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I currently have 47 credits and about a 3.51, due to being an idiot freshmen year, less than I had previously thought I had (3.6).

I used my school's GPA calculator and calculated that, theoretically, if I were to get perfect grades from here on out until 137 credits, which is about what I'd have at graduation, I would be able to get a 3.83, which is near 25th percentile for Harvard. Looking at it realistically the highest I'll likely be able to make is around a 3.75, and unless I can score a 177+ on the LSAT (which is incredibly unlikely unless I'm a genius and don't know it) am I already done for?

Perhaps a strong upward trend (4.0 for 6 more semesters is pretty strong, I'd say) and a good LSAT + some softs might get me there, but at the moment it's looking somewhat glum. Thoughts? I know how theoretical grade + LSAT posts are received, but I'm a little ... distraught after learning this

M.M. wrote:I currently have 47 credits and about a 3.51, due to being an idiot freshmen year, less than I had previously thought I had (3.6).

I used my school's GPA calculator and calculated that, theoretically, if I were to get perfect grades from here on out until 137 credits, which is about what I'd have at graduation, I would be able to get a 3.83, which is near 25th percentile for Harvard. Looking at it realistically the highest I'll likely be able to make is around a 3.75, and unless I can score a 177+ on the LSAT (which is incredibly unlikely unless I'm a genius and don't know it) am I already done for?

Perhaps a strong upward trend (4.0 for 6 more semesters is pretty strong, I'd say) and a good LSAT + some softs might get me there, but at the moment it's looking somewhat glum. Thoughts? I know how theoretical grade + LSAT posts are received, but I'm a little ... distraught after learning this

P?

I've always wanted to go to P. What's it like there? What do the teach in 1L?

..

Egregious Penn trolling.

delBarco wrote:Egregious Penn trolling.

icwutudidthar

My bad :<

After I posted I thought that sounded wrong but it was time for bed and I was exhausted

The good news is that you didn't waste an application fee on Princeton Law School which can now be used for Dartmouth Law.

You can get in with a 3.75+ if you get 177+ on the LSAT. So to answer your question, yes it's possible but you need pretty much straight A's here on out to have a good chance.

2014 wrote:You can get in with a 3.75+ if you get 177+ on the LSAT. So to answer your question, yes it's possible but you need pretty much straight A's here on out to have a good chance.

Hmm.

Looks like I'll just have to do my best. Though honestly I doubt I'm smart enough to pull it off... I just work really hard, and honestly shit happens (e.g. my Soc 101 class I was the highest grade with a low A ... in a Soc 101 class. The median grade was 68% lol) that might mess me up. Thanks for the first serious reply ITT

You can get in with <3.75 and <177 if you have great softs. In other words, if you end up in the 3.6+ and 170+ range and REALLY want to go to HYS, forget about law school for a couple years and do something really rewarding and unique, and then apply (at least to YS--H may not look past your numbers).

M.M. wrote:

2014 wrote:You can get in with a 3.75+ if you get 177+ on the LSAT. So to answer your question, yes it's possible but you need pretty much straight A's here on out to have a good chance.

Hmm.

Looks like I'll just have to do my best. Though honestly I doubt I'm smart enough to pull it off... I just work really hard, and honestly shit happens (e.g. my Soc 101 class I was the highest grade with a low A ... in a Soc 101 class. The median grade was 68% lol) that might mess me up. Thanks for the first serious reply ITT

If you don't think — and if you don't think it, who will? — you're smart enough to get perfect grades in undergrad why would you even be thinking so seriously about harvard, yale and stanford law?

SullaFelix wrote:

M.M. wrote:

2014 wrote:You can get in with a 3.75+ if you get 177+ on the LSAT. So to answer your question, yes it's possible but you need pretty much straight A's here on out to have a good chance.

Hmm.

Looks like I'll just have to do my best. Though honestly I doubt I'm smart enough to pull it off... I just work really hard, and honestly shit happens (e.g. my Soc 101 class I was the highest grade with a low A ... in a Soc 101 class. The median grade was 68% lol) that might mess me up. Thanks for the first serious reply ITT

If you don't think — and if you don't think it, who will? — you're smart enough to get perfect grades in undergrad why would you even be thinking so seriously about harvard, yale and stanford law?

I was more referring to the LSAT part, which I've been told relies to a certain extent on natural intelligence and practicing will only help you to a certain point on.

Though as I said, shit happens. Professor tosses you a test with material on it that wasn't on the study guide or that wasn't mentioned in class. You get an A- in the class. Oops. There goes your perfect GPA. I'm just sayin. I can believe I'm smart enough, and put in the effort, but I'm human, I make mistakes, and so are professors. That is not to say I'm not going to try.


@ abl, thanks... Harvard is that much more concerned about numbers despite having slightly lower numbers than Yale, yes? Hmm .. you'd think it'd be the other way around. I understand they have a much larger student body but that's a bummer

...URM?

