crush your dreams because they like you, want life to be more fair, and don't have a vested interest in the truth.

Either way I think you will get in, and will likely be barred somewhere. However, you have to protect your ass. Some states have a total bar to admission for weapons charges, and some of bars for AA. Not all states recognize other states diversion programs as a non-admission of guilt. You owe it to yourself to do some research (with an attorney or one your own through the records of the Supreme Court of whatever states you might want to practice in) about how prior bad acts are considered, and what types of proof of rehabilitation they like to see.

[muggman2015]

I do not consider the advice i have received here to be garbage and have consistently thanked all of those who have replied. You speak as if you know my motivations for coming to TLS forums while discounting my appreciation. As noted several of my advisors are attorneys who have gone through c & f. I came here seeking a broader range of opinions not inferences into my person lol

[HRomanus]

Im not going to worry too much about this. coming to TLS forums was kind of like a WebMD mistake. I believe I'm in good hands with my advisors and professors who support me 100% and are fully aware of surrounding details. thanks though good luck everyone.

120.

[muggman2015]

Lol cool.

[spleenworship]

First, let me say that it sounds like if someone was going to get past C&F despite mistakes, it sounds like you have a chance.

That said, the people ITT are right that you need to contact the board(s) of bar examiners where you want to practice and some attorneys who specialize in this field to make sure you aren't going to waste your time.

[muggman2015]

definitely I would hate to waste the time and money. I will reach out to a few attorneys I know and see if they have contacts that take part in those decisions or that are at least knowledgable. Ive been doing some research since making this post and time between and age at the time of offense are two key factors. Im hoping ill be fine. Thank you

[Clyde Frog]

It's all about showing rehabilitation and distancing yourself from the crime according to the bar c&fs I've read. Ten years is a considerable amount of time between the crime and your predicted application bar application. There are many documented cases of people committing horrible crimes and getting admitted to the bar after ten years. As long as you don't have anything related in the future then I'm sure the odds are in your favor.

[PDaddy]

18- Aggravated Assualt, 19- Carrying Concealed Firearms. Both cases I was sentenced under a deferment program HYTA, subsequently I have no criminal record and the records of those cases are sealed. At 23 I have a 3.95 GPA, Work with at risk foster youth, and have started on organization designed to promote educational opportunities for underprivileged youth.I am an AA male, has my past become a plus? Should I use those experiences extensively in essays? Ive been told that I have to own it.

The incidents are still fairly recent, but you are to be commended for turning things around. The sky is the limit for you as long as you continue in your current path. Have you gotten counseling? I think adcoms are going to want to know that you have gotten counseling/anger-management and are a well-adjusted individual. Be sure that you tell them you no longer carry weapons and vow to stay away from people who do.

Given the seriousness of your offenses I would probably apply in about 2018 and see what happens. Be sure to get letters from your case worker/probation officers, correction officers, attorney, or even the judge in your case - if any of them are willing to write a letter for you.

The only thing that concerns me is that your history is still fairly recent given the seriousness of your crimes. You might be well-served to wait until about 2018 or so to apply.