Top Law Schools

Thanks.

If you're really set on practicing law, take a year off, work and retake the LSAT.

If you can even get your score into the mid 150s, it will open a world of doors into law schools for you given that you're a URM.

Next time adequately prepare: you should be doing two hours a day of prep (roughly 4 LSAT sections), 7 days a week, for two to three months to truly get in the range of your potential.

I also recommend the Powerscore virtual course: it was awesome.

deltasigbn wrote:Another question, how bad would it screw me to go to Cooley? Would it be impossible for me to get a job even if I excelled there academically?

This is a bad move. If you want to be an attorney so bad, act like it. Prepare as if excelling in the profession would mean something to you. Put in the time now, and it'll save you a lot of time (and money) later.

No matter what school you attend, you aren't doomed for unemployment. From lower schools it's just harder and the job you may get isn't as good as from other schools.

If I was in your situation, I would study like crazy for the LSAT. If your score doesn't get out of the 140s, then I would thick twice about going to law school. I know it isn't a perfect indicator of performance in law school, but with a really low score I would doubt my ability to perform well in school.

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icydash wrote:If you're really set on practicing law, take a year off, work and retake the LSAT.

If you can even get your score into the mid 150s, it will open a world of doors into law schools for you given that you're a URM.

Next time adequately prepare: you should be doing two hours a day of prep (roughly 4 LSAT sections), 7 days a week, for two to three months to truly get in the range of your potential.

I also recommend the Powerscore virtual course: it was awesome.

deltasigbn wrote:Another question, how bad would it screw me to go to Cooley? Would it be impossible for me to get a job even if I excelled there academically?

This is a bad move. If you want to be an attorney so bad, act like it. Prepare as if excelling in the profession would mean something to you. Put in the time now, and it'll save you a lot of time (and money) later.

TITCR, don't go to Cooley.

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School like that you will probably only be allowed to take the bar in Mass. and maybe a couple other states. Seriously, if this is something you really wanna do, re-take the LSAT, we're not joking.

deltasigbn wrote:Okay.

Also has anybody heard of Massachusetts school of law at Andover?

They apparently don't require the lsat, and instead give their own essay entrance exam.

It seems like you're trying to take the easy way out. In general, I'm getting the feeling you may not be cut out for this profession. Don't go to a bullshit school-- prepare adequately, and do well on a LSAT retake. Again, adequate preparation is NOT four hours of private tutoring. It's 120ish hours over the course of two months.

Law school is a LOT of hard work. If you think the LSAT is bad, wait until law school finals. It's like five LSATs all in a one week time period -- sometimes a few in a single day. If you can't handle the LSAT and don't want to study for it, law school may not be for you.

This is not to be a dick, but hopefully to enlighten you. Law school is no joke. If you don't even want to prepare for the entrance exam, it's not a profession you're going to excel in.

Your GPA is good (mine was only a 3.52), and you're a URM. With a 160+ LSAT score, you have a golden ticket because you're black into a top 14 school that other kids would kill for. Don't waste it because you're lazy.

deltasigbn wrote:Okay.

Also has anybody heard of Massachusetts school of law at Andover?

They apparently don't require the lsat, and instead give their own essay entrance exam.

Only go if you want to be unemployed when you get out.

RETAKE

Talk to us when you break 160.

I may get flamed for this, since most people may think I don't belong at TLS, but here I go anyway:

I am a URM too. I took the LSAT the first time in 2000 right after I finished UG, with little to no preparation. Bombed it – 143. I took it again in 2007, again, with very little serious preparation. Bomb again – 147. I managed to come up with $1,100 and took a prep course for the Feb. 2010 test. I got 155. Much better. I was in quite the dilemma; should I take again? Working full-time and a family, I know I didn’t devote near enough energy to my course homework, etc. I *KNOW* with more prep time, I could push 160s, or even better. But I’m going to let it ride. It is well in the range for some of my safe schools. I was content to leave it at that, but then I got several fee waiver invitations to apply for schools I considered beyond reach. I assume it was because of the URM boost. I applied to every where who offered me a fee waiver, since I think my softs are pretty good. (My parents were high school drop-outs, I was pregnant at 18, single-mom, and I managed to finish UG and an MBA at a large public university.)

Long story short: Take it again. Just getting mid-150s will get you somewhere. I regret now that I didn’t work harder on prep, because then I could have found myself in scholarship range. But the tradeoff is that I can go next year with my 155, opposed to trying to get another 8-10 points and waiting for next cycle to apply with scholarship options.

hsprophet wrote:No matter what school you attend, you aren't doomed for unemployment. From lower schools it's just harder and the job you may get isn't as good as from other schools.

