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Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:52 pm
by lawbreakr
I'm trying to fully understand the Cooley scholarship formula(s). According to
http://www.lsac.org/officialguide/2015/lsac_1796.asp there seem to be two ways to calculate an "Honors Scholarship":
One:
(UndergradGPA x 15) + LSAT = Admission Index
Admission Index: Honors Scholarship
217+: 100%
214–216: 80%
210–213: 60%
205–209: 50%
198–204: 25%
191–197 (with 141+ LSAT): 15%
Two:
LSAT: Honors Scholarship
160+: 100%
153–159: 50%
149–152: 25%
147–148 (with 183+ index): 15%
So for the 100% level, I am understanding the person needs an LSAT of either [217-(UndergradGPA x 15)] or 160.
What's confusing to me is that the two ways are introduced with the statement
"Students can earn up to 65 percent of tuition in two ways:".
Looking a couple years back
http://www.lsac.org/officialguide/2013/lsac_1796.asp the statement was
"Students can earn up to 100 percent of tuition in two ways:".
So does that mean presently a 100% Honors Scholarship is 65% of tuition?
The Cooley site
http://www.cooley.edu/prospective/scholarships.html lists a different scale (10% increments) but without any actual formula. It also clearly shows the scholarships go to 100% of tuition, a contradiction of the 65% statement (unless there are other ways beyond the two methods listed above).
Could someone clearly explain the current Cooley merit scholarship, preferably with an example or two?
Thank you.
Post removed.
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:55 pm
by basedvulpes
Post removed.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 1:59 pm
by Clemenceau
Retake
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:01 pm
by Mack.Hambleton
Who gives a shit
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:02 pm
by lawbreakr
I just realized there is a more updated profile
http://www.lsac.org/officialguide/2016/lsac_1796.asp which lists no formula.
I also just received a reply to my email to admissions that told me they'd let me know if I fill out their mailing list form.
I guess maybe this is all proprietary now.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:06 pm
by landshoes
If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:17 pm
by lawbreakr
landshoes wrote:If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Even if it costs me $0?
I'm not looking to become a full-time attorney or for a job as an attorney. I am looking to be a better businessman in a very highly regulated industry. I am also geographically constrained for a few years while my significant other completes her education. A Cooley location just happens to be within walking distance. I figured if it costs me nothing, there isn't much I can lose.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:19 pm
by TLSModBot
lawbreakr wrote:landshoes wrote:If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Even if it costs me $0?
I'm not looking to become a full-time attorney or for a job as an attorney. I am looking to be a better businessman in a very highly regulated industry. I am also geographically constrained for a few years while my significant other completes her education and a Cooley location just happens to be within walking distance. My goals are not typical.
A. A Cooley law degree helps you 0% in 'becoming a better businessman', or in pretty much anything.
B. Go to business school
C. If dumpster fires had their own language, their word for 'dumpster fire' would be 'Cooley'
D. It won't cost 0$. There is the opportunity cost of what you could have been earning in time you were not at Cooley.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:23 pm
by Johann
lawbreakr wrote:landshoes wrote:If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Even if it costs me $0?
I'm not looking to become a full-time attorney or for a job as an attorney. I am looking to be a better businessman in a very highly regulated industry. I am also geographically constrained for a few years while my significant other completes her education. A Cooley location just happens to be within walking distance. I figured if it costs me nothing, there isn't much I can lose.
Your reasoning is correct. Free degrees are pretty worthwhile. There are lots of jobs where people don't even realize but certain credentials give you a one time bonus or 10% raise just for having regardless the school. Most people on this forum don't really have any idea about how the real world works and thus they are headed to law school.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:25 pm
by Johann
Capitol_Idea wrote:lawbreakr wrote:landshoes wrote:If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Even if it costs me $0?
I'm not looking to become a full-time attorney or for a job as an attorney. I am looking to be a better businessman in a very highly regulated industry. I am also geographically constrained for a few years while my significant other completes her education and a Cooley location just happens to be within walking distance. My goals are not typical.
