Top Law Schools

Splitter 3.25 GPA with a 174 LSAT. I played around with my numbers on MyLSN and I'm loving the percentages for the applicants that have ED'd at some of the lower t14 schools. I looked into NU ed option as it offers 50k/year which is very nice but I would love it if I can get into my dream school, UPenn. I didn't see much scholarship information for ED applicants at UPenn with my numbers...Im not trying to accumulate a large amount of debt post law.

Softs:
-D1 Athlete - Competed in professional events
-Intern with J.P Morgan, Large Venture Capitalist firm, Local judge
-Unique reason for low GPA
-joined multiple cultural clubs at school
-Helped create the athletic-entrepreneurship club at university
-vol. work

Northwestern is the only T14 ED that's worth it.

How are you paying for law school? Penn at sticker is over $300,000 and you're gonna pay sticker if you ED and get in.

Mullens wrote:Northwestern is the only T14 ED that's worth it.

How are you paying for law school? Penn at sticker is over $300,000 and you're gonna pay sticker if you ED and get in.

Parents and Grandparents will be helping out even though I hate owing people money. I really hope i'll be eligible for some merit scholarships and need based grants if I decide to pay for it.

illsueyou wrote:

Mullens wrote:Northwestern is the only T14 ED that's worth it.

How are you paying for law school? Penn at sticker is over $300,000 and you're gonna pay sticker if you ED and get in.

Parents and Grandparents will be helping out even though I hate owing people money. I really hope i'll be eligible for some merit scholarships and need based grants if I decide to pay for it.

Still not worth it unless they have "fuck you money" and would also be fine throwing away that money when you can go to a peer school for cheaper.

And again, schools don't give scholarships to students that are accepted ED because you have no leverage so the schools have no incentive to give you money. As much as law schools try to pretend otherwise, all aid outside of HYS is merit and not need-based.

Don't ED Penn, or anywhere that's not NU.

Mullens wrote:

illsueyou wrote:

Mullens wrote:Northwestern is the only T14 ED that's worth it.

How are you paying for law school? Penn at sticker is over $300,000 and you're gonna pay sticker if you ED and get in.

Parents and Grandparents will be helping out even though I hate owing people money. I really hope i'll be eligible for some merit scholarships and need based grants if I decide to pay for it.

Still not worth it unless they have "fuck you money" and would also be fine throwing away that money when you can go to a peer school for cheaper.

And again, schools don't give scholarships to students that are accepted ED because you have no leverage so the schools have no incentive to give you money. As much as law schools try to pretend otherwise, all aid outside of HYS is merit and not need-based.

What would be a good peer school if i'm trying to work NYC/Chicago biglaw? I hope WashU will throw some $ for me to leverage with.

existentialcrisis wrote:Don't ED Penn, or anywhere that's not NU.

Why not? Does it not increase chances at a Columbia/Penn/NYU?

corporatemandaorbust wrote:

existentialcrisis wrote:Don't ED Penn, or anywhere that's not NU.

Why not? Does it not increase chances at a Columbia/Penn/NYU?

because you'd have to pay 300K+

corporatemandaorbust wrote:

existentialcrisis wrote:Don't ED Penn, or anywhere that's not NU.

Why not? Does it not increase chances at a Columbia/Penn/NYU?

It might, but it also essentially guarantees paying sticker.

Strongly consider applying ED to NU, but nowhere else. There's still a sizeable chance you won't get the 150k from NU, but that's likely the most you could get in the t13 so might as well take a crack at it.

illsueyou wrote:-Unique reason for low GPA

In addition to what's already been said (don't ED anywhere that doesn't offer guaranteed money with acceptance), I highly doubt that this is true. If you had a medical reason for a low GPA, then that's something to write an addendum for, but I have yet to hear a truly "unique" story for why someone didn't do so well in college. And if it's not a medical reason (hell, even if it is), I wouldn't count on it having much of an effect.

