Should I, a Teacher, Go to Law School? Forum

[chicagolaw2013]

After lurking on TLS and JDU for some time, I've been getting seconds thoughts (every once in a while, of course, because I really wanna go to UVA) about going to Law School.

If I stay in my home country as I am now, I'll be able to net about $45,000/year after taxes; this is a conservative assessment. The per capita income for South Korea is around $25,000ish, whereas in the United States, it's at about $45,000ish. So making about $45,000 a year after taxes (paying minimal taxes and practicing severe tax evasion... so much easier to pull off in this country) is actually a pretty decent living. What's more is that I already have a house inherited from my parents, and have a fully functional car. I'll actually be able to save up about $35,000 to $40,000 a year if I live the way I do right now.

The only problem is that I dislike what I'm doing, because it is definitely not challenging. A little "mind-numbing" as well; I've been hired by the government to lead a public interest English learning program, and have gathered a significant "book of business," for the lack of a better term, for tutoring ($32+/hour). The one thing that I do appreciate about this job is the stability of having a government job, and the promise of having a readily accessible stream of clients to tutor.

If what I really want is to have a stimulating and yet a safe job, would I be better off going to law school? Or should I try to discover the "stimulating aspects" of my current job by saving up and trying to make it as some kind of real estate investor in the long run???

Good luck with the LSAT and all, and I really think you'll have the numbers to get into a great school if you decide to go, but the bolded stopped me in my tracks. Teachers in SK are paid SO WELL, given what you've posted about the per capita average...can you tell our country to hurry the hell up and do the same please? I made more than my sister at my first sales job after college than she made in her 10th year of teaching...just appalling.

Teachers are NOT paid well in South Korea. I am in an exceptional position that I was able to obtain by pulling some strings as well. I generate most of my money from private tutoring; the city-wide English program that I lead has been a bottomless source of clients for me. Everyone is mesmerized by my supposed "competence."

My income likens that have a solo practice for a lawyer; I sell my services to people and the official job that I have functions as a marketing device (just like how solo practitioners join various associations to market their practices to potential clients).

EDIT:

Teachers are usually paid about $12,000-$20,000 a year in South Korea. I've demonstrated very high competence in a relatively "technical" subject, and I cater to those who aren't interested in improving their academic career, but to improve upon the soft-skills (English happens to be one of them) required by the presumably "global" society that we live in.

Jumped to conclusions...sorry. But man, if that were true, that would be WILD.

[PLATONiC]

Jumped to conclusions...sorry. But man, if that were true, that would be WILD.

Yes, it would be wild, considering the fact that it would violate the laws of supply and demand.

[chicagolaw2013]

Jumped to conclusions...sorry. But man, if that were true, that would be WILD.

Yes, it would be wild, considering the fact that it would violate the laws of supply and demand.

Supply of teachers, or supply of GOOD teachers?

I don't know how it is in SK, but here, the supply is large, but the good ones are ridiculously hard to find. They give just about anyone a teaching degree these days.

I guess it's like the legal field...still can't believe they accredited Phoenix Law...geez.

[PLATONiC]

I was sort of talking about the supply of teachers in general, because an ordinary teacher's annual income equaling nearly double a country's per capita income wouldn't make sense unless the country is in dire need of teachers in order to operate its schools.

The supply is indeed large in South Korea, and since I don't live in Seoul (the city that carries nearly 40% of the country's population), I don't have to compete against a large pool of qualified English teachers.

[09042014]

I was sort of talking about the supply of teachers in general, because an ordinary teacher's annual income equaling nearly double a country's per capita income wouldn't make sense unless the country is in dire need of teachers in order to operate its schools.

The supply is indeed large in South Korea, and since I don't live in Seoul (the city that carries nearly 40% of the country's population), I don't have to compete against a large pool of qualified English teachers.

Teachers in some suburbs of Chicago make more than twice the average income of the USA, after a decade of experience.

[chicagolaw2013]

I was sort of talking about the supply of teachers in general, because an ordinary teacher's annual income equaling nearly double a country's per capita income wouldn't make sense unless the country is in dire need of teachers in order to operate its schools.