A. A Cooley law degree helps you 0% in 'becoming a better businessman', or in pretty much anything.
B. Go to business school
C. If dumpster fires had their own language, their word for 'dumpster fire' would be 'Cooley'
D. It won't cost 0$. There is the opportunity cost of what you could have been earning in time you were not at Cooley.
Business in a highly regulated is pretty much definition of JD advantage. They don't care where the JD is from but it helps significantly with controlling your career and being able to run departments. Are people on this forum really this oblivious to the real world?
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:27 pm
by TLSModBot
JohannDeMann wrote:lawbreakr wrote:landshoes wrote:If you're thinking about going there, stop. That's really not a good idea. You seem bright and capable of detail-oriented legal work and this will be a mistake at any cost.
Even if it costs me $0?
I'm not looking to become a full-time attorney or for a job as an attorney. I am looking to be a better businessman in a very highly regulated industry. I am also geographically constrained for a few years while my significant other completes her education. A Cooley location just happens to be within walking distance. I figured if it costs me nothing, there isn't much I can lose.
Your reasoning is correct. Free degrees are pretty worthwhile. There are lots of jobs where people don't even realize but certain credentials give you a one time bonus or 10% raise just for having regardless the school. Most people on this forum don't really have any idea about how the real world works and thus they are headed to law school.
As someone who was out in the 'real world' for almost a decade working with people who followed advice like Johann's, I strongly disagree.
NO graduate school is worth it for the sake of having the degree - unless you have a plan of how it is going to impact your career and have actually done some baseline research into that, you are very likely wasting time and money. That goes for MBAs, PhDs, MAs, and most especially JDs.
If you are in an industry that just arbitrarily pays better because you have a JD (lol), then maybe it is worth it in the long term but given that you are losing 3 years of income and growth in whatever career you are in, I wouldn't recommend it.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:29 pm
by TLSModBot
Not flame - interested what business sectors Johann is talking about.
Litigation and financial consulting doesn't give a shit if you have a JD. They care much MUCH more about experience. Experience you don't get while you are stuck in law school. Plus, y'know, law school doesn't teach youbANYTHING useful relating to business.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:29 pm
by Mack.Hambleton
Just do part time somewhere
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:42 pm
by landshoes
there's also the negative signaling from going to a place like Cooley. People see that you went there and assume you're either 1) incapable of getting in elsewhere or 2) incapable of doing the right research before making a 3yr investment of time.
Neither is a good look.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:43 pm
by Johann
Capitol_Idea wrote:
As someone who was out in the 'real world' for almost a decade working with people who followed advice like Johann's, I strongly disagree.
NO graduate school is worth it for the sake of having the degree - unless you have a plan of how it is going to impact your career and have actually done some baseline research into that, you are very likely wasting time and money. That goes for MBAs, PhDs, MAs, and most especially JDs.
If you are in an industry that just arbitrarily pays better because you have a JD (lol), then maybe it is worth it in the long term but given that you are losing 3 years of income and growth in whatever career you are in, I wouldn't recommend it.
It appears OP has done some baseline research - he is in a very regulated industry where having a JD would be beneficial. Can't waste money on free things either.
And there are lots of industries where having a credential automatically entitles you to a bonus. My friend who works at a university got a free MBA through the school part time and when she finished they just gave her a 10% raise without her asking because its university policy. The policy is also a staple in most government jobs as well. Certain degrees trigger automatic pay grades in lots of places with standardized salaries.
More importantly in a regulated industry, if you want to be the top you have to be more than the compliance monkey. Always better to be the brains behind the operation so you can run it. I graduated with a lot of people who were pushed into compliance by default and most of them at this point could run a group now if they weren't in a big city (small pond vs big pond). They are better positioned than all of the people who they started out working beside despite the other people's greater years on the job.
Regulation is a very hot industry right now and is just going to get better knowing the way government is trending. This isn't just someone blindly saying I want to go Cooley. They are in the field and need a JD from anywhere to differentiate their skillset from the monkey/robot that will do their job in 10 years.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:45 pm
by Johann
Capitol_Idea wrote:Not flame - interested what business sectors Johann is talking about.