M.M. wrote: I was more referring to the LSAT part, which I've been told relies to a certain extent on natural intelligence and practicing will only help you to a certain point on.

Though as I said, shit happens. Professor tosses you a test with material on it that wasn't on the study guide or that wasn't mentioned in class. You get an A- in the class. Oops. There goes your perfect GPA. I'm just sayin. I can believe I'm smart enough, and put in the effort, but I'm human, I make mistakes, and so are professors. That is not to say I'm not going to try.


@ abl, thanks... Harvard is that much more concerned about numbers despite having slightly lower numbers than Yale, yes? Hmm .. you'd think it'd be the other way around. I understand they have a much larger student body but that's a bummer

Overall Harvard will dip lower grade and LSAT wise if only because of their huge class size. You will certainly see outliers who get into Yale who you would think had no chance, but because of legacy donor parents, URM, or compelling softs, they get in. Either way though, they don't dip particularly low at all, and you will have an extremely difficult time getting into either without 3.7+. If you are doubting your intelligence to do well on the LSAT, I imagine your softs wouldn't be good enough to make up for a numerical deficit either since you probably aren't going to end up as a Rhodes.

The LSAT is very learnable though and if you devoted several months to it, you can beat it. Some will argue that not everyone is capable of scoring 170+, but the evidence around here shows if you study incredibly hard, most people can.

The last part about the LSAT is good to know - I will definitely study until my brain melts.

Any idea on about how long people spend studying for it on average ?

Perhaps I might take a few extra classes for a GPA boost that I find interesting while studying for it, and apply a semester later. It's years in the future so I have time to see, I suppose

Edit: @ cubswin, nope, pure bred white boy

I think you need to study hard, but not too hard, or you will burn out. Try not to focus on the schools when you are studying. If you take the test with the mentality that you have to get a 177+ to get into Harvard, and if you don't get into Harvard you will be crushed, you may panic.

M.M. wrote:I currently have 47 credits and about a 3.51, due to being an idiot freshmen year, less than I had previously thought I had (3.6).

I used my school's GPA calculator and calculated that, theoretically, if I were to get perfect grades from here on out until 137 credits, which is about what I'd have at graduation, I would be able to get a 3.83, which is near 25th percentile for Harvard. Looking at it realistically the highest I'll likely be able to make is around a 3.75, and unless I can score a 177+ on the LSAT (which is incredibly unlikely unless I'm a genius and don't know it) am I already done for?

Perhaps a strong upward trend (4.0 for 6 more semesters is pretty strong, I'd say) and a good LSAT + some softs might get me there, but at the moment it's looking somewhat glum. Thoughts? I know how theoretical grade + LSAT posts are received, but I'm a little ... distraught after learning this

I think you can probably write off Yale and Stanford... Harvard would be the only one you would likely have a shot at and that would only happen if you managed to get near perfect grade from here on out, and managed to really ace the LSAT. AND even if you managed to do that you would not be guaranteed a spot in Harvard. Look at the statistics Harvard does publish and you see that only 25% got less than 3.76 GPAs and 25% were lower than 171 on the LSAT... you also note that they enroll just over 25% minorities... I'm willing to bet that the majority of the ones with a score near what you are looking at were either splitters (which you aren't) or URM. So unless you are an URM I don't think you are going to good chance of getting in.

If I were you I would accept that I'm not going to get into HYS and then decide where I could go... if it was a decent school then I would be happy with that and enjoy life. You seemed to wake up a little after the train left the station... and unfortunately there isn't a lot you can do to change that fact.

If you were dead set on HYS then your best chance is to not only get perfect grades from here on out, but it would also probably require you to go into the real world and excel at something so you have something meaningful that could set you apart from the other applicants.

Pip wrote:

M.M. wrote:I currently have 47 credits and about a 3.51, due to being an idiot freshmen year, less than I had previously thought I had (3.6).

I used my school's GPA calculator and calculated that, theoretically, if I were to get perfect grades from here on out until 137 credits, which is about what I'd have at graduation, I would be able to get a 3.83, which is near 25th percentile for Harvard. Looking at it realistically the highest I'll likely be able to make is around a 3.75, and unless I can score a 177+ on the LSAT (which is incredibly unlikely unless I'm a genius and don't know it) am I already done for?

Perhaps a strong upward trend (4.0 for 6 more semesters is pretty strong, I'd say) and a good LSAT + some softs might get me there, but at the moment it's looking somewhat glum. Thoughts? I know how theoretical grade + LSAT posts are received, but I'm a little ... distraught after learning this

I think you can probably write off Yale and Stanford... Harvard would be the only one you would likely have a shot at and that would only happen if you managed to get near perfect grade from here on out, and managed to really ace the LSAT. AND even if you managed to do that you would not be guaranteed a spot in Harvard. Look at the statistics Harvard does publish and you see that only 25% got less than 3.76 GPAs and 25% were lower than 171 on the LSAT... you also note that they enroll just over 25% minorities... I'm willing to bet that the majority of the ones with a score near what you are looking at were either splitters (which you aren't) or URM. So unless you are an URM I don't think you are going to good chance of getting in.

