Top Law Schools

Okay, so I got into Seattle U for 2010. I have yet to find out if I got any $$ but it's unlikely given my numbers (2.75/157).

The thing is, I was sort of counting on NOT getting in based on the rest of my cycle, and had made my peace with that. Last year when I took the LSAT, I didn't really study too much, and I scored about what I deserved for effort expended. This year, however, I was able to afford more materials, and having been shaken out of my complacency by my previous score and my cycle this year, I have been studying like crazy. Diagnostics put me somewhere between 168-175, whereas the two PTs I took last year w/o studying much placed me between 155-164. Obviously, my mileage may vary on test day, but even if I only score in the low 160s that's a big plus over my current 157 (as I understand it.)

More pure conjecture: Given a higher score, I think I could get into a better school or at least get money at SU. I would ideally be shooting for UC-Berkeley or UW, and I think those are both feasible w/a score in the 168-175 range.

Basically, if I go to Seattle U at sticker, I'm $150k in debt at a lower-ranked school. I have heard that Seattle places decently for its rank, but I'm still a little nervous. But given that law school is pretty much my highest current ambition, and that I've already waited a year post-UG to get here, I'm still loathe to give it up.

So, what do you think, TLSers? Do I see if I can defer, wait a year, and apply to better schools? Or is there a reason I'm overlooking for biting the very expensive platinum $150k bullet and going to Seattle this year?

Depends - Do you want to live in Seattle or the Northwest?

oberlin08 wrote:Depends - Do you want to live in Seattle or the Northwest?

Absolutely. Seattle or San Francisco would be my top picks for areas to practice in, w/Seattle taking priority, I think. But like I said, I think w/better scores, I'd have a shot at UW, which has better placement options, I think.

upfish wrote:

oberlin08 wrote:Depends - Do you want to live in Seattle or the Northwest?

Absolutely. Seattle or San Francisco would be my top picks for areas to practice in, w/Seattle taking priority, I think. But like I said, I think w/better scores, I'd have a shot at UW, which has better placement options, I think.

As someone who loves Seattle U (just put my tuition deposit down) - If youre sure you can get a better score and get into UW then go for it. But I dont think you'd be in too bad a spot as a Seattle grad either - unlike some of the lower ranked bay area schools where you might have a tougher time getting a job in the bay area afterwards.

wait it out. would you skip a yr of law school for $50k+? because with a 170+, thats the minimum id expect you to get from SU...

seattle is a Very oversaturated market. And uw clearly has a much higher alumni base for postgrad jobs as well.

on a side note, with a 175, you may be able to break the t14 if u so choose. check lsn, its been done this cycle.

either way u go, the year off, with ur apps already done, will allow u to apply really early and ull be happy with the results..

i say retake and sit it out. However, Berkeley is not happening with a 2.75. Maybe -maybe - with a 3.75, but they are picky about GPAs, unfortunately for both of us.

You should probably wait a year and retake. That said, UW is a long shot even with a 170 + given your gpa http://www.law.washington.edu/admission ... stics.aspx, and Berkeley probably even more so. Neither school is particularly friendly to extreme splitters. You can certainly do better than Seattle U or get some good money from Seattle U if you get a 165 or better, but I wouldn't retake unless you are absolutely sure you can do that because you might not even get in to SU again if you only increase by a couple of points, and I wouldn't count on UW or Berkeley regardless of your score.

What about w/URM status on the UC-Berkeley/UW possibilities? Neglected to add that...

upfish wrote:What about w/URM status on the UC-Berkeley/UW possibilities? Neglected to add that...

That probably does make a difference actually. I can't say how much, but it certainly strengthens the case for waiting a year. With a 170+ and URM status I would speculate that you might even have a shot at a few T14s.

jcl2 wrote:

upfish wrote:What about w/URM status on the UC-Berkeley/UW possibilities? Neglected to add that...

