Top Law Schools

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

theconsigliere wrote:

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

just meant I agree that I personally would go to Chicago, mostly because I'm pretty sure I wouldn't like NYU. fwiw I agree that there's no reason to think Chi > NYU for elite NYC firms

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

Redfactor wrote:

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

This is why this site has gone downhill.

The site overwhelmingly parrots only basic, bumper-sticker analysis, but when someone even proposes an alternative view, posters like this attempt to dominate the discourse rather than make legitimate contributions. There is room for reasonable minds to disagree on the matter; no need to be a d-bag.

OP:
There is simply not enough evidence to conclusively state which school has the advantage, but what's available does suggest that UChi has the upper hand, unless something has changed in the last couple years.

This is not a knock on Columbia or NYU, and it's not arguing that Chicago is a superior law school or anything. I am simply saying that there is a valid, reasoned argument that UChi students have an edge over Columbia or NYU students for elite NY firms, and that I personally subscribe to this view.

Firms want diverse classes with representation from UChi. They want a presence on UChi's campus with hired 3Ls the same as they want to have a presence at Columbia and NYU. The difference is that UChi has a small class size and the majority of UChi students do not want to work in NYC. Only around ~20% of UChi grads work in NY (presumably even fewer in NY biglaw). That's only 30-40 total students available for all of the NY firms.

Columbia and NYU each pump out 300+ students into NY, likely 200+ into NY biglaw.

And with most firms' hiring practices, students are competing against peers for jobs, not students from other law schools. So when it comes to hiring, Columbia grads are not competing against NYU grads or UChi grads. They're competing against other Columbia students for a "Columbia" slot in the class. Same is true at NYU and UChi.

So, a NY V5 firm wants to take 12 Columbia students, 12 NYU students and 6 UChi students. Columbia and NYU each have 200 students jockeying for one of these 12 spots. Meanwhile at UChi, there are 40 (and that's generous) competing for 6 slots. It's a better position to be in.

Also, take into account that there are simply not enough UChi grads to go around for NY. So a UChi student who would be the only UChi student Firm X could get that year might be more desirable than adding a 7th Columbia/NYU student to the class, despite inferior credentials. It's for this reason that V5 firms have tended to dip lower into UChi classes (bottom 1/3) than at Columbia or NYU (generally top 1/3 to 1/2).

--------

This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

--------

Now, while I think there is an advantage to going to UChi over Columbia or NYU if one wants NY biglaw, I don't think it's worth the hassle if you don't like the school or you'd prefer to live in one city over the other. For that reason, I stand by my original position that she should 1) not go to CLS (because of the debt), and 2) choose between UChi and NYU based on where she would like to spend the next three years of her life and which school she likes more.

Nebby wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

This is why this site has gone downhill.

The site overwhelmingly parrots only basic, bumper-sticker analysis, but when someone even proposes an alternative view, posters like this attempt to dominate the discourse rather than make legitimate contributions. There is room for reasonable minds to disagree on the matter; no need to be a d-bag.

OP:
There is simply not enough evidence to conclusively state which school has the advantage, but what's available does suggest that UChi has the upper hand, unless something has changed in the last couple years.

This is not a knock on Columbia or NYU, and it's not arguing that Chicago is a superior law school or anything. I am simply saying that there is a valid, reasoned argument that UChi students have an edge over Columbia or NYU students for elite NY firms, and that I personally subscribe to this view.

Firms want diverse classes with representation from UChi. They want a presence on UChi's campus with hired 3Ls the same as they want to have a presence at Columbia and NYU. The difference is that UChi has a small class size and the majority of UChi students do not want to work in NYC. Only around ~20% of UChi grads work in NY (presumably even fewer in NY biglaw). That's only 30-40 total students available for all of the NY firms.

Columbia and NYU each pump out 300+ students into NY, likely 200+ into NY biglaw.

And with most firms' hiring practices, students are competing against peers for jobs, not students from other law schools. So when it comes to hiring, Columbia grads are not competing against NYU grads or UChi grads. They're competing against other Columbia students for a "Columbia" slot in the class. Same is true at NYU and UChi.

So, a NY V5 firm wants to take 12 Columbia students, 12 NYU students and 6 UChi students. Columbia and NYU each have 200 students jockeying for one of these 12 spots. Meanwhile at UChi, there are 40 (and that's generous) competing for 6 slots. It's a better position to be in.

Also, take into account that there are simply not enough UChi grads to go around for NY. So a UChi student who would be the only UChi student Firm X could get that year might be more desirable than adding a 7th Columbia/NYU student to the class, despite inferior credentials. It's for this reason that V5 firms have tended to dip lower into UChi classes (bottom 1/3) than at Columbia or NYU (generally top 1/3 to 1/2).

--------

This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

--------

Now, while I think there is an advantage to going to UChi over Columbia or NYU if one wants NY biglaw, I don't think it's worth the hassle if you don't like the school or you'd prefer to live in one city over the other. For that reason, I stand by my original position that she should 1) not go to CLS (because of the debt), and 2) choose between UChi and NYU based on where she would like to spend the next three years of her life and which school she likes more.

Yes. Please take advice from this 0L

Redfactor wrote:
There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU.