If I were you I would accept that I'm not going to get into HYS and then decide where I could go... if it was a decent school then I would be happy with that and enjoy life. You seemed to wake up a little after the train left the station... and unfortunately there isn't a lot you can do to change that fact.

If you were dead set on HYS then your best chance is to not only get perfect grades from here on out, but it would also probably require you to go into the real world and excel at something so you have something meaningful that could set you apart from the other applicants.

Yeah I think my LSAC GPA will probably be even lower as well. Hmmm, guess I'll have to see. Maybe I could work on getting a double degree, which would be a nice soft and a nice thing to have (and it wouldn't add much to my already low debt) and it would give me another 30 or so credits with which to raise my GPA.

Bleh. Thanks everybody

..

acrossthelake wrote:

M.M. wrote:

Pip wrote:

M.M. wrote:I currently have 47 credits and about a 3.51, due to being an idiot freshmen year, less than I had previously thought I had (3.6).

I used my school's GPA calculator and calculated that, theoretically, if I were to get perfect grades from here on out until 137 credits, which is about what I'd have at graduation, I would be able to get a 3.83, which is near 25th percentile for Harvard. Looking at it realistically the highest I'll likely be able to make is around a 3.75, and unless I can score a 177+ on the LSAT (which is incredibly unlikely unless I'm a genius and don't know it) am I already done for?

Perhaps a strong upward trend (4.0 for 6 more semesters is pretty strong, I'd say) and a good LSAT + some softs might get me there, but at the moment it's looking somewhat glum. Thoughts? I know how theoretical grade + LSAT posts are received, but I'm a little ... distraught after learning this

I think you can probably write off Yale and Stanford... Harvard would be the only one you would likely have a shot at and that would only happen if you managed to get near perfect grade from here on out, and managed to really ace the LSAT. AND even if you managed to do that you would not be guaranteed a spot in Harvard. Look at the statistics Harvard does publish and you see that only 25% got less than 3.76 GPAs and 25% were lower than 171 on the LSAT... you also note that they enroll just over 25% minorities... I'm willing to bet that the majority of the ones with a score near what you are looking at were either splitters (which you aren't) or URM. So unless you are an URM I don't think you are going to good chance of getting in.

If I were you I would accept that I'm not going to get into HYS and then decide where I could go... if it was a decent school then I would be happy with that and enjoy life. You seemed to wake up a little after the train left the station... and unfortunately there isn't a lot you can do to change that fact.

If you were dead set on HYS then your best chance is to not only get perfect grades from here on out, but it would also probably require you to go into the real world and excel at something so you have something meaningful that could set you apart from the other applicants.

Yeah I think my LSAC GPA will probably be even lower as well. Hmmm, guess I'll have to see. Maybe I could work on getting a double degree, which would be a nice soft and a nice thing to have (and it wouldn't add much to my already low debt) and it would give me another 30 or so credits with which to raise my GPA.

Bleh. Thanks everybody

You can't raise your GPA after you've received your first degree, though, so careful with timing there. Good luck!

Hmmm yes I took this into account, but is there a distinction between earning sufficient credits to receive a degree and actually ceremonially receiving it? If there is, and the former won't be the last of what LSAC sees for my GPA, then I should be fine.

M.M. wrote:Hmmm yes I took this into account, but is there a distinction between earning sufficient credits to receive a degree and actually ceremonially receiving it? If there is, and the former won't be the last of what LSAC sees for my GPA, then I should be fine.

Yes. Most people are eligible to receive their degree prior to their final semester. Hypothetically you could postpone filing for graduation and take a ton of online courses at a local community college to boost your LSAC gpa.

bk187 wrote:
Yes. Most people are eligible to receive their degree prior to their final semester. Hypothetically you could postpone filing for graduation and take a ton of online courses at a local community college to boost your LSAC gpa.

I am sure if you did this for a lower ranked school it would be all good. If you did it for HYS you might actually have to write an addendum for this

r6_philly wrote:

bk187 wrote:
Yes. Most people are eligible to receive their degree prior to their final semester. Hypothetically you could postpone filing for graduation and take a ton of online courses at a local community college to boost your LSAC gpa.

I am sure if you did this for a lower ranked school it would be all good. If you did it for HYS you might actually have to write an addendum for this

I just really love to learn

It's amazing to read threads like these where the OP is a college sophomore that is stressing about the possibility that (s)he will not get into one of HYS. I certainly understand the allure of these schools, and I'm all for setting the bar high, but life is too short, no? But hell, I guess someone has to exploit the proletariat.