Applications to T6 only? Forum
- heythatslife
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Applications to T6 only?
Is this a stupid thing to do? I just don't feel like applying to a bunch of schools that I wouldn't go to anyway even if I'm accepted. One factor to consider is that since I'm an international, there is a high likelihood that I will end up practicing outside of the US eventually, and the portability of the JD degree diminishes rapidly outside of the T6 as you go down the ranking. So right now, I'm looking at applying to the T6 and maybe Penn thrown in for good measure. I'm wondering if this is too much of a risk, though.
Numbers-wise, I'm 173/4.0 (UG in US).
Numbers-wise, I'm 173/4.0 (UG in US).
- moonman157
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Unless there's something glaringly wrong with your application, you should be fine at the T6. Your only motivation for applying outside of the T6 would be scholarship negotiations.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
If you don't care about debt, then I see nothing wrong with it. You are literally a lock for NYU (And less so, Chicago, Columbia, and Harvard - especially if you apply early). Y/S are iffy.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
I only applied to five of the T6 plus Berkeley, but I don't think applying in a very limited fashion is the best plan for most high-numbers people. It might not have been a great idea for me either, ignoring the actual results. At the time I applied, I was pretty sure I wouldn't actually attend law school the following fall if I didn't get into YHS, but it's certainly possible that my thinking could have changed.
If a high-numbers domestic applicant would attend CCN, then the smartest play is to apply to the entire T14 to maximize chances of getting huge scholarship money. Even if a domestic applicant were dead-set on attending only a T6 school (not a rational position for domestic applicants, since the lower T14 with a full ride beats the hell out of CCN with small scholarships), she should apply to all T14 schools to cover the possible scenarios where she could use a lower T14 full ride to squeeze a little more money out of CCN.
However, I don't know how any of this applies to you as an international student, because I have no idea how the different T14 schools treat international students in awarding merit scholarships.
If a high-numbers domestic applicant would attend CCN, then the smartest play is to apply to the entire T14 to maximize chances of getting huge scholarship money. Even if a domestic applicant were dead-set on attending only a T6 school (not a rational position for domestic applicants, since the lower T14 with a full ride beats the hell out of CCN with small scholarships), she should apply to all T14 schools to cover the possible scenarios where she could use a lower T14 full ride to squeeze a little more money out of CCN.
However, I don't know how any of this applies to you as an international student, because I have no idea how the different T14 schools treat international students in awarding merit scholarships.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Don't apply to schools you wouldn't go to. But honestly, taking a scholarship at a lower T14 is the better play.
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- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.Desert Fox wrote:Don't apply to schools you wouldn't go to. But honestly, taking a scholarship at a lower T14 is the better play.
- sinfiery
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Completely agree with this post. HYSCN are actually quite stingy with scholarship money aside from named scholarships (Far from a guarantee) and you definitely want something to help you negotiate if certain scenarios.Ti Malice wrote:I only applied to five of the T6 plus Berkeley, but I don't think applying in a very limited fashion is the best plan for most high-numbers people. It might not have been a great idea for me either, ignoring the actual results. At the time I applied, I was pretty sure I wouldn't actually attend law school the following fall if I didn't get into YHS, but it's certainly possible that my thinking could have changed.
If a high-numbers domestic applicant would attend CCN, then the smartest play is to apply to the entire T14 to maximize chances of getting huge scholarship money. Even if a domestic applicant were dead-set on attending only a T6 school (not a rational position for domestic applicants, since the lower T14 with a full ride beats the hell out of CCN with small scholarships), she should apply to all T14 schools to cover the possible scenarios where she could use a lower T14 full ride to squeeze a little more money out of CCN.
However, I don't know how any of this applies to you as an international student, because I have no idea how the different T14 schools treat international students in awarding merit scholarships.
I also think that the variance and lack of data for how exactly international applications play out should also get you applying to as much of the T14 as you can.
Does this really improve ones chances at HLS?ArtistOfManliness wrote:
Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.
Last edited by sinfiery on Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Yea, 150k is a fuckload of money. And internationals are often in more need of money since they can't just get unlimited loans like a citizen can.ArtistOfManliness wrote:Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.Desert Fox wrote:Don't apply to schools you wouldn't go to. But honestly, taking a scholarship at a lower T14 is the better play.