Just to give a counter point ... I got into NYU ED and was given a substantial merit scholarship (which I was not expecting, especially considering what I had been told about ED). NYU told me that they do not consider whether an applicant is ED or not when making scholarship decisions (and I imagine this is also the case elsewhere, would be worth asking). This is not to say that applying ED is a good idea (it is probably not for most people). Because I was a splitter and had to stay in the tri state area (few options, basically nyu or Columbia) I figured it was a good option for me, though that is not necessarily true, maybe I got lucky. My main point is that the idea that ED admits have no chance at money is a little overplayed (though obviously you can't negotiate ... in my case, it is unlikely I would have had any leverage to negotiate even if I had not applied ED). But, again, not suggesting that ED is a great option or that you will end up in the best money situation. There are clear downsides.

cavalier1138 wrote:

illsueyou wrote:-Unique reason for low GPA

In addition to what's already been said (don't ED anywhere that doesn't offer guaranteed money with acceptance), I highly doubt that this is true. If you had a medical reason for a low GPA, then that's something to write an addendum for, but I have yet to hear a truly "unique" story for why someone didn't do so well in college. And if it's not a medical reason (hell, even if it is), I wouldn't count on it having much of an effect.

He said he was a D1 athlete. While I am not one myself, my cousin is a D1 fencer at one of the top programs in the country, at a school he is overqualified for in terms of intelligence, and even he struggles to get all his work done and study at the same level a nerd like me does. And what he does is nothing compared to what football/basketball/hockey players do.

How much does it really hurt you? No one can say for sure, but I'd say it's worth probably roughly a .2-.25 bump.

mwells56 wrote:He said he was a D1 athlete. While I am not one myself, my cousin is a D1 fencer at one of the top programs in the country, at a school he is overqualified for in terms of intelligence, and even he struggles to get all his work done and study at the same level a nerd like me does. And what he does is nothing compared to what football/basketball/hockey players do.

How much does it really hurt you? No one can say for sure, but I'd say it's worth probably roughly a .2-.25 bump.

If that's the "unique" reason for the low GPA, I'm sure it's worth an addendum, but I don't think anyone knows how much of a bump it provides. I think a .25 GPA bump is highly optimistic, especially considering the scandals involving the grades of D1 athletes (in popular sports, so not sure if it applies to the OP).

cavalier1138 wrote:

mwells56 wrote:He said he was a D1 athlete. While I am not one myself, my cousin is a D1 fencer at one of the top programs in the country, at a school he is overqualified for in terms of intelligence, and even he struggles to get all his work done and study at the same level a nerd like me does. And what he does is nothing compared to what football/basketball/hockey players do.

How much does it really hurt you? No one can say for sure, but I'd say it's worth probably roughly a .2-.25 bump.

If that's the "unique" reason for the low GPA, I'm sure it's worth an addendum, but I don't think anyone knows how much of a bump it provides. I think a .25 GPA bump is highly optimistic, especially considering the scandals involving the grades of D1 athletes (in popular sports, so not sure if it applies to the OP).

Yeah I just pulled that number out because my cousin has ~3.5 and he's a smart kid at a good but not great school so he should probably have closer to a 3.7. But I'd still say that whatever the bump is worth, it's worth SOMETHING, you know?

cavalier1138 wrote:

mwells56 wrote:He said he was a D1 athlete. While I am not one myself, my cousin is a D1 fencer at one of the top programs in the country, at a school he is overqualified for in terms of intelligence, and even he struggles to get all his work done and study at the same level a nerd like me does. And what he does is nothing compared to what football/basketball/hockey players do.

How much does it really hurt you? No one can say for sure, but I'd say it's worth probably roughly a .2-.25 bump.

If that's the "unique" reason for the low GPA, I'm sure it's worth an addendum, but I don't think anyone knows how much of a bump it provides. I think a .25 GPA bump is highly optimistic, especially considering the scandals involving the grades of D1 athletes (in popular sports, so not sure if it applies to the OP).

Yeah, I know multiple D1 major sport athletes that finished above their means thanks to being part of an athletic team

[Some] D1 athletes also have access to tutors, priority registration, and other academic resources. I think a .25 bump is way overstating it.

