Top Law Schools

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:21 pm**

kimkardashian wrote:Hey everyone! I'm choosing between Michigan Law and Duke. I got off their waitlists recently and committed to Michigan before knowing I got into Duke.

- Michigan gave me $15k a year and I don't know if Duke gave me anything (I'll be calling to ask tomorrow). Either way, cost is not a factor to me because my family is paying for tuition.

- I'd like to work in NYC but flexibility is also important to me because I have a SO in a military academy and we plan to get married. Hopefully he gets stationed somewhere near NYC but who knows what will happen?

- Don't have any significant ties to either place but Duke is a bit closer to home, which is good (I live in NJ).

- Don't know what area of law I'll go into yet.

- Already committed to Michigan and would lose apartment deposit, but haven't paid tuition deposit yet. I already lost tuition deposit and apartment deposit at another school too.

Thank you for your opinions.

These schools are basically a wash as far as NY employment chances go, and both have roughly comparable national placement - though Duke has had the slight edge for several years now. Since money is no object, go to whichever school you like better / whichever place you'd rather live for three years.

I have a strong preference for Michigan's culture, based on what I learned of each back in applications, and I'd personally rather live in Ann Arbor than Durham (though not by much). This is totally up to your personal tastes.

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:22 pm**

jk148706 wrote:
kimkardashian wrote:Hey everyone! I'm choosing between Michigan Law and Duke. I got off their waitlists recently and committed to Michigan before knowing I got into Duke.

- Michigan gave me $15k a year and I don't know if Duke gave me anything (I'll be calling to ask tomorrow). Either way, cost is not a factor to me because my family is paying for tuition.

- I'd like to work in NYC but flexibility is also important to me because I have a SO in a military academy and we plan to get married. Hopefully he gets stationed somewhere near NYC but who knows what will happen?

- Don't have any significant ties to either place but Duke is a bit closer to home, which is good (I live in NJ).

- Don't know what area of law I'll go into yet.

- Already committed to Michigan and would lose apartment deposit, but haven't paid tuition deposit yet. I already lost tuition deposit and apartment deposit at another school too.

Thank you for your opinions.
Numbers?

COA?

Which part of "cost is not a factor" and "my family is paying tuition" failed to communicate "really fucking rich parents" to you?

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:25 pm**

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:31 pm**

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:36 pm**

kimkardashian wrote:
ymmv wrote:
kimkardashian wrote:Hey everyone! I'm choosing between Michigan Law and Duke. I got off their waitlists recently and committed to Michigan before knowing I got into Duke.

- Michigan gave me $15k a year and I don't know if Duke gave me anything (I'll be calling to ask tomorrow). Either way, cost is not a factor to me because my family is paying for tuition.

- I'd like to work in NYC but flexibility is also important to me because I have a SO in a military academy and we plan to get married. Hopefully he gets stationed somewhere near NYC but who knows what will happen?

- Don't have any significant ties to either place but Duke is a bit closer to home, which is good (I live in NJ).

- Don't know what area of law I'll go into yet.

- Already committed to Michigan and would lose apartment deposit, but haven't paid tuition deposit yet. I already lost tuition deposit and apartment deposit at another school too.

Thank you for your opinions.
These schools are basically a wash as far as NY employment chances go, and both have roughly comparable national placement - though Duke has had the slight edge for several years now. Since money is no object, go to whichever school you like better / whichever place you'd rather live for three years.

I have a strong preference for Michigan's culture, based on what I learned of each back in applications, and I'd personally rather live in Ann Arbor than Durham (though not by much). This is totally up to your personal tastes.

Right, I also felt like Ann Arbor would be a nicer place to live but I've never visited either school so I don't actually know what place I'd like better. Unfortunately I don't have time to visit before my deposits are due.

Also, I don't like sports or "fratty" types. I'll go to like one or two games a year if everyone else is going but I definitely am not a sports person. I realize that sports are big in both schools but for some reason I feel like Michigan is somewhat less sporty and less douchey (maybe?).

Michigan definitely gave me a less fratty, douchey vibe than Duke did. I'm sure people at both places like sports though.
Ann Arbor is a wonderful little town except for the winters, which are admittedly a large percentage of the year there.

Oh, and Michigan has maybe the most beautiful law campus this side of Oxbridge, if the decision is really that close for you.

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:40 pm**

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:42 pm**

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:50 pm**

kimkardashian wrote:I mean, all these things (weather, beauty of campus, location) don't matter to me that much. I guess my major question is: which school usually ranks better? They're both 10 now but does one school historically do better than the other? And place better?

I already answered this. Both are decent national schools without a regional market to call their own; both can get you into NY biglaw with a lot of hustle and a lot of luck.
"Rank" is utterly meaningless outside of employment prospects, and employment prospects from either are very similar. Michigan had better placement for a while, but Duke has been their equal and occasional superior (again, by a narrow margin) since the Recession.

Posted: **Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:58 pm**

Same cost to you b/c rich parents, same level of placement power in NYC ... go wherever you like. If my costs were exactly equal ($0) and I was closer to Duke, I'd probably go there. You're bidding NYC anyway.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 6:29 am**

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 6:54 am**

Duke. I'm not trusting Michigan these days. Without Detroit as a market, Michigan is losing its sheen.