Not true. Even during the boom, 30% of fresh JDs did not get a legal job. Now, it's probably higher than that. Unemployment is heavily biased towards lower ranked schools too.

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rayiner wrote:

hsprophet wrote:No matter what school you attend, you aren't doomed for unemployment. From lower schools it's just harder and the job you may get isn't as good as from other schools.

Not true. Even during the boom, 30% of fresh JDs did not get a legal job. Now, it's probably higher than that. Unemployment is heavily biased towards lower ranked schools too.

I've heard Cooley places really well at McDonalds and you can even get Chili's from the top 20%.

rayiner wrote:

hsprophet wrote:No matter what school you attend, you aren't doomed for unemployment. From lower schools it's just harder and the job you may get isn't as good as from other schools.

Not true. Even during the boom, 30% of fresh JDs did not get a legal job. Now, it's probably higher than that. Unemployment is heavily biased towards lower ranked schools too.

I would say the vast majority of graduates of any law school get jobs within a reasonable amount of time. Maybe not legal jobs, but they aren't unemployed.

Even as you mentioned, 30% of fresh JD's didn't get legal jobs, but 70% did. That's not being "doomed for unemployment."

OP: Take a serious look at what type of legal career you want first. That determines a lot. Your performance and choice of school means less if you want to work at Legal Aid vs. biglaw.

deltasigbn wrote:I'm not trying to take the easy way out, I just realize that I don't have that much time.

My parents have said they can help me finance my education while they are working, but they are going to be retiring pretty soon. 1 year is a lot of time, a lot of things can happen in that time that could make it hard for me to go back to school. I've never been out of school before.

'

Three points to consider on this:

1. If you work during the year off and actually SAVE as much $$ as you can, you'll probably be able to put away a decent chunk of cash. That means being miserly with your money, but if you really want it, you can do it.

2. If your parents could help you if you were going to school this year, then nothing stops them from putting what they would have given you this year into a savings account and giving it to you next year.

3. A solid increase in your LSAT score will probably lead to some scholarship offers which will reduce the financial burden on you and your parents.

deltasigbn wrote:

icydash wrote:

deltasigbn wrote:Okay.

Also has anybody heard of Massachusetts school of law at Andover?

They apparently don't require the lsat, and instead give their own essay entrance exam.

It seems like you're trying to take the easy way out. In general, I'm getting the feeling you may not be cut out for this profession. Don't go to a bullshit school, prepare adequately, and do well on a LSAT retake. Again, adequate preparation is NOT four hours of private tutoring. It's 120ish hours over the course of two months.

Law school is a LOT of hard work. If you think the LSAT is bad, wait until law school finals. It's like five LSATs all in a one week time period -- sometimes a few in a single day. If you can't handle the LSAT and don't want to study for it, law school may not be for you.

This is not to be a dick, but hopefully to enlighten you. Law school is no joke. If you don't even want to prepare for the entrance exam, it's not a profession you're going to excel in.

Your GPA is good (mine was only a 3.52), and you're a URM. With a 160+ LSAT score, you have a golden ticket because you're black into a top 14 school that other kids would kill for. Don't waste it because you're lazy.

I'm not trying to take the easy way out, I just realize that I don't have that much time.

My parents have said they can help me finance my education while they are working, but they are going to be retiring pretty soon. 1 year is a lot of time, a lot of things can happen in that time that could make it hard for me to go back to school. I've never been out of school before.

If they can finance your education now, one year won't make a difference. And if they *can't* finance your education because they retire or whatever, it's even MORE incentive for you to study hard, do well on the LSAT, and get mad scholarships because you're a URM.

I don't think you realize what kind of a golden ticket you have being a URM. With a 160+ score, people have gotten into Harvard/Columbia/NYU because they are a URM. Do you know what us white kids would give to have that? For us, anything less than a 3.9 and 170 won't do it. Don't waste this opportunity.

In the scheme of life, 1 year is NOT a lot of time and you'll save yourself MORE time in the end. Do it right the first time around, and you'll save yourself a lot of time, energy, stress and money in the long haul.

So what you've never been out of school before? Go get a job and some life experience-- it'll help you in your future legal career

deltasigbn wrote:Alright so I took the February LSAT and bombed it (142). I didn't adequately prepare infact I would say I only did about 3 weeks of preparation, I took about 4 hours of private kaplan tutoring and did badly on the 5 practice tests I took (142-144).

I currently have a 3.56 gpa at my school, and an lsdas gpa of 3.2.

Are there any law schools that I could realistically get into? I am an under represented minority (black), I attend school in california but am originally from Canada.

My rush is that I would have to take a year off and I have absolutely no clue what I will do with myself in that time.

Another question, how bad would it screw me to go to Cooley? Would it be impossible for me to get a job even if I excelled there academically?

