Top Law Schools

I currently have a 2.7 gpa after slacking off for two years. I am in my junior year, and by the end of this semester my gpa should be 3.0. I do not want to attend a top law school by any means nor do I think i could get accepted. My hopes are set on CUNY Law School a tier 3-4. I love their focus on public interest. I just want to know the possibilities of getting in if I graduate with a 3.1 and should I retake the classes I did poorly in or just take different classes to improve gpa. Another question is that I was told that law schools do not look at senior and junior year GPA which seems absurd just want to know how truthful this is. I retook one class so far, plan to retake 3 more. Just want to know If i do well on lsat could i get into Cuny law. and how my gpa is calculated if I retake? Thanks

There's a TLSer who currently has ~2.8 GPA who is looking at elite schools (t14, possibly t10 but she has an absolutely amazing LSAT). It's not impossible. However, you will have to destroy the LSAT.

You should be aiming to get perfect grades from here on out if you want to go to a top school or any law school that is worth the tuition but know that your GPA probably only closes doors at the top 11 schools (NU being the law school that is notoriously splitter friendly). 3.0 is definitely a nice threshold to get over but at this point you should be aiming at top schools' 25th%tiles for GPA (i.e. 3.4/3.5ish). GL! Bring those grades up!

1. Get above a 3.0, pretty much every school is going to care at least somewhat about the difference between a 2.X and 3.X.

2. CUNY depends on your LSAT. Check http://www.lawschoolnumbers.com

3. Why would you have not want to go to a better law school that gives you a better chance at becoming employed as a full time lawyer?

FWIW, I had a similar GPA freshmen year and with some hard work/careful planning, I was able to leave UG with ~3.5.

ETA: They look at your cumulative GPA which includes every year of your undergraduate education up until your first bachelor's degree. I think higher Jr/Sr year grades are definitely positives on your application.

JDizzle2015 wrote:There's a TLSer who currently has ~2.8 GPA who is looking at elite schools (t14, possibly t10 but she has an absolutely amazing LSAT). It's not impossible. However, you will have to destroy the LSAT.

You should be aiming to get perfect grades from here on out if you want to go to a top school or any law school that is worth the tuition but know that your GPA probably only closes doors at the top 11 schools (NU being the law school that is notoriously splitter friendly). 3.0 is definitely a nice threshold to get over but at this point you should be aiming at top schools' 25th%tiles for GPA (i.e. 3.4/3.5ish). GL! Bring those grades up!

D'awww, JDizzle. Thanks for the shoutout <3

OP - you are VERY VERY VERY lucky to be thinking about this when you're in undergrad and still have a chance to change your GPA.
To answer your question about how your grades will be calculated: LSAC includes ALL grades, including for classes you have retaken. So basically if you took Phi 101 and got an F, then retook and got an A, both grades will show up (and will average out to a C GPA). What does this mean? This means that you need to not only ACE the classes you are retaking, but take a lot more classes that you get A's in so that you can balance out the existing Cs/Ds/Fs.

I have a 2.8 (as JDizzle mentioned) and I have these suggestions for you (aka, this is what I would do if I could go back and change my life, lol)

1) IT IS NOT TOO LATE TO CHANGE YOUR GPA. A lot of the reason why my GPA isn't over a 3.0 is because I spent a lot of time underachieving because I thought it was 'too late' to improve my GPA and there was 'no point in trying'. This is NOT TRUE. Bust your ass. Even a 3.0 or 3.2 will be leaps and bounds better than a 2.8 or 2.9.

2) TAKE AN EXTRA YEAR. If you have the funds for it, take an extra year of completely BS and easy classes. Law schools do not care HOW you got your grades, just that you have them.

3) Get work experience. If you're shooting for schools in the T14, a lot of them will not hold your GPA against you as much if you have a few years of WE. Some (ie Northwestern) prefer WE to the point of almost requiring it. Since NU is the only T14 school that regularly takes people with a 2.X GPA, this means that WE is a crucial part of your application as a splitter.

4) GET A 170+ ON THE LSAT! I'm serious here, DO NOT take the LSAT until you think you can score over 170. Retake if you have to. Bust your ass, do what you need to do. The only reason I even have a shot at the top 20 (much less T14 or T10) schools is because I have a 176, which helps balance out my 2.8 GPA. There are tons of resources for this on this forum, so start looking into it as soon as you can.

