Top Law Schools

I noticed the new rankings and now I have my worries.

UNC:
- in state tuition
- 15k / year scholarship

Wake:
- full tuition scholarship

Thoughts?

what's the total COA for both schools?

UNC law
advertised COA: $47,975
tuition: $23,551

Wake law
advertised COA: $66,840
tuition: $44,470

I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

What are your career goals? GPA/LSAT?

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

What are your career goals? GPA/LSAT?

Wouldn't his debt for wake just be COL?

existentialcrisis wrote:

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

What are your career goals? GPA/LSAT?

Wouldn't his debt for wake just be COL?

That's $60k of pointless debt, depending on OP's goals.

cavalier1138 wrote:

existentialcrisis wrote:

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

What are your career goals? GPA/LSAT?

Wouldn't his debt for wake just be COL?

That's $60k of pointless debt, depending on OP's goals.

I agree that there's no way to know if OP should go there without knowing their goals. I was just responding to the point about servicing debt.

Also COL in WS is dirt cheap.

cavalier1138 wrote:

existentialcrisis wrote:

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

What are your career goals? GPA/LSAT?

Wouldn't his debt for wake just be COL?

That's $60k of pointless debt, depending on OP's goals.

LOL. No, a full tuition scholarship at Wake Law, and the COL that comes with it, is not pointless. And since OP has in state tuition at UNC, he is presumably a NC resident.

NC Resident = REALLY nice options at Wake.

OP - I am a current 1L at Wake on a full tuition scholly. You are going to be just fine. Don't let these Negative Nancies get to you. I am happy to answer any questions you have, just PM me.

GPA: 3.6
LSAT: 164

As for career goals: potentially business interest M&A or other transactional type stuff. Honestly, not certain.

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

This is a little overboard.

Arculease wrote: LOL. No, a full tuition scholarship at Wake Law, and the COL that comes with it, is not pointless. And since OP has in state tuition at UNC, he is presumably a NC resident.

NC Resident = REALLY nice options at Wake.

OP - I am a current 1L at Wake on a full tuition scholly. You are going to be just fine. Don't let these Negative Nancies get to you. I am happy to answer any questions you have, just PM me.

It's a good thing you know the OP's career goals just from... I dunno... mind-melding with the initial post. Is that one of the practical lawyering skills they don't teach in the fancified law schools?

And hey, it turns out the OP is interested in things like M&A. Now where on earth do lawyers do M&A work? Is it in a small firm in Charlotte? Is it in a solo practice? Or is it in biglaw, which the OP has a 12% chance of landing from Wake?

Don't pay attention to the rankings either way. Schools in this range bounce around all the time.

That said, it looks like Wake would be ~$25K cheaper. Wake seems to make more sense unless you have wealthy family paying the difference. If I wanted to stay in NC above all else, I'd do UNC, but I don't know if I'd spend an extra $25K for it (especially if you already have NC ties, in which case the UNC advantage doesn't matter as much).

Also you can probably avoid 60K in COL debt in Winston-Salem, which is extremely cheap. If you don't do well/hate the idea of being a lawyer after 1L, you could call it quits without a life-ruining amount of debt.

But yeah, goals would be helpful. Neither school is good if you're biglaw or bust. Either option is probably fine if you want smaller firm, DA/public defender, etc.

trevorthomps wrote:GPA: 3.6
LSAT: 164

As for career goals: potentially business interest M&A or other transactional type stuff. Honestly, not certain.

Hinestly, Wfu even with a full ride, is not a good school for those goals. You should retake for T14.

trevorthomps wrote: As for career goals: potentially business interest M&A or other transactional type stuff. Honestly, not certain.

This is the only worrisome issue. You'll probably get an ok job with manageable debt from either Wake or UNC.

But what you just described is typically biglaw work. You'll need to be in the top 20ish percent of your class at either school to have a reasonable shot at biglaw. I'd think harder about what you really want to do before you jump into law school. I'm a Wake 3L so I'm not trying to trash my school and am by no means an automatic "retake" type poster, but retaking for a T14 is the safest option for your stated goals.

But again, you don't really seem sure about what you want, so at least think through your goals.

EDIT: Also, if you haven't already, try to get an idea of what biglaw M&A lawyers do. I haven't talked to many people who enjoy it.

AT9 wrote:try to get an idea of what biglaw M&A lawyers do. I haven't talked to many people who enjoy it.

Hell maybe even a biglaw M&A lawyer will weigh in on these choices.

OP- I would not go to either school if I wanted to do M&A.

Rigo wrote:

cavalier1138 wrote:I assume you've posted annual numbers. The answer is neither, because you won't be able to pay off that debt.

This is a little overboard.

50k debt for a respectable law education in a state where only 45% of people pass the bar now? yeah thats a good investment. there will be options for you.

Johann wrote: 50k debt for a respectable law education in a state where only 45% of people pass the bar now? yeah thats a good investment. there will be options for you.

What is the deal with that? Geez.

AT9 wrote:

trevorthomps wrote: As for career goals: potentially business interest M&A or other transactional type stuff. Honestly, not certain.

This is the only worrisome issue. You'll probably get an ok job with manageable debt from either Wake or UNC.

But what you just described is typically biglaw work. You'll need to be in the top 20ish percent of your class at either school to have a reasonable shot at biglaw. I'd think harder about what you really want to do before you jump into law school. I'm a Wake 3L so I'm not trying to trash my school and am by no means an automatic "retake" type poster, but retaking for a T14 is the safest option for your stated goals.

But again, you don't really seem sure about what you want, so at least think through your goals.

EDIT: Also, if you haven't already, try to get an idea of what biglaw M&A lawyers do. I haven't talked to many people who enjoy it.

probably not getting biglaw M&A. but there are other transactional practices that exist. make sure you're okay with non-M&A/non-biglaw options.

Rigo wrote:

Johann wrote: 50k debt for a respectable law education in a state where only 45% of people pass the bar now? yeah thats a good investment. there will be options for you.

What is the deal with that? Geez.

I've heard they're trying to make the NC bar more difficult, probably because there are probably 3 too many law schools in this state. Maybe the Feb. exam has a disproportionate number of Elon/Charlotte/NC Central takers?

Wake for about 50k is a pretty great option for a NC resident. Biglaw is not likely though so if you are Biglaw or bust re-take.

BigZuck wrote:

AT9 wrote:try to get an idea of what biglaw M&A lawyers do. I haven't talked to many people who enjoy it.

Hell maybe even a biglaw M&A lawyer will weigh in on these choices.

OP- I would not go to either school if I wanted to do M&A.

Biglaw transactional (not M&A) lawyer who went to one of these schools here. Neither will give you a strong shot at a biglaw job. UNC seems to place a lot more in biglaw firms from what I've seen though (I think they benefit by biglaw firms dropping by for OCI while passing through for Duke OCI). I'd retake if serious about M&A. Also, you might what to look into what biglaw transactional practices entail, it's usually not as glamorous as prospective law students think.

If you aren't serious about M&A and would be fine working for a smaller firm or in public interest, then Wake and UNC are both great options, especially if you are looking to stay in NC. I'd lean towards Wake if you are okay with small law and a lower shot at biglaw because Winston is dirt cheap and the full tuition scholarship.