The supply is indeed large in South Korea, and since I don't live in Seoul (the city that carries nearly 40% of the country's population), I don't have to compete against a large pool of qualified English teachers.

Teachers in some suburbs of Chicago make more than twice the average income of the USA, after a decade of experience.

Yup, ^^^ all depends on what you teach.

[schmohawk]

paying minimal taxes and practicing severe tax evasion...so much easier to pull off in this country

Big difference between minimizing your tax liability and outright tax evasion, which I'm sure you know is illegal in the U.S.

[shutterbug]

I find the poll results absolutely amazing, as if EVEN ONE of these people who voted "NO" would ever forego a law career for a teaching career.

[PLATONiC]

paying minimal taxes and practicing severe tax evasion...so much easier to pull off in this country

Big difference between minimizing your tax liability and outright tax evasion, which I'm sure you know is illegal in the U.S.

I'm talking about the outright illegal tax evasion, since I operate on a complete cash basis when it comes to "tutoring." When it comes to the ordinary pay that I receive from my official position, I'd have to pay the standard taxes; there's no way I can hide the pay that I receive from the government.

[PLATONiC]

I find the poll results absolutely amazing, as if EVEN ONE of these people who voted "NO" would ever forego a law career for a teaching career.

I'm sure most people would agree that a law career is a lot more interesting than a teaching career. It's just that actually securing a career in law is very difficult ITE.

[northwood]

I find the poll results absolutely amazing, as if EVEN ONE of these people who voted "NO" would ever forego a law career for a teaching career.

I'm sure most people would agree that a law career is a lot more interesting than a teaching career. It's just that actually securing a career in law is very difficult ITE.

so is trying to get a teaching position. Teachers are being laid off left and right, and there are thousands more waiiting for the opportunity to get hired. Not to mention. approximately 1 out of 3 teachers leaves the teaching field before 5 years. Depending on the school, the district its in, and the area, you may wind up in horrible working atmosphere, ( or on the opposite- a Great atmosphere), but the chances are far better that it wont be the dream school.

only you can answer this question. You are looking at a lot of debt. weigh all of the pros and cons, sleep on it, then see what happends. IF you have serious doubts ( other than a case of the nerves) then i would say wait a year at least. You can always apply to schools that you are considering and see what offers come back. Then make a decision.

[schmohawk]

paying minimal taxes and practicing severe tax evasion...so much easier to pull off in this country

Big difference between minimizing your tax liability and outright tax evasion, which I'm sure you know is illegal in the U.S.

I'm talking about the outright illegal tax evasion, since I operate on a complete cash basis when it comes to "tutoring." When it comes to the ordinary pay that I receive from my official position, I'd have to pay the standard taxes; there's no way I can hide the pay that I receive from the government.

I guess what I'm getting at is since you admit the tutoring counts for at least more than half of your income, and it technically isn't "legit", you might want to get out of that practice if you plan to become a lawyer. Not trying to sound preachy at all, it's just paying taxes is a civic duty in the land of delicious cheeseburgers, and lawyers, in theory, are supposed to uphold the law of the land. If I sound like a douche, it's only because I've seen so many business owners come to me for a loan who inevitably say "Well, I know it shows a loss in 2009, but obviously I brought in much more than that." That always ticks me off because aside from a small amount in interest from CD's and various other instruments, my only income is W2.

So virtually every dollar that I earn is taxed before I get to see it. A guy who shows a loss every year, or pays hardly anything in income taxes when he's living on a complete cash basis such as yourself in my opinion doesn't deserve to drive on tax-payer funded highways. I had no sympathy for the owner of a company who became angry when I turned down his loan request for not showing enough income.

I'm honestly not trying to sound like a dick, but I know I'll be a stickler for this kind of stuff in whatever law I end up practicing. Pay your taxes and I'll buy you a cheeseburger when you get to the states.