Litigation and financial consulting doesn't give a shit if you have a JD. They care much MUCH more about experience. Experience you don't get while you are stuck in law school. Plus, y'know, law school doesn't teach youbANYTHING useful relating to business.
Banking regulations are insane right now. They are all relatively new and just getting newer and newer. New pushes to break up big banks again right now. FATCA compliance. Perfect opportunities for people to get in at the ground floor and be running departments well before age 40 cause no boomers can do this shit.
Healthcare regulation is also brand new and presents the same opportunity.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:48 pm
by Johann
landshoes wrote:there's also the negative signaling from going to a place like Cooley. People see that you went there and assume you're either 1) incapable of getting in elsewhere or 2) incapable of doing the right research before making a 3yr investment of time.
Neither is a good look.
That's not really true either. It depends on your story. K-JD sure. But in OP's case, I knew I needed a law degree to do this to transform my career. I was locked into this location at that point in my life so I got the degree from Cooley with the intention to do this. Pretty easily explained. Nobody in Michigan is gonna question that.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:49 pm
by lawbreakr
Capitol_Idea wrote:
B. Go to business school
Already did. It helped me start a nice business in financial services which I would like to expand in a few years.
Capitol_Idea wrote:
D. It won't cost 0$. There is the opportunity cost of what you could have been earning in time you were not at Cooley.
That is true. However, I am not one to spend all my free time drinking beers. I enjoy learning. So there are hidden benefits as well.
landshoes wrote:there's also the negative signaling from going to a place like Cooley. People see that you went there and assume you're either 1) incapable of getting in elsewhere or 2) incapable of doing the right research before making a 3yr investment of time.
Neither is a good look.
This is actually a concern of mine. People react very passionately about this school.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:53 pm
by landshoes
JohannDeMann wrote:landshoes wrote:there's also the negative signaling from going to a place like Cooley. People see that you went there and assume you're either 1) incapable of getting in elsewhere or 2) incapable of doing the right research before making a 3yr investment of time.
Neither is a good look.
That's not really true either. It depends on your story. K-JD sure. But in OP's case, I knew I needed a law degree to do this to transform my career. I was locked into this location at that point in my life so I got the degree from Cooley with the intention to do this. Pretty easily explained. Nobody in Michigan is gonna question that.
First, that's assuming you get the interview. The signaling happens long before that. If he has his own business maybe that's not such a big deal. But in that case, law school has to be a supremely impractical way to gain the knowledge that you need to improve your own business.
Anyway, just call them and ask about their scholarship and refuse to go unless they don't charge you money.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:54 pm
by Julien_Benda
Capitol_Idea wrote:C. If dumpster fires had their own language, their word for 'dumpster fire' would be 'Cooley'
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:59 pm
by lawbreakr
JohannDeMann wrote:
Always better to be the brains behind the operation so you can run it.
This is exactly my reasoning. I have spent too much time trying to understand things I have a hard time controlling simply because I do not know how to research the law well. I don't want to be a lawyer (no offense to anyone who does). I just want to be better at business regulation so I can run a better operation and possibly take advantage of the legal environment better.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:00 pm
by thesealocust
Julien_Benda wrote:Capitol_Idea wrote:C. If dumpster fires had their own language, their word for 'dumpster fire' would be 'Cooley'
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:01 pm
by celtslaw
You seem pretty intent on attending despite what the majority of people here are telling you. By all means, go ahead and attend Cooley- it's your life after all. Just don't expect anyone to respect the degree that you will spend three years earning. Let there be no mistake: we're talking about the worst of the worst when it comes to law schools.
Best of luck to you.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:02 pm
by pancakes3
Michigan State is also in Lansing, and Michigan proper is an hour's drive away. Michigan State for free is defensible. No reason for Cooley to exist.
Re: Understanding the Cooley Scholarship
Posted: Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:04 pm
by Johann
[quote="thesealocust"][/quote]
Why would you ever want a law degree to assist/complement your business when you can go T14! V10! to flameout all within 2 years of practice.