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

Redfactor wrote: This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

anyriotgirl wrote:

Redfactor wrote: This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

while you don't need to go to the same school as the hiring partner, it certainly seems to help, and I know more than one person with meh grades who managed to network their way into big law jobs they probably wouldn't have gotten from an OCI screener alone

Redfactor wrote:

anyriotgirl wrote:

Redfactor wrote: This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

while you don't need to go to the same school as the hiring partner, it certainly seems to help, and I know more than one person with meh grades who managed to network their way into big law jobs they probably wouldn't have gotten from an OCI screener alone

That's awesome to hear, though I think that's more an exception than the rule when it comes to OCI hiring at any of CCN
I will say, though, that being at Columbia/NYU is likely much better to hustle/network if you happen to be an unlucky one that strikes out at at OCI.

----------

While I recognize that going to UChi over Columbia/NYU for NY Biglaw is counterintuitive, it's hardly a new idea:

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... aw+chicago

I encourage people to learn about how firms approach OCI recruiting to fill their classes and how that interplays with particular schools.

----------

This thread is officially derailed. This will be my last post within it.

Feel free to PM if you want to continue insults / whatnot

Redfactor wrote:

Nebby wrote:

theconsigliere wrote:

Redfactor wrote:

Barack O'Drama wrote:Assuming she won't retake....

NYU seems to be make the most sense given the NYC big law goals.

I don't think many would argue that Columbia is worth 80K more than NYU with NYC big law goals.
And if she is gunning for NYC then I don't see any point in taking Chi over NYU...

There's a strong argument to be made that it's easier to get elite NY firms from UChi than from Columbia or NYU. If she's having second thoughts about going to UChi instead of a NY school, she shouldn't.

I think Columbia is worst of the three options due to the additional cost.

Between UChi and NYU, I think it comes down to personal preference for where she'd like to live the next three years and which school is a better "fit".

(I personally would go UChi out of the three options.)

I agree. UChi also is best for clerking which is a good experience no matter what you want to do.

I can't say for sure because I haven't visited both schools but I think you'd find that they are very different in terms of atmosphere. I would do some research on what the campus and culture is like at each school - i.e. NYU has a pretty strong PI bent and UChi is stereotypically kinda nerdy - and see which is the best fit. I'm not sure saving $20k over 3 years is worth going to a school you won't like over a school you will. But it can certainly be a thumb on the scale for NYU

Lol

Uchi has no advantage over NYU in terms of "elite" NY firms. Can you people who literally know nothing stop giving bad advice to people seeking actual information? Jfc

OP, NYU for NYC biglaw is the way to go.

This is why this site has gone downhill.

The site overwhelmingly parrots only basic, bumper-sticker analysis, but when someone even proposes an alternative view, posters like this attempt to dominate the discourse rather than make legitimate contributions. There is room for reasonable minds to disagree on the matter; no need to be a d-bag.

OP:
There is simply not enough evidence to conclusively state which school has the advantage, but what's available does suggest that UChi has the upper hand, unless something has changed in the last couple years.

This is not a knock on Columbia or NYU, and it's not arguing that Chicago is a superior law school or anything. I am simply saying that there is a valid, reasoned argument that UChi students have an edge over Columbia or NYU students for elite NY firms, and that I personally subscribe to this view.

Firms want diverse classes with representation from UChi. They want a presence on UChi's campus with hired 3Ls the same as they want to have a presence at Columbia and NYU. The difference is that UChi has a small class size and the majority of UChi students do not want to work in NYC. Only around ~20% of UChi grads work in NY (presumably even fewer in NY biglaw). That's only 30-40 total students available for all of the NY firms.

Columbia and NYU each pump out 300+ students into NY, likely 200+ into NY biglaw.

And with most firms' hiring practices, students are competing against peers for jobs, not students from other law schools. So when it comes to hiring, Columbia grads are not competing against NYU grads or UChi grads. They're competing against other Columbia students for a "Columbia" slot in the class. Same is true at NYU and UChi.

So, a NY V5 firm wants to take 12 Columbia students, 12 NYU students and 6 UChi students. Columbia and NYU each have 200 students jockeying for one of these 12 spots. Meanwhile at UChi, there are 40 (and that's generous) competing for 6 slots. It's a better position to be in.

Also, take into account that there are simply not enough UChi grads to go around for NY. So a UChi student who would be the only UChi student Firm X could get that year might be more desirable than adding a 7th Columbia/NYU student to the class, despite inferior credentials. It's for this reason that V5 firms have tended to dip lower into UChi classes (bottom 1/3) than at Columbia or NYU (generally top 1/3 to 1/2).

--------

This isn't the show Suits. You don't need to go to the same law school as the hiring partner. And these are also not the type of jobs that you can simply network your way into during a cocktail event, so there's no need to go to the local school. And finally, the strength of the alumni/ae network or Columbia or NYU isn't going get you a shot over a UChi student because when these firms go to OCI at UChi, they go with the intent to hire UChi students.

--------

Now, while I think there is an advantage to going to UChi over Columbia or NYU if one wants NY biglaw, I don't think it's worth the hassle if you don't like the school or you'd prefer to live in one city over the other. For that reason, I stand by my original position that she should 1) not go to CLS (because of the debt), and 2) choose between UChi and NYU based on where she would like to spend the next three years of her life and which school she likes more.

Nebby wrote:Uchicago also produces more potential serial killers, too.