Please help, I am in a complete panic.

Retake the LSAT if you want to be a lawyer, or rethink things. 3.2 GPA with a 140s LSAT doesn't make you seem to be the most qualified of applicants

deltasigbn wrote:Alright so I took the February LSAT and bombed it (142). I didn't adequately prepare infact I would say I only did about 3 weeks of preparation, I took about 4 hours of private kaplan tutoring and did badly on the 5 practice tests I took (142-144).

Please help, I am in a complete panic.

Also, since you know you did horribly little preparation, and your practice tests were so low...did you really not see this coming? It's not like on test day you were magically going to get a 165--you didn't think "hey, maybe I'm not ready to take the test" and cancel or study harder?

Just aim for the 150's man. It will open 100 doors (Many T2's, most/all T3s/T4's).

Don't let people tell you that you are not cut out to be a lawyer because you hate or suck at the LSAT. Law school exams are a different kind of animal. Preparation for the LSAT is difficult for a number of reasons, plus you will never use the LSAT in your career or in life. What you will learn and apply in a law school exam is applicable to the real world. There is a different kind of motivation that goes with that.

Really, the best bet is to sign up for the test on October and study a little bit each week. Focus on your weakest area first (games, reading or logical reasoning). Take this year as an opportunity to get some solid work experience or just earn a paycheck while you take practice tests.

jetlagz28 wrote:Don't let people tell you that you are not cut out to be a lawyer because you hate or suck at the LSAT. Law school exams are a different kind of animal. Preparation for the LSAT is difficult for a number of reasons, plus you will never use the LSAT in your career or in life. What you will learn and apply in a law school exam is applicable to the real world. There is a different kind of motivation that goes with that.

We're not saying he's not cut out to be a lawyer because he hates or sucks at the LSAT. We're saying it's possible he may not be cut out to be a lawyer because he doesn't even have the motivation to study for the entrance exam to law school. Getting in is the easiest part of law school. If you can't even motivate yourself to study hard / do well on that.... well you must not really want it that bad, and you're not going to excel in the profession.

Everyone hates the LSAT and initially sucks at it. What separates the 160's from the 140s is their motivation to succeed / drive, ability to learn new concepts, and how bad they "want it." These factors are highly relevant to whether or not our OP will be a good attorney. Luckily, they are mostly factors that are easy for the OP to cultivate for himself. All he has to do is decide he wants to...and go do it.

4 hours of tutoring (I ended up doing around 50 hrs. I paid for 20) and 5 PT's are nowhere near enough to get a higher LSAT. You need to give yourself WAY more time and put in way more effort than you did to get your score up.

Sangiovese wrote:

deltasigbn wrote:I'm not trying to take the easy way out, I just realize that I don't have that much time.

My parents have said they can help me finance my education while they are working, but they are going to be retiring pretty soon. 1 year is a lot of time, a lot of things can happen in that time that could make it hard for me to go back to school. I've never been out of school before.

'

Three points to consider on this:

1. If you work during the year off and actually SAVE as much $$ as you can, you'll probably be able to put away a decent chunk of cash. That means being miserly with your money, but if you really want it, you can do it.

2. If your parents could help you if you were going to school this year, then nothing stops them from putting what they would have given you this year into a savings account and giving it to you next year.

3. A solid increase in your LSAT score will probably lead to some scholarship offers which will reduce the financial burden on you and your parents.

This is great advice.

delta -- with your current stats Law School Predictor says you have a shot at going part-time to schools like Indiana-Indianapolis, Hawaii, Michigan State, etc. http://www.lawschoolpredictor.com/wp-co ... ograms.htm

All of these schools could help you, but even if you do end up going to them if you increase your score you'd probably be able to go for a lot less than sticker price.

Ultimately, though, I would buy the Powerscore Bibles (the 3 would run you ~ $100) and start looking for gigs. If need be, try to find something to pay the bills (catering, busboy, landscaping, etc.) and then spend the rest of your time volunteering with a local nonprofit/shelter/community center. There's a wider world out there beyond law school.

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deltasigbn wrote:For the people saying I lack motivation, I've been enrolled in 6 courses these past two semesters, so in my preparation I was also focusing on the work I had for other classes. I initially wanted to take the December lsat but because of the workload last semester I thought it wasn't a good idea.

I knew I hadn't prepared enough for this one however I was starting to get pretty decent at logical reasoning and reading comp. I believe I completely bombed the logic games section(4 correct if I was lucky) on this test, and that is what was my major focus for my tutoring sessions.

While it would absolutely be difficult to study with 6 classes going on, and I definitely feel for you, my previous advice still stands: Get a job, take a year, and retake.

Adcoms won't care why you didn't do well, or how many classes you were in, just that you didn't do well.