- heythatslife
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Getting into HLS would actually solve the loan problem as HLS provides loans to international students through the Harvard University Employee Credit Union without the need for a co-signer. And I should have close to $0 EFC, so I'm hoping for some grant. Well, that's IF I can get in.Desert Fox wrote:Yea, 150k is a fuckload of money. And internationals are often in more need of money since they can't just get unlimited loans like a citizen can.ArtistOfManliness wrote:Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.Desert Fox wrote:Don't apply to schools you wouldn't go to. But honestly, taking a scholarship at a lower T14 is the better play.
I realize 150-200k is a pretty huge amount of money to handle but I'm not particularly debt-averse, either. I had no debt coming out of UG, and I'm more concerned about exit options available to me in my home country or elsewhere internationally after working for a few years in the US and my work visa expires.
But it does look like I should add a few schools in the T14, if only for the purpose of scholly negotiations... I was under the impression, though, that schools consider competing scholarship offers in negotiations only if the other offers in question are from "peer" or higher-ranked schools. So would merit scholarships from lower T14s help me leverage money from a T6?
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Schools will only consider making equal offers if the scholarship in hand is from at least a peer school. So you obviously can't use a full ride at Michigan or Duke to get a full ride at NYU. But it's possible that you could use a full ride from a lower T14 to get something like an extra $30K out of CCN.heythatslife wrote:Getting into HLS would actually solve the loan problem as HLS provides loans to international students through the Harvard University Employee Credit Union without the need for a co-signer. And I should have close to $0 EFC, so I'm hoping for some grant. Well, that's IF I can get in.Desert Fox wrote:Yea, 150k is a fuckload of money. And internationals are often in more need of money since they can't just get unlimited loans like a citizen can.ArtistOfManliness wrote:Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.Desert Fox wrote:Don't apply to schools you wouldn't go to. But honestly, taking a scholarship at a lower T14 is the better play.
I realize 150-200k is a pretty huge amount of money to handle but I'm not particularly debt-averse, either. I had no debt coming out of UG, and I'm more concerned about exit options available to me in my home country or elsewhere internationally after working for a few years in the US and my work visa expires.
But it does look like I should add a few schools in the T14, if only for the purpose of scholly negotiations... I was under the impression, though, that schools consider competing scholarship offers in negotiations only if the other offers in question are from "peer" or higher-ranked schools. So would merit scholarships from lower T14s help me leverage money from a T6?
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
My bad, I meant more along the lines of practicing outside of the US. OP said high likelihood of that, and outside the US, Harvard is leaps and bounds ahead of other schools.sinfiery wrote:
Does this really improve ones chances at HLS?ArtistOfManliness wrote:
Than going to HLS, where OP has a 90% chance? Especially for international, you gotta be trolling.
- untar614
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
If you can get fee waivers, I don't see any reason not to blanket T13. It can always turn up useful for scholarship negotiations, and you never really know for sure what you'll end up with. Just don't be a jerk and withdraw from any place once you're sure you won't go there or get anything useful for negotiating from them (though FYI plenty of ppl have been offered big money off the waitlist)
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Just blanket the t14 and don't worry about any of the Why X essays.
Just curious, what country?
Just curious, what country?
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Just go for the T6 - the other schools aren't worth your time to apply to if you have no interest or purpose in attending them.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Don't waste the $1K... go to a strip club instead and make it rain!Lumieres wrote:Just blanket the t14 and don't worry about any of the Why X essays.
Just curious, what country?
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Again, bad advice.KingofSplitters55 wrote:Just go for the T6 - the other schools aren't worth your time to apply to if you have no interest or purpose in attending them.
Get fee waivers and blanket the T14. Even if you don't plan to attend certain schools, they might offer you scholarships that you can use as leverage with your favored schools.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
HYS (aka his target schools) are not gonna give a damn about his scholarships. It's wasted money. If he doesn't get into HYS, he should revamp his app and try again since his numbers make him a shoe-in at HLS so long as he isn't a functional idiot during the interviewTi Malice wrote:Again, bad advice.KingofSplitters55 wrote:Just go for the T6 - the other schools aren't worth your time to apply to if you have no interest or purpose in attending them.
