Australian Law Schools Forum

[BeautifulSW]

They still wear wigs down under, I believe. Wigs and gowns. Don't know if I could get used to that...

[zainlundell]

yeah but I have a feeling that if you specialise in International law you have Europe (the EU), Hongkong and Middle East (which pay the highest law salaries in the world) in the palm of your hands. (assuming you get into the Oxford or NYU masters)

[EdwardS]

just got my acceptance to Uni Melbourne

Awesome.

I got accepted too.

Are you already in Melbourne or where are you coming from?

[stonemac]

Congrats, I'm currently a 1st yr JD student at Melbourne.

RE LSAT: It is considered, but is far less important than your grades/relevant work experience. I got in with a 158.

RE Salaries in Aus: See http://www.mahlab.com.au Highest salary for a first year lawyer is $A 85 000. This is at a top-tier firm in Sydney, which has higher rates than Melbourne. Average salary at a top-tier in Melbourne is approx $75 000. By fifth year, this goes up to approx $150 000. However, salaries at mid-tier firms will be much less.

RE Oxford/NYU: Good luck, a lot of students are interested in these programs. There are 2 hurdles:

1) GRADES: For Oxford, you need at least a 77 average, but preferably 80+. NYU might be a little less.
2) $$$: Oxford £15 000; NYU $US 45 000 + cost of living in New York for a year.

[descartesb4thehorse]

.

[mottainai]

Don't know if this thread is still relevant, but I've been considering law school down under so I'd love some thoughts.

I've looked at the Bar Exam Qualifications (--LinkRemoved--), and it does seem like a major hurdle to take an Australian degree back to the States without an LLM or work experience in the country that granted the degree. However, and I know no one here probably has any practical knowledge about it, but I was wondering what the success rate of Americans getting jobs as first year lawyers in Australia is. If I went, I'd want to go to ANU (in Canberra), which has an unbelievably low unemployment rate, which is amazing for the country's capital. Of course I want to specialize in International Law, and there are definitely programs in the US which grant you an LLM dual degree (NYU, Columbia, Harvard, and American are 4 I know for sure do this), which seems on the surface to be a safer route than traveling down under and wasting $28k (AUD) per year on a degree which is useless in the US without either more schooling or work. I tried to get a job in London after graduating undergrad, so I know the stigmas against hiring Americans for a job in foreign countries. Typically, in order to provide you a work visa, you have to be able to prove that the job isn't able to be adequately filled by a citizen. Tough to prove for someone who is applying for an entry-level position. Is it any easier coming off a degree in the country, though? I'd love to work for the Australian government or in US relations with an Australian company, but I can't imagine, even with the great Australian economy, that those sorts of jobs are easy to find.

For context, I scored well on my LSATs (171), got a not-terrible, not-great GPA at a top 10 undergrad school in the US, and I'm from a state that is generally underrepresented in academia. I've been accepted to American, waitlisted at Georgetown, and awaiting word on the others. I expect very generous packages from some Tier 4 schools that have already accepted me, but I'm well aware of the stigmas on such schools, and can't imagine getting a degree from a foreign institution would prove worse in the long run for me. However, it would be more expensive. To be honest, I've been trying to spend some time away from America, and this seems ideal, although if it will be hugely detrimental to my future (i.e. if I can't find a job in Australia after I graduate), it's not worth it and I'll hope to get into a joint degree program at whichever American law school I end up attending. My main problem is that I missed the deadline for Melbourne, which would actually be an ideal situation. I could go, test out the waters, and then retry entry at NYU with further qualifications, as those two schools have a joint degree partnership.

Anyways, decision time is quickly approaching, and I feel like I'm flailing with my decision-making here, so any help (especially from someone who has made this transition!) would be incredibly helpful.

I'm also curious about this. Stats are roughly the same (assuming your GPA is around the 3.5ish range).

[fatduck]

do australian barristers wear powdered wigs?

[descartesb4thehorse]

.

[Fred_McGriff]

You call that a tort?

[descartesb4thehorse]

You call that a tort?

That's not a tort. This is a tort. (Craziest eyes)

[mottainai]

Don't know if this thread is still relevant, but I've been considering law school down under so I'd love some thoughts.