Law is the wrong profession if you think you will need to move a lot. You won't be licensed in each state.

Actually, just deposit at both and then visit. You can't make a decision like this without seeing the schools.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:09 am**

Not for nothing, but how on earth could your SO be stationed near NYC? Army has fort drum (not close to NYC) and navy has New London (not really near NYC and first year+ will be nowhere near NYC cause it's a sub base). I realize you're looking to be somewhat close to your SO, but just wondering what exactly that means to you.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:16 am**

NYSprague wrote:Duke. I'm not trusting Michigan these days. Without Detroit as a market, Michigan is losing its sheen.

Law is the wrong profession if you think you will need to move a lot. You won't be licensed in each state.

Actually, just deposit at both and then visit. You can't make a decision like this without seeing the schools.

Detroit hasn't been a real market in decades. Michigan's jobs numbers are going to improve a bunch over the next three years. This year's 1Ls got a grade bump and a 25 percent reduction in class size from the current graduating class. There's going to be many more jobs to go around and less competition than there has been in the past.

Job numbers are essentially the same. Michigan is cheaper to begin with and even more so with the scholarship. No reason to waste your money going to a school that is generally considered less prestigious and more douchey.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:31 am**

CTT wrote:
NYSprague wrote:Duke. I'm not trusting Michigan these days. Without Detroit as a market, Michigan is losing its sheen.

Law is the wrong profession if you think you will need to move a lot. You won't be licensed in each state.

Actually, just deposit at both and then visit. You can't make a decision like this without seeing the schools.
Detroit hasn't been a real market in decades. Michigan's jobs numbers are going to improve a bunch over the next three years. This year's 1Ls got a grade bump and a 25 percent reduction in class size from the current graduating class. There's going to be many more jobs to go around and less competition than there has been in the past.

Job numbers are essentially the same. Michigan is cheaper to begin with and even more so with the scholarship. No reason to waste your money going to a school that is generally considered less prestigious and more douchey.

No one in the real world thinks Michigan is more prestigious than Duke. Duke has better placement. I would go there and not hope for improvement from michigan, if it was me and money was no object.

Edit: I think Michigan used to be much higher ranked and better placement than it is now. Plus, I think Dean Z is a twit. How many school funded jobs does Michigan have this year?

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:49 am**

NYSprague wrote:How many school funded jobs does Michigan have this year?

3.5% compared to Duke's 4.6%

http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/michigan/duke/

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:00 am**

I remember visiting Duke for undergrad with my dad...granted this was 7 years ago. We both had the same impression that Duke's campus was magnificent, but even just 5 minutes outside the campus was disgusting. This would explain why Duke could be frattier, as ppl. have no incentive to leave the campus w/o Kevlar vests. See how you would like living in both Ann Arbor and Durham.

But if you can parlay Michigan into a new car...that would be sweet!

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:17 am**

jk148706 wrote:
NYSprague wrote:How many school funded jobs does Michigan have this year?
3.5% compared to Duke's 4.6%

http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/michigan/duke/

I must be reading that chart wrong. I like to look at actual numbers and not percent. Duke has a slightly higher percent but a smaller actual number .
I do see that Duke has a higher employed percentage and a smaller class.
I would go to Duke between these two, if money didn't matter.

But OP should visit the schools and deposit at both.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:27 am**

I live 10 minutes from Durham. Love the city but summers here are 95°F and 85% humidity. I'd take long Michigan winters any day.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:54 am**

tskela wrote:I live 10 minutes from Durham. Love the city but summers here are 95°F and 85% humidity. I'd take long Michigan winters any day.

Yet another illustration of the extent to which this decision is solely a matter of personal taste and preference.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:30 am**

jk148706 wrote:
NYSprague wrote:How many school funded jobs does Michigan have this year?
3.5% compared to Duke's 4.6%

http://www.lstscorereports.com/compare/michigan/duke/

Just lol at this dude. Good work, jk.

Srsly, their NYC placement power is roughly the same. Mich attracts a lot of ppl targeting secondary markets and pi, but if you're exclusively bidding NYC you can't seriously argue that these schools aren't peers.

Just pick whichever you like. If Duke is more geographically convenient and it's free, then go there. This twittering over peer schools is useless.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:12 pm**

I went to Mich UG and am starting at Duke for law school. Ann Arbor is a great college town but winters are extremely long (snow in April) and extremely cold (i.e. hit -30 deg last year). The weather is by far the worst part, but I'm choosing sunny NC after 4 yrs there

.

Duke is better overall for fed clerks and biglaw but the difference isn't significant (http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog ... chool.html). Oh, and Duke doesn't tell you your scholly info until after you complete their financial aid form (for merit too). I'd vote Duke, but it def comes down to subjective factors and whether you prefer the midwest or east coast.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:26 pm**

I would be shocked if Dean Hoye did not at least match Michigan's aid offer.

Posted: **Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:34 pm**

jbagelboy wrote:I would be shocked if Dean Hoye did not at least match Michigan's aid offer.

Seconding this. Duke increased my aid offer twice during the admissions process last year, both times fairly substantially. It's worth a shot!

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