And speaking of overstating, ED = sticker may be overstating it but you don't just lose leverage, you miss out on opportunities for money that are independent of bargaining. Tons of people every cycle end up with unpredictable scholly results. Some schools are more generous than others, and some schools are more amenable to high LSATs than others. It just doesn't seem wise to close those doors.

On top of all that, a 174 LSAT is an increasingly valuable bargaining chip. Campos just posted this: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... hilit=LSAT

The balancing test for ED is weighing an increased chance at admissions and $. I think a lot on this board will say that with a 3.25/174, you have a good chance at the T13. Maybe not Penn specifically but you pass the threshold of be admitted somewhere, so the overriding concern at this point is defraying cost.

And just bc ppl will want to know: why Penn? Legacy? Family? Significant Other?

pancakes3 wrote:[Some] D1 athletes also have access to tutors, priority registration, and other academic resources. I think a .25 bump is way overstating it.

And speaking of overstating, ED = sticker may be overstating it but you don't just lose leverage, you miss out on opportunities for money that are independent of bargaining. Tons of people every cycle end up with unpredictable scholly results. Some schools are more generous than others, and some schools are more amenable to high LSATs than others. It just doesn't seem wise to close those doors.

On top of all that, a 174 LSAT is an increasingly valuable bargaining chip. Campos just posted this: http://top-law-schools.com/forums/viewt ... hilit=LSAT

The balancing test for ED is weighing an increased chance at admissions and $. I think a lot on this board will say that with a 3.25/174, you have a good chance at the T13. Maybe not Penn specifically but you pass the threshold of be admitted somewhere, so the overriding concern at this point is defraying cost.

And just bc ppl will want to know: why Penn? Legacy? Family? Significant Other?

Legacy for the main reason. My father owns his own company and works with many UPenn law and MBA graduates who are extremely successful.

cavalier1138 wrote:

mwells56 wrote:He said he was a D1 athlete. While I am not one myself, my cousin is a D1 fencer at one of the top programs in the country, at a school he is overqualified for in terms of intelligence, and even he struggles to get all his work done and study at the same level a nerd like me does. And what he does is nothing compared to what football/basketball/hockey players do.

How much does it really hurt you? No one can say for sure, but I'd say it's worth probably roughly a .2-.25 bump.

If that's the "unique" reason for the low GPA, I'm sure it's worth an addendum, but I don't think anyone knows how much of a bump it provides. I think a .25 GPA bump is highly optimistic, especially considering the scandals involving the grades of D1 athletes (in popular sports, so not sure if it applies to the OP).

My freshman year I had solid grades but was involved in a season ending injury that took a heavy toll on me mentally. Doing something like my sport everyday for 6 hours a day becomes so apart of my life that when it was taken away by an injury, my grades began to slip shortly following.

illsueyou wrote:My freshman year I had solid grades but was involved in a season ending injury that took a heavy toll on me mentally. Doing something like my sport everyday for 6 hours a day becomes so apart of my life that when it was taken away by an injury, my grades began to slip shortly following.

I'm actually not sure how much an addendum would help here. It would be good to explain (what I assume is) a weird dip in grades, but I don't think you're going to get any boosts from that.

illsueyou wrote:Splitter 3.25 GPA with a 174 LSAT. I played around with my numbers on MyLSN and I'm loving the percentages for the applicants that have ED'd at some of the lower t14 schools. I looked into NU ed option as it offers 50k/year which is very nice but I would love it if I can get into my dream school, UPenn. I didn't see much scholarship information for ED applicants at UPenn with my numbers...Im not trying to accumulate a large amount of debt post law.

Softs:
-D1 Athlete - Competed in professional events
-Intern with J.P Morgan, Large Venture Capitalist firm, Local judge
-Unique reason for low GPA
-joined multiple cultural clubs at school
-Helped create the athletic-entrepreneurship club at university
-vol. work

http://admissionsbythenumbers.blogspot. ... el-in.html

That link takes you to a solid analysis that includes the statistical benefits of applying ED to Penn as a splitter: they are determined to be statistically zero. Therefore, save your ED for another school?