That probably does make a difference actually. I can't say how much, but it certainly strengthens the case for waiting a year. With a 170+ and URM status I would speculate that you might even have a shot at a few T14s.

Thanks for the advice, man. I'm definitely leaning towards waiting a year.

If you are consistently scoring no less than 11 points better on PTs than your actual score, a retake seems like a no-brainer.

I don't see any downside to deferring, retaking, and applying to some better schools.

The low GPA will still be an albatross even as an URM - especially at Berkeley. But keep at that LSAT, nail it on test day, and other splitter-friendly T14s and UW seem possible.

yeff wrote:If you are consistently scoring no less than 11 points better on PTs than your actual score, a retake seems like a no-brainer.

+180, if you have a decent job and are cash flow positive

However, if you are unemployed or have a crappy job, then think about it as a purely economic decision. Your score might get you, what, $25k-40k in scholarship? Your GPA won't change. But delaying by a year will prevent you from getting a legal job for another year, which will pay around $50-60k.

So, this thread is long dead, I guess, but I feel like starting another one is equally pointless since I only have this to add:

I got a $9k scholarship that's renewable yearly if I'm in the upper half of my class. The stipulation seems reasonable, because I mean, I'm probably not getting a job if I'm not in the top half anyway.

So, w/the scholarship, which is not deferable, should I still wait a year? Or should I take it and go?

EDIT: Other considerations:

I'm unemployed.
My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

upfish wrote: My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

Take her to the People's Court.

quickquestionthanks wrote:

upfish wrote: My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

Take [strike]her[/strike] him to the People's Court.

FTFY =p

But I've read that bad credit = no grad PLUS, and I'm assuming that's true. Is there any way around that, or am I screwed?

upfish wrote:

quickquestionthanks wrote:

upfish wrote: My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

Take [strike]her[/strike] him to the People's Court.

FTFY =p

But I've read that bad credit = no grad PLUS, and I'm assuming that's true. Is there any way around that, or am I screwed?

Oops. My man goggles took over. Does sound like something a dude would do...

I don't know the underwriting guidelines for grad PLUS loans, but I used to work in finance reviewing credit reports. A bad score isn't the whole picture. If you want you can PM me your FICO, how many "lines" of credit you have open, how many days you are past due (if at all) currently, or in the past, when that was, etc.

upfish wrote:So, this thread is long dead, I guess, but I feel like starting another one is equally pointless since I only have this to add:

I got a $9k scholarship that's renewable yearly if I'm in the upper half of my class. The stipulation seems reasonable, because I mean, I'm probably not getting a job if I'm not in the top half anyway.

So, w/the scholarship, which is not deferable, should I still wait a year? Or should I take it and go?

EDIT: Other considerations:

I'm unemployed.
My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

If you are able to really get a 170+ then def retake, even if you are unemployed. Start working with a small biz or something as a consultant over the next year (so you can say you have work experience) and then app to Northwestern.

gwuorbust wrote:

upfish wrote:So, this thread is long dead, I guess, but I feel like starting another one is equally pointless since I only have this to add:

I got a $9k scholarship that's renewable yearly if I'm in the upper half of my class. The stipulation seems reasonable, because I mean, I'm probably not getting a job if I'm not in the top half anyway.

So, w/the scholarship, which is not deferable, should I still wait a year? Or should I take it and go?

EDIT: Other considerations:

I'm unemployed.
My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

If you are able to really get a 170+ then def retake, even if you are unemployed. Start working with a small biz or something as a consultant over the next year (so you can say you have work experience) and then app to Northwestern.

Why Northwestern?

upfish wrote:

gwuorbust wrote:

upfish wrote:So, this thread is long dead, I guess, but I feel like starting another one is equally pointless since I only have this to add:

I got a $9k scholarship that's renewable yearly if I'm in the upper half of my class. The stipulation seems reasonable, because I mean, I'm probably not getting a job if I'm not in the top half anyway.

