Top Law Schools

Title pretty much says it all. I'm on the waitlist at Duke and Nwestern. I am a 2.8-173 splitter.

I know people say WUSTL is better than Fordham for basically everywhere except NYC (and arguably the NE in general). Career goals...I'd like to eventually get into criminal law, but I'd like some money early to help pay down loans. Also, I'd like to take a few years to really hone my skill as a lawyer before settling into the legally-repetitive defense/ prosecution position. So, ideally big law out of school, but who knows? I'm not opposed to living in NYC, in fact I think it'd be cool, but also not 100% on it.

My current thinking is WUSTL, and if either Duke or Nwestern takes me then just go there. I know the risk of paying sticker, but hey you can't win if you don't play right?

sandrews wrote:Title pretty much says it all. I'm on the waitlist at Duke and Nwestern. I am a 2.8-173 splitter.

I know people say WUSTL is better than Fordham for basically everywhere except NYC (and arguably the NE in general). Career goals...I'd like to eventually get into criminal law, but I'd like some money early to help pay down loans. Also, I'd like to take a few years to really hone my skill as a lawyer before settling into the legally-repetitive defense/ prosecution position. So, ideally big law out of school, but who knows? I'm not opposed to living in NYC, in fact I think it'd be cool, but also not 100% on it.

My current thinking is WUSTL, and if either Duke or Nwestern takes me then just go there. I know the risk of paying sticker, but hey you can't win if you don't play right?

I would negotiate with WUSTL for a full ride. I would think that with your 173 you would be competitive, even with your low GPA. Let them know about your offer from Fordham and that you would really like to come to WUSTL but finances and blah blah blah, and they might up their offer. I don't think 90K is enough to justify WUSTL, but with $112K or a full ride then I think it's a good value.

Northwestern or Duke at sticker is a horrible idea, as you would be $300K in debt at graduation.

Fordham at $130K is also probably a bad idea given the high cost of living in NYC and Fordham's mediocre employment prospects.

So as it stands, I guess I would choose WUSTL with low STL cost of living, but gun for a higher scholarship.

Yeah you should be able to get more money out of WUSTL. Given NYC's CoL, I'd say the CoA between the two schools currently is about equal. A little more money from WUSTL and it'd be an EASY D.

So just to be clear -- 100% no to NW and Duke? If I'm accepted I know I (probably) won't get a scholarship. I appreciate that 250-300k is a nice chunk of money -- but considering the lifetime investment, wouldn't it be worth it?

sandrews wrote:So just to be clear -- 100% no to NW and Duke? If I'm accepted I know I (probably) won't get a scholarship. I appreciate that 250-300k is a nice chunk of money -- but considering the lifetime investment, wouldn't it be worth it?

Not when you want to go into criminal law. Btw, how do you imagine this career path working exactly? Are you thinking Biglaw to pay down your $275k debt from Northwestern, then transition to a PD/DA job? Or are you thinking you want to transition to be an AUSA?

Most criminal law work will be low paid, and the skills you learn in Biglaw mostly won't be helpful in doing criminal trial work.

You may have a defined career path in mind, but without more details, it's a bit convoluted to me and doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

all bad options. your GPA is always going to cause you trouble, but I have to think there was something else wrong with you application if a 173 is only getting 90k from wustl. What do you think was wrong with your app?

Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

sandrews wrote:Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

I'm graduating from WUSTL after entering with essentially the same stats as yours and know many people with similar stats and I can tell you flat out that you should be getting more from WUSTL. 70-100 is probably the range you should expect pre-negotiation, but WUSTL is super easy to negotiate with and you're just throwing away tens of thousands of dollars if you don't even try.

njdevils2626 wrote:

sandrews wrote:Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

I'm graduating from WUSTL after entering with essentially the same stats as yours and know many people with similar stats and I can tell you flat out that you should be getting more from WUSTL. 70-100 is probably the range you should expect pre-negotiation, but WUSTL is super easy to negotiate with and you're just throwing away tens of thousands of dollars if you don't even try.

Yeah. You have nothing to lose OP and a lot to gain by taking a few minutes to write an email. Worst case they say no and delete your email, best case you go to law school for free. They will want your 173.

acr wrote:

njdevils2626 wrote:

sandrews wrote:Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

I'm graduating from WUSTL after entering with essentially the same stats as yours and know many people with similar stats and I can tell you flat out that you should be getting more from WUSTL. 70-100 is probably the range you should expect pre-negotiation, but WUSTL is super easy to negotiate with and you're just throwing away tens of thousands of dollars if you don't even try.

Yeah. You have nothing to lose OP and a lot to gain by taking a few minutes to write an email. Worst case they say no and delete your email, best case you go to law school for free. They will want your 173.

Especially this year.