[northwood]

post above +1

[PLATONiC]

I guess what I'm getting at is since you admit the tutoring counts for at least more than half of your income, and it technically isn't "legit", you might want to get out of that practice if you plan to become a lawyer. Not trying to sound preachy at all, it's just paying taxes is a civic duty in the land of delicious cheeseburgers, and lawyers, in theory, are supposed to uphold the law of the land. If I sound like a douche, it's only because I've seen so many business owners come to me for a loan who inevitably say "Well, I know it shows a loss in 2009, but obviously I brought in much more than that." That always ticks me off because aside from a small amount in interest from CD's and various other instruments, my only income is W2.

So virtually every dollar that I earn is taxed before I get to see it. A guy who shows a loss every year, or pays hardly anything in income taxes when he's living on a complete cash basis such as yourself in my opinion doesn't deserve to drive on tax-payer funded highways. I had no sympathy for the owner of a company who became angry when I turned down his loan request for not showing enough income.

I'm honestly not trying to sound like a dick, but I know I'll be a stickler for this kind of stuff in whatever law I end up practicing. Pay your taxes and I'll buy you a cheeseburger when you get to the states.

I understand how you feel; I'd feel the same way if I were on the losing side of the deal. You might want to look into Plato's Ring of Gyges:D If you can pull it off (without any repercussions whatsoever, besides the illusory loss attributable to a lack of conscience), you'd do it too. Unless you've got the slave morality that Mr. Nietzsche taught us about.

There's virtually no way for C&F to figure out the fact that I have a second stream of income in a foreign country; I can easily find a way to "clean" the money that I stacked up through my friends or family if I were to ever consider transferring my assets to America.

Also, I still pay my taxes, actually. I pay as much as the average taxpayer would pay if calculated in terms of the per capita income, since my official job pays approximately that amount. Just the $30/hour tutoring that I do is all taken in as cash, and it doesn't look like I'll be in a shortage of clients since I have a considerable amount of exposure to those who are hungry for my services; in addition to word of mouth among crazy Korean mothers.

[SwollenMonkey]

Short and sweet:

1) Stop wondering.
2) Take the LSAT.
3) Go to law school.

End.

Time spent on TLS typing is time that could be spent on more productive matters.

[schmohawk]

I guess what I'm getting at is since you admit the tutoring counts for at least more than half of your income, and it technically isn't "legit", you might want to get out of that practice if you plan to become a lawyer. Not trying to sound preachy at all, it's just paying taxes is a civic duty in the land of delicious cheeseburgers, and lawyers, in theory, are supposed to uphold the law of the land. If I sound like a douche, it's only because I've seen so many business owners come to me for a loan who inevitably say "Well, I know it shows a loss in 2009, but obviously I brought in much more than that." That always ticks me off because aside from a small amount in interest from CD's and various other instruments, my only income is W2.

So virtually every dollar that I earn is taxed before I get to see it. A guy who shows a loss every year, or pays hardly anything in income taxes when he's living on a complete cash basis such as yourself in my opinion doesn't deserve to drive on tax-payer funded highways. I had no sympathy for the owner of a company who became angry when I turned down his loan request for not showing enough income.

I'm honestly not trying to sound like a dick, but I know I'll be a stickler for this kind of stuff in whatever law I end up practicing. Pay your taxes and I'll buy you a cheeseburger when you get to the states.

I understand how you feel; I'd feel the same way if I were on the losing side of the deal. You might want to look into Plato's Ring of Gyges:D If you can pull it off (without any repercussions whatsoever, besides the illusory loss attributable to a lack of conscience), you'd do it too. Unless you've got the slave morality that Mr. Nietzsche taught us about.

There's virtually no way for C&F to figure out the fact that I have a second stream of income in a foreign country; I can easily find a way to "clean" the money that I stacked up through my friends or family if I were to ever consider transferring my assets to America.

Also, I still pay my taxes, actually. I pay as much as the average taxpayer would pay if calculated in terms of the per capita income, since my official job pays approximately that amount. Just the $30/hour tutoring that I do is all taken in as cash, and it doesn't look like I'll be in a shortage of clients since I have a considerable amount of exposure to those who are hungry for my services; in addition to word of mouth among crazy Korean mothers.