5) Get your LORs on file and start working on your PS/DS/GPA addendum/Why X essays at LEAST 9 months to a year in advance. I requested my LORs in March, and one of them didn't arrive until October. I was still fixing my PS a year after I started it. As a splitter, you want to apply AS SOON AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN in order to get the best shot at getting in. This means taking the Sept/Dec LSAT BEFORE your cycle, and then retaking in either Dec/June. This also means getting your apps done and ready by early September (I didn't do this, since I retook in October, but IMO it was worth it since I jumped from 169 --> 176. Still though, you want to be in the 17X territory BEFORE October )

I hope this was helpful. The most important two things to take from all this text are that you NEED to get your GPA over 3.0 and DO NOT be satisfied with anything less than a 170 LSAT. (: Feel free to ask me any questions, and you can follow my cycle at http://lawschoolnumbers.com/whimsical (though hopefully you'll have better numbers than me by the time you apply )

thanks for all the information. I know many people wonder why Cuny law school. I have a deep passion to be a lawyer, but not to practice big law. Cuny offers a tuition of 10k a year, I will be able to stay home with parents while in school and only end up with 30k in debt but more after interest. Cuny focuses on public interest law, and they have a 94% employment rate after graduation, in public interest. So I looked at schools that would allow me to practice law, but to help people at the same time, and not be 120k after graduation.

BTW I have one more question, did any of you take prep courses for the LSAT? And when should I take my LSAT I am scheduled to graduate December 2012, I was thinking of taking them June 2012 and a prep class before that. But CUNY Law only admits first year students for the fall semester so would taking LSAT in June 2012 but applying in March 2013 be an issue?

Another thing what are these things "Get your LORs on file and start working on your PS/DS/GPA addendum/Why X essays" may sound dumb but not familiar with law school app jargon. I know letters of recommendation and the essays.

--LinkRemoved-- (copy and paste if it doesn't work by clicking)

Does that not scare you about CUNY?

Half of their grads don't even get full time jobs. LESS than half of their grads get jobs that require passing the bar. Even at 10k/year that is resoundingly awful (even if it is better than most T3/T4's).

wg1024 wrote:thanks for all the information. I know many people wonder why Cuny law school. I have a deep passion to be a lawyer, but not to practice big law. Cuny offers a tuition of 10k a year, I will be able to stay home with parents while in school and only end up with 30k in debt but more after interest. Cuny focuses on public interest law, and they have a 94% employment rate after graduation, in public interest. So I looked at schools that would allow me to practice law, but to help people at the same time, and not be 120k after graduation.

BTW I have one more question, did any of you take prep courses for the LSAT? And when should I take my LSAT I am scheduled to graduate December 2012, I was thinking of taking them June 2012 and a prep class before that. But CUNY Law only admits first year students for the fall semester so would taking LSAT in June 2012 but applying in March 2013 be an issue?

NOPE NOPE NOPE hth

[quote]BTW I have one more question, did any of you take prep courses for the LSAT? And when should I take my LSAT I am scheduled to graduate December 2012, I was thinking of taking them June 2012 and a prep class before that. But CUNY Law only admits first year students for the fall semester so would taking LSAT in June 2012 but applying in March 2013 be an issue?[quote]

I took the PowerScore online class. It was actually a copy of the virtual online class. So I could watch the three hour lectures whenever I had time (I believe there were fourteen of them). They mail you the four books that teach you everything about every section and every type of question you will see on the best. This was very beneficial. It also includes a ton of practice tests and you can enter your scores online. It tracks what types of questions you got wrong so you can focus on them.

wg1024 wrote:Another thing what are these things "Get your LORs on file and start working on your PS/DS/GPA addendum/Why X essays" may sound dumb but not familiar with law school app jargon. I know letters of recommendation and the essays.

LORs = Letter of Recommendations
PS = Personal Statement
DS = Diversity Statement
Why X = Law school specific interest essays (Most valuable aka necessary at Michigan, Penn, Duke, Virginia and Northwestern. Also debatably important at Georgetown.)

Please take to heart everything crumpts wrote. It is golden advice.

Do not let the fact that you'd be content with CUNY cause you to not bust your ass for the next two years. It'll open a lot more doors for you and if you're still happy with CUNY in two years, you'd get more scholarship money. Who doesn't like more free money?

Look at independent employment data (ie http://www.lawschooltransparency.com/ --> Data Clearinghouse --> Select Schools --> CUNY). Law schools notoriously fudge their post-graduation employment information such as counting flipping burgers as "employed after 9 months".

wg1024 wrote:thanks for all the information. I know many people wonder why Cuny law school. I have a deep passion to be a lawyer, but not to practice big law. Cuny offers a tuition of 10k a year, I will be able to stay home with parents while in school and only end up with 30k in debt but more after interest. Cuny focuses on public interest law, and they have a 94% employment rate after graduation, in public interest. So I looked at schools that would allow me to practice law, but to help people at the same time, and not be 120k after graduation.

BTW I have one more question, did any of you take prep courses for the LSAT? And when should I take my LSAT I am scheduled to graduate December 2012, I was thinking of taking them June 2012 and a prep class before that. But CUNY Law only admits first year students for the fall semester so would taking LSAT in June 2012 but applying in March 2013 be an issue?

This is misleading. That rate includes people who have ANY job, not who are employed as an attorney. So someone working at Starbucks or working as a janitor counts as "employed."

Also, that only includes people who respond to the survey. You know who doesn't bother to respond? Unemployed people. Advice - go to the CUNY campus and talk to random students (do not go through admin and ask to talk to students, they will put you in touch only with employed people). Ask them how the employment situation is.