So, w/the scholarship, which is not deferable, should I still wait a year? Or should I take it and go?

EDIT: Other considerations:

I'm unemployed.
My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

If you are able to really get a 170+ then def retake, even if you are unemployed. Start working with a small biz or something as a consultant over the next year (so you can say you have work experience) and then app to Northwestern.

Why Northwestern?

Northwestern that is most willing to look at someone with very low GPA. The lowest on LSN for this cycle is 2.7 I believe. UVA will look at low GPA splitters though I do not think they reach much below 3.0.

But Northwestern looks at the lack of work experience as a very serious negative soft. Like ding worthy soft. So if you do not have we then I suggest you start getting some right now.

gwuorbust wrote:

upfish wrote:

gwuorbust wrote:

upfish wrote:So, this thread is long dead, I guess, but I feel like starting another one is equally pointless since I only have this to add:

I got a $9k scholarship that's renewable yearly if I'm in the upper half of my class. The stipulation seems reasonable, because I mean, I'm probably not getting a job if I'm not in the top half anyway.

So, w/the scholarship, which is not deferable, should I still wait a year? Or should I take it and go?

EDIT: Other considerations:

I'm unemployed.
My credit rating has taken a serious hit due to an ex-boyfriend (awesome.)

If you are able to really get a 170+ then def retake, even if you are unemployed. Start working with a small biz or something as a consultant over the next year (so you can say you have work experience) and then app to Northwestern.

Why Northwestern?

Northwestern that is most willing to look at someone with very low GPA. The lowest on LSN for this cycle is 2.7 I believe. UVA will look at low GPA splitters though I do not think they reach much below 3.0.

But Northwestern looks at the lack of work experience as a very serious negative soft. Like ding worthy soft. So if you do not have we then I suggest you start getting some right now.

Does the reason for a low GPA play into things strongly/at all? I have had a decently positive cycle despite my GPA, and I attribute that to my addendum describing the intensely ridiculous medical/family circumstances that surrounded my freshman year, which is followed by a drastic upward tick (1.5 to 4.0). Will that soften the blow, or does that essentially not matter?

I feel like getting WL'd at UC-Boulder is an indication that at least some adcomms are sympathetic and are taking that into account...

As a URM you might be able to LSAT your way into UW if you retake. but think really hard about what you can accomplish on that test (i.e. can you actually bump up to at least a 163). You will have to at least bump up to a 163 or 164 (UW median) for the UW to disregard your GPA. Also bear in mind that UW has a rep for liking GPA's, which adds challenge.

P.S. if you DO wait a year, make sure to write a GPA addendum. Did you do that for this years app?

Advice:
1. Retake the LSAT
2. Get around a 170 and go to a T14 over any school in the Northwest.
2. Come back to Northwest and work in Biglaw
4. Prosper

legalease9 wrote:As a URM you might be able to LSAT your way into UW if you retake. but think really hard about what you can accomplish on that test (i.e. can you actually bump up to at least a 163). You will have to at least bump up to a 163 or 164 (UW median) for the UW to disregard your GPA. Also bear in mind that UW has a rep for liking GPA's, which adds challenge.

P.S. if you DO wait a year, make sure to write a GPA addendum. Did you do that for this years app?

I posted about the addendum a couple posts back. I think it's what has gotten me WLs over auto-rejs, because it's basically the perfect storm of family emergencies that killed my GPA, followed by a drastic upward trend.

I am as certain as I can be that I can top 163.

jacko wrote:Advice:
1. Retake the LSAT
2. Get around a 170 and go to a T14 over any school in the Northwest.
2. Come back to Northwest and work in Biglaw
4. Prosper

I don't think I want to work in Biglaw, except maybe to pay off debts. I'm generally obsessed with my work, but I don't think I'm obsessed to the point that I understand I'd need to be to enjoy Biglaw. I'm not super into money, and I'm planning to do non-profit stuff if I can get into that.