By that logic, if I'm on the losing side of the deal, you must be on the winning side? You're cheating the government, I hardly would call you a winner. I'd call you a cheater. And your Plato reference doesn't apply since there are repercussions in this case, such as serious fines and jail time. Also, saying that you pay as much as the average taxpayer on a per capita basis is irrelevant. Nothing wrong with making some extra scrilla on the side, just do it the right way. C&F probably wouldn't catch it unless the IRS caught you first, but that still doesn't make it okay.

I realize you may look at it as no big deal since it's your money anyway, but as long as it's a law, well then it's a law. And tax evasion, in any form and at any amount, is against the law. Besides, you sound like you have a lucrative side business that I'll bet could really grow even more if you wanted it to. You're only hurting yourself by constantly having to lie on your tax return. And if you want to find a banker in the U.S. to fund your growth, these days auditors look for the numbers used for underwriting. So good luck.

But yes, I agree that if there were no repercussions, I guess we'd all do it. But then, we wouldn't have a country. Like I said, pay your taxes if you're coming this way.

[PLATONiC]

By that logic, if I'm on the losing side of the deal, you must be on the winning side? You're cheating the government, I hardly would call you a winner. I'd call you a cheater. And your Plato reference doesn't apply since there are repercussions in this case, such as serious fines and jail time. Also, saying that you pay as much as the average taxpayer on a per capita basis is irrelevant. Nothing wrong with making some extra scrilla on the side, just do it the right way. C&F probably wouldn't catch it unless the IRS caught you first, but that still doesn't make it okay.

I realize you may look at it as no big deal since it's your money anyway, but as long as it's a law, well then it's a law. And tax evasion, in any form and at any amount, is against the law. Besides, you sound like you have a lucrative side business that I'll bet could really grow even more if you wanted it to. You're only hurting yourself by constantly having to lie on your tax return. And if you want to find a banker in the U.S. to fund your growth, these days auditors look for the numbers used for underwriting. So good luck.

But yes, I agree that if there were no repercussions, I guess we'd all do it. But then, we wouldn't have a country. Like I said, pay your taxes if you're coming this way.

urgh;; you and I are on different wave lengths. I am so sorry.

One more thing: I think the world needs more people like you so that bolded doesn't happen. That way, I can evade taxes and we'd still have a country!

[schmohawk]

By that logic, if I'm on the losing side of the deal, you must be on the winning side? You're cheating the government, I hardly would call you a winner. I'd call you a cheater. And your Plato reference doesn't apply since there are repercussions in this case, such as serious fines and jail time. Also, saying that you pay as much as the average taxpayer on a per capita basis is irrelevant. Nothing wrong with making some extra scrilla on the side, just do it the right way. C&F probably wouldn't catch it unless the IRS caught you first, but that still doesn't make it okay.

I realize you may look at it as no big deal since it's your money anyway, but as long as it's a law, well then it's a law. And tax evasion, in any form and at any amount, is against the law. Besides, you sound like you have a lucrative side business that I'll bet could really grow even more if you wanted it to. You're only hurting yourself by constantly having to lie on your tax return. And if you want to find a banker in the U.S. to fund your growth, these days auditors look for the numbers used for underwriting. So good luck.

But yes, I agree that if there were no repercussions, I guess we'd all do it. But then, we wouldn't have a country. Like I said, pay your taxes if you're coming this way.

urgh;; you and I are on different wave lengths. I am so sorry.

One more thing: I think the world needs more people like you so that bolded doesn't happen. That way, I can evade taxes and we'd still have a country!

Yeah, we're on totally separate wavelengths. When I was a kid, if I was out with my friends playing and we came across a "No Trespassing" sign, I stopped. I got laughed at a few times, but I just don't have that bone in me that allows me to live dangerously. Not saying I've never broken the rules, I'm just saying I am the type who gets very nervous when I know I'm doing something I shouldn't be doing. Others might call that a rush, but it never felt good to me. As a grownup, I get a kick out of busting people and I cannot wait to get paid for it.

[PLATONiC]

Should I go to law school?

[xyzzzzzzzz]

[schmohawk]

Obviously that is a question only you can answer, and I think you know the answer already. You need to instead ask yourself if you will regret your decision in ten years. I know that I asked myself that very question about ten months ago and it brought me here.

