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This is just my curiosity at work here, since I don't have any C&F issues to speak of. How do adcoms take C&F issues into consideration when they make decisions?

I've always thought of it like this—either your C&F issues are not severe enough to have an effect on your decision one way or another, or they are severe enough to cause respectable schools to discard your application, regardless of what your numbers are. You could have a 4.0/180 or 3.0/160 and Tier 1 schools would all ding them just the same. Good C&F standing is just a yes/no prerequisite to admission.

But perhaps I'm wrong. Maybe the effect is a linear one—such that applicants with identical C&F issues with have different outcomes depending on their numbers.

Let's say an applicant fucked up and plagiarized a paper their freshman year of UG. Definitely a red flag for most adcoms, but not a felony. The applicant applies to a school with 3.7/167 medians and beats both of the medians. Would the school admit the applicant if he had a 3.9/178, but ding him if he had a 3.75/169? Does the C&F issue do nothing except arbitrarily raise the theoretical GPA/LSAT floor for the applicant? I'm assuming the applicant's demonstration of remorse (or, alternatively, recalcitrance) is the same for both pairs of numbers.

Independently, let's take YHSCCN, where they have the luxury of cherry picking their students. Is there a lower threshold for C&F influencing a decision as compared to, say, the bottom of the T14? I could definitely see schools with piles of 3.9/175s ranking applicants with small but notable (i.e. not traffic ticket) C&F issues behind all peer applicants with the same or slightly lower numbers. Not so much at GULC or Cornell.

Thoughts?

tabula rasa wrote:This is just my curiosity at work here, since I don't have any C&F issues to speak of. How do adcoms take C&F issues into consideration when they make decisions?

I've always thought of it like this—either your C&F issues are not severe enough to have an effect on your decision one way or another, or they are severe enough to cause respectable schools to discard your application, regardless of what your numbers are. You could have a 4.0/180 or 3.0/160 and Tier 1 schools would all ding them just the same. Good C&F standing is just a yes/no prerequisite to admission.

But perhaps I'm wrong. Maybe the effect is a linear one—such that applicants with identical C&F issues with have different outcomes depending on their numbers.

Let's say an applicant fucked up and plagiarized a paper their freshman year of UG. Definitely a red flag for most adcoms, but not a felony. The applicant applies to a school with 3.7/167 medians and beats both of the medians. Would the school admit the applicant if he had a 3.9/178, but ding him if he had a 3.75/169? Does the C&F issue do nothing except arbitrarily raise the theoretical GPA/LSAT floor for the applicant? I'm assuming the applicant's demonstration of remorse (or, alternatively, recalcitrance) is the same for both pairs of numbers.

Independently, let's take YHSCCN, where they have the luxury of cherry picking their students. Is there a lower threshold for C&F influencing a decision as compared to, say, the bottom of the T14? I could definitely see schools with piles of 3.9/175s ranking applicants with small but notable (i.e. not traffic ticket) C&F issues behind all peer applicants with the same or slightly lower numbers. Not so much at GULC or Cornell.

Thoughts?

They will take a hit on their LSAT/GPA medians to preserve their BAR acceptance/pass rates. C&F is very important for this reason so the schools can gauge whether you will be able to take and be admitted to the BAR.

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anon123 wrote:Interested in this too. 3.9x/ 175+ applicant and a lot of volunteer work with C&F issue that is 5 years old, when I was 14-15. No conviction, no formal charges and it is considered very minor since I was young. I called the notoriously tough Bars and they all said it poses actually zero threat. Hoping it doesn't effect admissions decisions since most T-14s require disclosure.. we'll see..

You'll be fine.

I wonder if it would hurt an applicant for scholly money, when no one is going to be particularly desperate to have you, but quite a few schools would want your numbers.

it factors quite a bit. i know someone who was denied this past cycle from a lot of schools that he was above median for.


its such a shame. really bright guy. i dont understand why someone should be blackballed from being a lawyer because of a few mistakes in his past. character and fitness is ridiculously pretentious.

completely unpredictable

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C&F covers both university and criminal. I think it depends on the time passed/ and incident type but neither are good.

I am really hoping to avoid a bad cycle because of this. It seems silly to me to deny someone with high numbers/ high community involvement and who has one isolated incident when 15.. like not even a parking ticket.. especially when the issue poses virtually no threat to passing the Bar.

Didn't think about scholarships but that would really suck. Will be disclosing and hoping for the best.

I think it's either bad enough to preclude admission, or insignificant enough not to stand in the way of anything.

What about two dui misdemeanors. How bad will that effect an applicant?