Top Law Schools

Applying this year to these schools among others in CA. I am planning on working in LA / southern CA and am leaning towards civil/business lit.

LSAT 156 GPA 3.25
Softs: sub ivy undergrad, leadership / president of pre-law student group.
NOT retaking.

Does anyone have any valuable input on weighing the trade offs between these schools? Is UCI or Davis worth considering with my numbers / softs? OC native so I will probably live at home if admitted to Chapman or UCI.

Does anyone have any experience to share regarding financial aid with these schools given my numbers?

I am obviously okay with not pursuing biglaw so please don't consider that route.

Thanks everyone.

Why can't you retake?

Because it is not an option

Thanks for posting a list of the schools no one should ever attend.

Mal Reynolds wrote:Thanks for posting a list of the schools no one should ever attend.

Thanks for the valuable input. You know your stuff.

Hewertt wrote:

Mal Reynolds wrote:Thanks for posting a list of the schools no one should ever attend.

Thanks for the valuable input. You know your stuff.

I mean really. Your scores mean that you will be getting nothing from these schools. You will be fucked with that much debt.

Softs: sub ivy undergrad, leadership / president of pre-law student group.

I love this part.

What is a sub ivy undergrad?

Hewertt wrote:Because it is not an option

Explain why it is not an option.

If you attend any of these schools, the most likely scenario is that you will end up with massive debt and will not get a job as a lawyer.

With your numbers, you will not receive any significant scholarship $ and will be 200k+ in debt. What kind of job are you going to get to pay that out? You will be lucky to snag a 50K/year law job from any of those--seriously, that would be a GREAT outcome from one of these schools. And your odds at landing one of those are not even very good.

Everyone here is trying to help you out, honestly.

deadpanic wrote:

Hewertt wrote:Because it is not an option

Explain why it is not an option.

If you attend any of these schools, the most likely scenario is that you will end up with massive debt and will not get a job as a lawyer.

With your numbers, you will not receive any significant scholarship $ and will be 200k+ in debt. What kind of job are you going to get to pay that out? You will be lucky to snag a 50K/year law job from any of those--seriously, that would be a GREAT outcome from one of these schools. And your odds at landing one of those are not even very good.

Everyone here is trying to help you out, honestly.

I am overloading for the rest of the year, working, and am not banking on a significant jump in my score. I won't be able to take in dec or February and will not be taking a gap year. Ok I got that I won't be getting scholarship money, and will have a VERY tough time getting a job. Moving forward - any more feedback?

You should take off a year to work and study for the LSAT. No more feedback necessary.

Hewertt wrote:

deadpanic wrote:

Hewertt wrote:Because it is not an option

Explain why it is not an option.

If you attend any of these schools, the most likely scenario is that you will end up with massive debt and will not get a job as a lawyer.

With your numbers, you will not receive any significant scholarship $ and will be 200k+ in debt. What kind of job are you going to get to pay that out? You will be lucky to snag a 50K/year law job from any of those--seriously, that would be a GREAT outcome from one of these schools. And your odds at landing one of those are not even very good.

Everyone here is trying to help you out, honestly.

I am overloading for the rest of the year, working, and am not banking on a significant jump in my score. I won't be able to take in dec or February and will not be taking a gap year. Ok I got that I won't be getting scholarship money, and will have a VERY tough time getting a job. Moving forward - any more feedback?

What more feedback do you need?

Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

Hewertt wrote:

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

You're fun, and if this is the way you approach $270k debt, you deserve it.

Hewertt wrote:

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

The only relevant difference is whether you would rather be saddled with insurmountable debt and horrendous job prospects in northern or southern California. So the world is your oyster!

Hewertt wrote:

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

I mean, those are pretty important things about those schools that applicants should know.

Mal Reynolds wrote:

Hewertt wrote:

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

The only relevant difference is whether you would rather be saddled with insurmountable debt and horrendous job prospects in northern or southern California. So the world is your oyster!

Seriously OP, why come asking for advice if you don't want to hear it? These schools are all terrible. You know what's worse than having to come up with a plan for the year? Graduating with massive debt from a piece of shit school. Not retaking or altogether reconsidering your aspirations because you don't want to take a gap year (are you k-jd?) is like refusing to have the bandaid ripped off now at the cost of getting your limbs amputated three years later. Don't be an idiot, retake until you have a score where you can, say, get decent money from Davis.

Hewertt wrote:

AReasonableMan wrote:Nobody cares about your extracurriculars. President of prelate club sounds like the least fun college kid ever. Zero chance a school thinks he's 156 but pre law president or a firm thinks he goes to a TTT but he was prelate president!! The website prestige!

Thanks for the valuable input. How many times have you saved the world? Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

You're all are pretty well versed. Retake, you're an idiot, no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

I know about these schools, the area that the other three are in, and the statistics. Your focus on your useless extracurriculars showcases how you are approaching this wrong. There are extremes on both ends (gold medal winner, or sits with arms folded and no eye contact), but for the most part you are a statistic. The schools you are going to are statistics.

There's a presumption that people who don't get a good job have something wrong with them, but that's not the case. There's little correlation between the two. I am not one of these people in a similarly stressful position so have no personal bias in the matter. The way the system works you either get an elite job or you get a tough shake. There's no middle ground. At these schools, it's mostly only lower ground.

UCLA and USC are risky propositions nowadays...the law schools you listed shouldn't even exist

retake

Does anyone have any valuable input on weighing the trade offs between these schools?

Do not attend these schools. Period.

For CA schools, no option below UCI/UC Davis WITH near a full ride should ever be considered. And that's probably generous for this board.

There's a thread in the legal employment section about a kid in the top quarter who struck out. I don't know them but would be willing to bet you wouldn't think they were especially weird if you met them. Even if you graded onto law review from these four skills, it's still more likely than not you would struggle to pay back the two-hundred grand in debt you're taking on.

Hewertt wrote:Do you know anything about these schools other than that they cost a lot and that employment prospects are difficult?

Yes, we know that these schools hire a bunch of HYS JDs to teach contracts, torts, civ pro, crim, and other basic courses using the case method of instruction. Just like every other ABA-accredited law school in this country.

When you ignore all the factors that truly distinguish law schools, that's what you're left with.

Hewertt wrote:no job, all debt, but no one knows anything about the advantages of choosing one over the other?

The advantages of choosing one law school over another are all about jobs and debt. What else are you hoping to hear about? Parking availability? Number of students per Chipotle?

OP, I suspect you've thrown your hands up and written off TLS, but in case you're still reading, retake is never "not an option." Or, rather, "don't go to law school" is always an option. If you truly can't or won't improve your LSAT substantially, then you just shouldn't go to law school. I would have thought someone in a pre-law club would have understood the importance of the LSAT. "I'm taking a lot of classes my senior year" is certainly not a reason. Wait a few years to go. Get some work experience.