I would advise you email them for more money. For example, Cornell initially gave me $75,000 this year, after negotiation Cornell bumped it to $105,000 and then $120,000 (negotiated twice!). I am considering emailing Cornell (again) to bump it to $135,000 using Georgetown's $165,000

My stats: LSAT 162
GPA 3.97
but with very strong soft factors

youngstar2028 wrote:I would advise you email them for more money. For example, Cornell initially gave me $75,000 this year, after negotiation Cornell bumped it to $105,000 and then $120,000 (negotiated twice!). I am considering emailing Cornell (again) to bump it to $135,000 using Georgetown's $165,000

My stats: LSAT 162
GPA 3.97
but with very strong soft factors

URM? Otherwise, the fuck. Your softs must be beyond "strong." Regardless, that's amazing! Congrats!

RedPurpleBlue wrote:

youngstar2028 wrote:I would advise you email them for more money. For example, Cornell initially gave me $75,000 this year, after negotiation Cornell bumped it to $105,000 and then $120,000 (negotiated twice!). I am considering emailing Cornell (again) to bump it to $135,000 using Georgetown's $165,000

My stats: LSAT 162
GPA 3.97
but with very strong soft factors

URM? Otherwise, the fuck. Your softs must be beyond "strong." Regardless, that's amazing! Congrats!

Yes URM

njdevils2626 wrote:

sandrews wrote:Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

I'm graduating from WUSTL after entering with essentially the same stats as yours and know many people with similar stats and I can tell you flat out that you should be getting more from WUSTL. 70-100 is probably the range you should expect pre-negotiation, but WUSTL is super easy to negotiate with and you're just throwing away tens of thousands of dollars if you don't even try.

Just an update for everyone. I took said advice and was just offered $120k.

Everyone is 100% I should do Wustl over the chance of Duke or nw?

Deposit at WashU and continue pursuing the waitlists. You never know 'cause waitlists do get $$ sometimes. I'd take 60k at duke/nw over 120k at washu. But otherwise, I think 120k at WashU with ur stats as a splitter is not a bad outcome at all. Congrats!

sandrews wrote:

njdevils2626 wrote:

sandrews wrote:Not sure if I agree about the $90k being due to something other than my GPA. mylsn.info shows that 70-100 is about the range for my stats the last six cycles.

To be honest, I think it would be naive of me to say "this is my exact plan." Life always seems to guide us down the path it wants us on. With that said, yes. I was thinking Big Law to pay down debt/ become a better lawyer and writer, then transition into something else. I'm not sure what area of criminal law I want to transfer to, or if I'll even end up going that route. I appreciate that those jobs don't pay a lot, hence the big law job to pay down debt.

I'm graduating from WUSTL after entering with essentially the same stats as yours and know many people with similar stats and I can tell you flat out that you should be getting more from WUSTL. 70-100 is probably the range you should expect pre-negotiation, but WUSTL is super easy to negotiate with and you're just throwing away tens of thousands of dollars if you don't even try.

Just an update for everyone. I took said advice and was just offered $120k.

Everyone is 100% I should do Wustl over the chance of Duke or nw?

Congrats on the bump! Yes, WUSTL is better given your goals.

screwtapeletters wrote:Deposit at WashU and continue pursuing the waitlists. You never know 'cause waitlists do get $$ sometimes. I'd take 60k at duke/nw over 120k at washu. But otherwise, I think 120k at WashU with ur stats as a splitter is not a bad outcome at all. Congrats!

Only problem is there was a stipulation that I have to withdraw all my other offers by Friday.

sandrews wrote:

screwtapeletters wrote:Deposit at WashU and continue pursuing the waitlists. You never know 'cause waitlists do get $$ sometimes. I'd take 60k at duke/nw over 120k at washu. But otherwise, I think 120k at WashU with ur stats as a splitter is not a bad outcome at all. Congrats!

Only problem is there was a stipulation that I have to withdraw all my other offers by Friday.

No you can't be required to withdraw from waitlists. Only actual offers. It's some rule. Asha from Yale posted a famous blog about it.

Npret wrote:

sandrews wrote:

screwtapeletters wrote:Deposit at WashU and continue pursuing the waitlists. You never know 'cause waitlists do get $$ sometimes. I'd take 60k at duke/nw over 120k at washu. But otherwise, I think 120k at WashU with ur stats as a splitter is not a bad outcome at all. Congrats!

Only problem is there was a stipulation that I have to withdraw all my other offers by Friday.

No you can't be required to withdraw from waitlists. Only actual offers. It's some rule. Asha from Yale posted a famous blog about it.

This.

Rigo wrote:

Npret wrote:

sandrews wrote:

screwtapeletters wrote:Deposit at WashU and continue pursuing the waitlists. You never know 'cause waitlists do get $$ sometimes. I'd take 60k at duke/nw over 120k at washu. But otherwise, I think 120k at WashU with ur stats as a splitter is not a bad outcome at all. Congrats!

Only problem is there was a stipulation that I have to withdraw all my other offers by Friday.

No you can't be required to withdraw from waitlists. Only actual offers. It's some rule. Asha from Yale posted a famous blog about it.

This.

Waitlists are not offers so you are good! Ride them out.

https://law.yale.edu/admissions/jd-admi ... hool-scams

There is the link in case you can't find it. I hate mentioning references without linking them.

Thanks everyone.