Get fee waivers and blanket the T14. Even if you don't plan to attend certain schools, they might offer you scholarships that you can use as leverage with your favored schools.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
I go to YHS. I know how their scholarships work.ArtistOfManliness wrote:HYS (aka his target schools) are not gonna give a damn about his scholarships. It's wasted money. If he doesn't get into HYS, he should revamp his app and try again since his numbers make him a shoe-in at HLS so long as he isn't a functional idiot during the interviewTi Malice wrote:Again, bad advice.KingofSplitters55 wrote:Just go for the T6 - the other schools aren't worth your time to apply to if you have no interest or purpose in attending them.
Get fee waivers and blanket the T14. Even if you don't plan to attend certain schools, they might offer you scholarships that you can use as leverage with your favored schools.
It's not wasted money because he's also open to attending CCN. App fees after fee waivers for the remaining schools (perhaps minus stingy Berkeley and GULC) amount to chump change. It's very cheap insurance for a scenario that's unlikely but far from unheard of. He's very likely to get H, but people on this site have been rejected with better numbers in the last two cycles (despite having other terrific offers). And no set of numbers guarantees the large scholarships from CCN. If OP misses H and doesn't get one of the large CCN scholarships, he could still wind up with a Levy, Darrow, Mordecai, etc. Members of this site have used these before to squeeze nice sums of money out of CCN.
Revamping the app and reapplying may be the smart move in such an unlucky scenario, but (1) many choose not to; (2) a previous rejection from YHS is a negative for a second application; and, (3) as an international student, waiting a year might be less practical/feasible for OP than for a domestic applicant.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Shit son, didn't mean to offend your prestigious ass. We all know you go to the "Y" of "YHS" because you're one of like three people on TLS that call it "YHS."Ti Malice wrote: I go to YHS. I know how their scholarships work.
It's not wasted money because he's also open to attending CCN. App fees after fee waivers for the remaining schools (perhaps minus stingy Berkeley and GULC) amount to chump change. It's very cheap insurance for a scenario that's unlikely but far from unheard of. He's very likely to get H, but people on this site have been rejected with better numbers in the last two cycles (despite having other terrific offers). And no set of numbers guarantees the large scholarships from CCN. If OP misses H and doesn't get one of the large CCN scholarships, he could still wind up with a Levy, Darrow, Mordecai, etc. Members of this site have used these before to squeeze nice sums of money out of CCN.
Revamping the app and reapplying may be the smart move in such an unlucky scenario, but (1) many choose not to; (2) a previous rejection from YHS is a negative for a second application; and, (3) as an international student, waiting a year might be less practical/feasible for OP than for a domestic applicant.
But fair enough... if he is really risk adverse, he should blanket the T14.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
My prestigious posterior is unoffended. And you should give me more credit on the "YHS" front -- I've done my part to make it quite a bit more common than that around here these days. It's "YSH" that hasn't gotten off the ground.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Hahaha I'd be down with a YSH... it just doesn't sound that official cuz it can be pronounced "ish"Ti Malice wrote:My prestigious posterior is unoffended. And you should give me more credit on the "YHS" front -- I've done my part to make it quite a bit more common than that around here these days. It's "YSH" that hasn't gotten off the ground.
That being said, I too shall stop using HYS... might even go for YSCH
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- Tiago Splitter
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Is NYU more prestigious internationally than all of the lower T-14? Serious question.
- ArtistOfManliness
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
I think Berkeley might beat it...Tiago Splitter wrote:Is NYU more prestigious internationally than all of the lower T-14? Serious question.
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
I'd assume you can get fee waivers and apply to the T10 just to be safe4
- sinfiery
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Re: Applications to T6 only?
Lay prestige wise, not likely. But as far as jobs are concerned (self selection need be accounted for)Tiago Splitter wrote:Is NYU more prestigious internationally than all of the lower T-14? Serious question.
Employed in a foreign country:
CLS: 14/469
Cornell: 3/190
Duke: 5/225
Harvard: 19/590
NYU: 8/482
UCB: 6/312
UVA: 6/364
Penn: 5/270
NU: 4/268
UChi: 3/215
Gtown: 13/626
Yale: 8/222
SLS: 5/181
No real major distinctions, maybe one could argue HYCLS but self selection basically makes the difference in the data meaningless
But #1 on that international ranking specialty is...NYU
http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandr ... w-rankings
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