Top Law Schools

AA Male
2.7
175 LSAT

Do I have a shot at Harvard?

Not a good shot with that GPA. If you see lawschoolnumbers graphs there seems to be a GPA floor set at 3.1 for the past years

You're in an exceedly rare position. The number of AA males with your LSAT is pretty low, and I'd venture an AA male splitter with your stats even rarer. That's not a terrible position to be in, as schools will be competing for AA males with your LSAT for sure. Unfortunately, that small sample size means nobody on here can really tell you much about prospects.

I'd say you're not out anywhere, but you should apply broadly across the T14/T20 and not get attached to any one school. Your cycle is going to be weird.

extreme splitter + URM = very weird cycle. guessing no Harvard though

Dcc617 wrote:You're in an exceedly rare position. The number of AA males with your LSAT is pretty low, and I'd venture an AA male splitter with your stats even rarer. That's not a terrible position to be in, as schools will be competing for AA males with your LSAT for sure. Unfortunately, that small sample size means nobody on here can really tell you much about prospects.

I'd say you're not out anywhere, but you should apply broadly across the T14/T20 and not get attached to any one school. Your cycle is going to be weird.

Cosign the above in its entirety. Apply to every single T13 and T20. Apply early in the cycle (i.e., before Thanksgiving). I'd be shocked if you didn't end up with multiple T13 offers, and you're pretty much guaranteed to get in to WUSTL with $$$, but hard to say for sure beyond that (legendary GPA snobs Berkeley and Cornell probably very unlikely, though with URM status in the mix, who knows?).

Harvard's possible, but hard to say. Don't fixate on any particular school.

And last but not least, CONGRATS on the amazing LSAT! You'll have a great cycle.

Profile:
African American Male
3.0 GPA
177 LSAT

Schools
Harvard
Columbia
Chicago
NYU

Can you give me a percent chance at each school

You can try the LSAC, 7sage and mylsn predictors. You do have a good chance at these schools if you apply early next cycle, at this point in the cycle it's not advisable to apply

You have a very wide spread of credentials, so it is going to be nearly impossible to forecast your chances at each of these schools. Because your GPA is low enough generally to disqualify you from most t14s, you may find that some schools reject or waitlist you despite your excellent LSAT. On the other hand, because of your amazing LSAT and URM status, you may get into some schools that largely ignore your GPA. I would say your chance of getting into at least one of these schools is about 70-80%, and your chance at each is between 10% and 50%. You should apply much more broadly than this: blanket the T14 and possibly even the T20. Because your cycle will be so unpredictable, it will be helpful to have as large a sample as possible. Also, definitely apply at the beginning of the cycle if you can.

would love to hear more answer!

OP, did your numbers improve from your last thread, where you had a 2.7 and 175? When and how did that happen?

cavalier1138 wrote:Both positions are basically true.

Once you're below the 25th percentile, your actual GPA doesn't matter to an extent. Schools like HYS often have GPA floors that you simply can't fall beneath, even if you have a great LSAT. And even in less GPA-conscious schools, a sub-3.0 GPA can be a serious issue. So while you might see very little difference in results between applicants with a 3.0x and a 3.1x, you will likely see a significant difference between applicants with a 2.x and a 3.0x.

What is the absolute GPA floor for the following schools for an AA Male with an LSAT of 175+

Harvard
Columbia
Chicago
NYU

TLSMM99 wrote:

cavalier1138 wrote:Both positions are basically true.

Once you're below the 25th percentile, your actual GPA doesn't matter to an extent. Schools like HYS often have GPA floors that you simply can't fall beneath, even if you have a great LSAT. And even in less GPA-conscious schools, a sub-3.0 GPA can be a serious issue. So while you might see very little difference in results between applicants with a 3.0x and a 3.1x, you will likely see a significant difference between applicants with a 2.x and a 3.0x.

What is the absolute GPA floor for the following schools for an AA Male with an LSAT of 175+

Harvard
Columbia
Chicago
NYU

Schools (except for Yale) don't generally report that number, but based on prior admissions specs, we can guess that Harvard is likely somewhere above a 3.0. Chicago, too. But Columbia and NYU might be more forgiving. Your URM status does affect the equation somewhat, so if you have a high LSAT, applying broadly is the best option.

I know you want hard numbers, but no one's going to be able to give you that.

Chicago reports their minumum GPA for each class, like Yale, and it's usually solidly above 3.0:

https://www.law.uchicago.edu/files/Admi ... 0FINAL.pdf - 3.13

https://www.law.uchicago.edu/class-profile - 3.31

It is plausible that HLS might be less picky, because they are so much larger, but I doubt it.

The Lsat Airbender wrote:Chicago reports their minumum GPA for each class, like Yale, and it's usually solidly above 3.0:

https://www.law.uchicago.edu/files/Admi ... 0FINAL.pdf - 3.13

https://www.law.uchicago.edu/class-profile - 3.31

It is plausible that HLS might be less picky, because they are so much larger, but I doubt it.

Note that this is range is for matriculated students, not admitted students, so it's very possible they let some people in with lower stats who chose to go elsewhere. Even so, not looking great for a 2.9 applicant (or a 3.0 applicant, fwiw).

AA Male
3.0 GPA
177 LSAT

I am aware I will get at least one t14 admission. What I want to know is what are my chances at T6 INDIVIDUALLY

Can you give me a percent chance or an idea about how I could fare at each school

My dream is Harvard

OP: I merged this with your prior topic because it's exactly the same question.

As was already stated here, no one can give you precise percentage chances at each of these schools. You've already gotten some specific advice (and some questions that you didn't respond to regarding your numbers changing dramatically between February and March). I strongly suggest following up on the advice you've been given instead of repeatedly asking for something that people can't provide.

cavalier1138 wrote:OP: I merged this with your prior topic because it's exactly the same question.