[schmohawk]

By that logic, if I'm on the losing side of the deal, you must be on the winning side? You're cheating the government, I hardly would call you a winner. I'd call you a cheater. And your Plato reference doesn't apply since there are repercussions in this case, such as serious fines and jail time. Also, saying that you pay as much as the average taxpayer on a per capita basis is irrelevant. Nothing wrong with making some extra scrilla on the side, just do it the right way. C&F probably wouldn't catch it unless the IRS caught you first, but that still doesn't make it okay.

I realize you may look at it as no big deal since it's your money anyway, but as long as it's a law, well then it's a law. And tax evasion, in any form and at any amount, is against the law. Besides, you sound like you have a lucrative side business that I'll bet could really grow even more if you wanted it to. You're only hurting yourself by constantly having to lie on your tax return. And if you want to find a banker in the U.S. to fund your growth, these days auditors look for the numbers used for underwriting. So good luck.

But yes, I agree that if there were no repercussions, I guess we'd all do it. But then, we wouldn't have a country. Like I said, pay your taxes if you're coming this way.

urgh;; you and I are on different wave lengths. I am so sorry.

One more thing: I think the world needs more people like you so that bolded doesn't happen. That way, I can evade taxes and we'd still have a country!

Yeah, we're on totally separate wavelengths. When I was a kid, if I was out with my friends playing and we came across a "No Trespassing" sign, I stopped. I got laughed at a few times, but I just don't have that bone in me that allows me to live dangerously. Not saying I've never broken the rules, I'm just saying I am the type who gets very nervous when I know I'm doing something I shouldn't be doing. Others might call that a rush, but it never felt good to me. As a grownup, I get a kick out of busting people and I cannot wait to get paid for it.

Sounds like you should go into law enforcement.

Not brave enough for that line of work.

[Richie Tenenbaum]

By that logic, if I'm on the losing side of the deal, you must be on the winning side? You're cheating the government, I hardly would call you a winner. I'd call you a cheater. And your Plato reference doesn't apply since there are repercussions in this case, such as serious fines and jail time. Also, saying that you pay as much as the average taxpayer on a per capita basis is irrelevant. Nothing wrong with making some extra scrilla on the side, just do it the right way. C&F probably wouldn't catch it unless the IRS caught you first, but that still doesn't make it okay.

I realize you may look at it as no big deal since it's your money anyway, but as long as it's a law, well then it's a law. And tax evasion, in any form and at any amount, is against the law. Besides, you sound like you have a lucrative side business that I'll bet could really grow even more if you wanted it to. You're only hurting yourself by constantly having to lie on your tax return. And if you want to find a banker in the U.S. to fund your growth, these days auditors look for the numbers used for underwriting. So good luck.

But yes, I agree that if there were no repercussions, I guess we'd all do it. But then, we wouldn't have a country. Like I said, pay your taxes if you're coming this way.

urgh;; you and I are on different wave lengths. I am so sorry.

One more thing: I think the world needs more people like you so that bolded doesn't happen. That way, I can evade taxes and we'd still have a country!

Yeah, we're on totally separate wavelengths. When I was a kid, if I was out with my friends playing and we came across a "No Trespassing" sign, I stopped. I got laughed at a few times, but I just don't have that bone in me that allows me to live dangerously. Not saying I've never broken the rules, I'm just saying I am the type who gets very nervous when I know I'm doing something I shouldn't be doing. Others might call that a rush, but it never felt good to me. As a grownup, I get a kick out of busting people and I cannot wait to get paid for it.

You both sound like douche bags. HTH.

[PLATONiC]

You both sound like douche bags. HTH.

Yah! We're both douche bags!

[Richie Tenenbaum]

Unless you're current job and situation is causing you to be unhappy, I would think long and hard about making a decision that could put you in a lot of debt and with a job you dislike as much (or more) than your current one. I'm pretty risk averse though, so I might be biased.

Another thing to keep in mind--if you get in the high 160's you still have a shot of minimizing debt and going to a T30 school. WUSTL, Illinois, and Emory love throwing cash at people with high 160's.