I've looked at the Bar Exam Qualifications (--LinkRemoved--), and it does seem like a major hurdle to take an Australian degree back to the States without an LLM or work experience in the country that granted the degree. However, and I know no one here probably has any practical knowledge about it, but I was wondering what the success rate of Americans getting jobs as first year lawyers in Australia is. If I went, I'd want to go to ANU (in Canberra), which has an unbelievably low unemployment rate, which is amazing for the country's capital. Of course I want to specialize in International Law, and there are definitely programs in the US which grant you an LLM dual degree (NYU, Columbia, Harvard, and American are 4 I know for sure do this), which seems on the surface to be a safer route than traveling down under and wasting $28k (AUD) per year on a degree which is useless in the US without either more schooling or work. I tried to get a job in London after graduating undergrad, so I know the stigmas against hiring Americans for a job in foreign countries. Typically, in order to provide you a work visa, you have to be able to prove that the job isn't able to be adequately filled by a citizen. Tough to prove for someone who is applying for an entry-level position. Is it any easier coming off a degree in the country, though? I'd love to work for the Australian government or in US relations with an Australian company, but I can't imagine, even with the great Australian economy, that those sorts of jobs are easy to find.

For context, I scored well on my LSATs (171), got a not-terrible, not-great GPA at a top 10 undergrad school in the US, and I'm from a state that is generally underrepresented in academia. I've been accepted to American, waitlisted at Georgetown, and awaiting word on the others. I expect very generous packages from some Tier 4 schools that have already accepted me, but I'm well aware of the stigmas on such schools, and can't imagine getting a degree from a foreign institution would prove worse in the long run for me. However, it would be more expensive. To be honest, I've been trying to spend some time away from America, and this seems ideal, although if it will be hugely detrimental to my future (i.e. if I can't find a job in Australia after I graduate), it's not worth it and I'll hope to get into a joint degree program at whichever American law school I end up attending. My main problem is that I missed the deadline for Melbourne, which would actually be an ideal situation. I could go, test out the waters, and then retry entry at NYU with further qualifications, as those two schools have a joint degree partnership.

Anyways, decision time is quickly approaching, and I feel like I'm flailing with my decision-making here, so any help (especially from someone who has made this transition!) would be incredibly helpful.

I'm also curious about this. Stats are roughly the same (assuming your GPA is around the 3.5ish range).

Around that. 3.43 with honors.

Which school were you thinking about? It would be so lovely to disappear to the other side of the world for 5-10 years.

I won't be applying until next cycle, but if I do apply to an Australian university, I'd probably choose Melbourne because of the ABA accreditation. My biggest worry is degree portability, if things don't work out.

[ArthurDigbySellers]

Wallaby Law
--ImageRemoved--

[legaleagle9]

Hey guys. Curious about this topic: What is the average gpa and LSAT for people accepted to the University of Melbourne Law JD program? Thanks!

[descartesb4thehorse]

Hey guys. Curious about this topic: What is the average gpa and LSAT for people accepted to the University of Melbourne Law JD program? Thanks!

it's unpublished. i think a 160 or so would be pretty safe, depending on how you did as an undergrad.

[legaleagle9]

160? thats interesting considering the fact that Uni of Melbourne is ranked the 9th best law school in the world

[descartesb4thehorse]

As I wrote in that PM and will now repeat myself saying here....

You have a lot of things at play w/r/t "world rankings" and why you think Melbourne's LSAT median isn't up to snuff. Legal systems are different all over the world. Very few law schools actually offer a JD. For instance, you couldn't go to Oxbridge and get a JD - either the LLB (Bachelors) or LLM (which you would need previous law studies to be accepted). That alone accounts for a bit of silliness in world rankings. Are you ranking a JD program at Yale against an LLB at Oxford against an LLM at Melbourne? It's just not standardized enough to work.

Then there's the fact that no other Oz law school takes the LSAT. Think of it this way: you want to apply to the t14 in the US, but only Stanford requires a standardized test, that is primarily for schools in say, Australia. So that's going to devalue the standardized test, in a way. Only US students applying to Stanford or foreign law schools would take it. Because Stanford is only doing that so that students can have accreditation in the US and Oz. You won't have easy access to the hundreds of test companies and books to help you study, students will typically only study for it for a short period of time, and the competition won't be as tough. The acceptance requirements will not (and basically can not) be as rigorous as if it were a test that every school in that country requires.

I'm just basing this as a guess. When I was researching law schools in Oz, it seemed like a bunch of people who scored high 150s were getting Melbourne acceptances. Outside link - that may be helpful as a starting point. Someone there said you have to have a 150+ to be competitive, which is the vibe I got.

BTW, It's not typically hard to get into law schools in Australia. I barely did any application work and got into ANU and UNSW with a pretty meh GPA in a subject not even passably related to law. On the flip side, you can't make biglaw salary. So, take that for whatever it's worth.