As was already stated here, no one can give you precise percentage chances at each of these schools. You've already gotten some specific advice (and some questions that you didn't respond to regarding your numbers changing dramatically between February and March). I strongly suggest following up on the advice you've been given instead of repeatedly asking for something that people can't provide.

To add on to my fellow moderator's post above: I also merged in your first topic, when you claimed your GPA was 2.7, because that is again basically the same question.

It isn't helpful to ask hypothetical questions. If your GPA's a 2.7, it doesn't make sense to ask people what your chances are with a 3.0. You don't have a 3.0.

I also note your other thread, http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 2&t=304847, asking why LSAC GPA is "always" lower than school GPA. (It's not always lower; LSAC GPA can actually be higher than school GPA, as several posters noted in that thread.) In any case, law schools ONLY care about LSAC GPA. If your LSAC GPA is 2.7, it does not matter whether your school or major GPA, printed on your transcript, is 3.0. Fair or not, law school admissions committees won't care about the 3.0 on your transcript. For law school admissions purposes, your GPA is 2.7.

Harvard
Columbia
UChicago
NYU
UPenn
UCLA
USC

3.0 GPA AA Male

Didn't you already say in a previous thread that you have a 175/177? Either of those would be plenty.

Anything in the 170s makes you an in-demand applicant for most of these schools. Harvard and, to a lesser extent, CCN might be tough with your GPA regardless.

You should definitely apply to the entire T14 if your numbers in in the ballpark, btw. The schools ranked 8-13 are probably going to be your sweet spot as a splitter.

I mean the GPA and LSAT kind of bounce around each time he asks this question.

OP, I get that you're trying to cover all your bases, but no one can really give you advice until you have an actual firm GPA and LSAT. If you don't have either of those things yet, just wait till you do. As for what LSAT you need, you need to aim for 180. You probably won't get a 180 (very very few people do), but there's no point in studying "just enough" to get a 170/173/175/whatever - that's not really how the exam works. Study, do practice exams, see where your scores fall, then maybe come back and ask whether you should take the exam yet, but really, just study and take the test and get a score and then ask for advice.

It's worth noting that this is your third post about your chances, each with different stats. In February, you said you had a 2.7 and a 175. In March, you said you had a 3.0 and 177. I asked in response to your March post when and how your stats improved, and despite being called out by mods, you didn't answer. Your new post implies that you don't have an LSAT score yet, or at least that you're considering retaking without giving a baseline score.

Let's assume you haven't miscalculated or misrepresented your credentials in this post and that your LSAC GPA is 3.0. If that's the case, Harvard would be at best unpredictable and at worst a long shot with any LSAT score, but your chances increase as your score does. Chicago and UPenn tend to be picky about GPA, and they may bend their standards on grades for a URM with a 177+ LSAT score, but I'd say your chances at those schools is not awesome either. USC tends to be grades-picky also, but it's lower-ranked and has a lower GPA "floor" than Chicago and Penn. You may get in with an upper 170s LSAT.

Assuming your LSAT score is excellent, say in the 175-177+ range, you will have an unpredictable cycle because (1) you're a splitter, with one of the widest margins these schools will see, and (2) you're a URM. It's likely that, if you apply to as many schools as you can, you'll get some good offers. I'd bet that about a third of the T13 and about half of the T20 will let you in, probably with some scholarship offers mixed in among them. I still think Yale, Stanford, and Harvard are out of reach or an unpredictable long shot, even with that high of a score. Chicago, Penn, and UVA are also long shots/unpredictable because they tend to care about GPA. I would say your cycle will be worse, but not much worse and even more unpredictable, if your LSAT score is in the 170-174 range. The only change there is that I'd say Harvard is almost certainly not happening.

Let's say your LSAT score is somewhere below 170, but above 165. You should still blanket the T20 (and consider retaking the LSAT), but your cycle will probably be a bit more disappointing. I wouldn't take all of these schools off the table, but your long-shot chances get longer as your LSAT score drops.

QContinuum wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:32 pm

cavalier1138 wrote:OP: I merged this with your prior topic because it's exactly the same question.

As was already stated here, no one can give you precise percentage chances at each of these schools. You've already gotten some specific advice (and some questions that you didn't respond to regarding your numbers changing dramatically between February and March). I strongly suggest following up on the advice you've been given instead of repeatedly asking for something that people can't provide.

To add on to my fellow moderator's post above: I also merged in your first topic, when you claimed your GPA was 2.7, because that is again basically the same question.

It isn't helpful to ask hypothetical questions. If your GPA's a 2.7, it doesn't make sense to ask people what your chances are with a 3.0. You don't have a 3.0.

I also note your other thread, http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 2&t=304847, asking why LSAC GPA is "always" lower than school GPA. (It's not always lower; LSAC GPA can actually be higher than school GPA, as several posters noted in that thread.) In any case, law schools ONLY care about LSAC GPA. If your LSAC GPA is 2.7, it does not matter whether your school or major GPA, printed on your transcript, is 3.0. Fair or not, law school admissions committees won't care about the 3.0 on your transcript. For law school admissions purposes, your GPA is 2.7.

I've again merged this into OP's previous threads. OP, please stop creating these duplicative threads. We are happy to help but please be honest. Telling people you have a 2.7/175, then changing that to 3.0/177, and now changing that to 3.0 and no LSAT score, 1) wastes other TLS posters' time, and 2) isn't even helpful to you, because any advice given in response to a 3.0/177 isn't going to apply to you if you don't have a 3.0 or a 177.